beautox Posted October 7, 2020 Share Posted October 7, 2020 Thats 115M guaranteed not taking into account his vesting option, 65M now since 50M is deferred, not even taking into account his full NTC. I'd welcome the purposed deal but I'm skeptical it happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted October 7, 2020 Share Posted October 7, 2020 1 hour ago, striker said: You try filling out the roster first via free agency, then you fall back on trades. The only way you do trades first is if you get a can't miss long term piece. Why trade all those pieces to Boston when you can just sign JBJ and Q for the same net WAR but you keep your prospects. because JBJ sucks 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eminor3rd Posted October 7, 2020 Share Posted October 7, 2020 On 10/6/2020 at 3:35 PM, ChiSox59 said: Cease for Benintendi would be terrible. I am rooting for Cease+++ for Nimmo and Diaz. My +++ would be Collins, Flores and L. Gonzalez. But you can insert whatever backend 40 man guys you want. But I think that's a pretty fair trade. My criticism applies equally to your proposal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YourWhatHurts Posted October 7, 2020 Share Posted October 7, 2020 Something that really cannot be argued is that the Sox, currently, are almost certainly either at the peak of their prospect depth / farm system quality right now, or will be between now and next year's offseason, likely depending on what we do in terms of trading between now and then. We will be: 1) picking lower, in the draft; 2) have less draft pool money; 3) have less INTL money; 4) will pick lower on the waiver wire; 5) pick lower in the Rule-5 order; 6) will be keeping 40-man roster spots open for AAAA/fringe MLBers and "win-now" veterans / bench and pen pieces instead of using them for prospects, so there is less room on the 40-man; 7) we will generally be attempting to trade prospects for vets instead of trading vets for prospects ... ...for probably the next 5+ seasons consecutively. We ***really*** need to manage our assets best, right now. If we don't, we will probably fuck up both our win-now window and fuck up our ability to transition from the coming win-now period to a Cardinals-like spot-patch contention period after (where we can make adjustments year to year but still play competitive baseball for several years after our extended young guys' contracts end). That transition is important because if we don't manage our assets well now then we will probably be looking at a need to fully rebuild when our Moncada/Robert/Eloy/etc. group gets to the end of their deals, ala the Cubs current situation. Right now, as I count it, we have Kopech, Crochet, Kelly, and Stiever all IMO as blue chipper SP prospects, regardless of where they are nationally ranked, and Dunning, Thompson, Dalquist, Lambert, and Vera as as very good SP prospects also who very likely have an MLB future and aren't just the kind of fringe guys that we're used to. Vaughn is an elite hitting prospect and the best 1B prospect in baseball, and one of if not the best pure hitting prospect in baseball. Then there is still maybe some life in other areas, like perhaps Collins, Rutherford, Burger, etc. We still have a good system that may actually be a bit underrated ATM. Let's not just piss it away. In all likelihood if we manage it very well it will gradually diminish to a bottom third system over the next 2 or 3 years, and after that, it will really be a struggle to keep it on the high side of the bottom third instead of the middle or lower portion of the bottom third. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YourWhatHurts Posted October 7, 2020 Share Posted October 7, 2020 3 hours ago, bmags said: because JBJ sucks Check out his numbers this year though. I'm not saying he'll continue to be that guy but he definitely didn't suck this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flash Posted October 7, 2020 Share Posted October 7, 2020 Trade proposal...who says no? Cease, Stiever and Fry for Darvish and Ed Howard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YourWhatHurts Posted October 7, 2020 Share Posted October 7, 2020 I'd just be interested in knowing 1) whether the Sox ownership would be willing to add a contract like Sale's regardless of the cost, and 2) if so, what would it cost us just to take it on and nothing else? They can have Reynaldo and Collins for that, and some filler. If Sale returns to form that deal is legal armed robbery with a pistol whipping that the judge sees and just winks and smiles at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted October 7, 2020 Share Posted October 7, 2020 7 minutes ago, YourWhatHurts said: Something that really cannot be argued is that the Sox, currently, are almost certainly either at the peak of their prospect depth / farm system quality right now, or will be between now and next year's offseason, likely depending on what we do in terms of trading between now and then. We will be: 1) picking lower, in the draft; 2) have less draft pool money; 3) have less INTL money; 4) will pick lower on the waiver wire; 5) pick lower in the Rule-5 order; 6) will be keeping 40-man roster spots open for AAAA/fringe MLBers and "win-now" veterans / bench and pen pieces instead of using them for prospects, so there is less room on the 40-man; 7) we will generally be attempting to trade prospects for vets instead of trading vets for prospects ... ...for probably the next 5+ seasons consecutively. We ***really*** need to manage our assets best, right now. If we don't, we will probably fuck up both our win-now window and fuck up our ability to transition from the coming win-now period to a Cardinals-like spot-patch contention period after (where we can make adjustments year to year but still play competitive baseball for several years after our extended young guys' contracts end). That transition is important because if we don't manage our assets well now then we will probably be looking at a need to fully rebuild when our Moncada/Robert/Eloy/etc. group gets to the end of their deals, ala the Cubs current situation. Right now, as I count it, we have Kopech, Crochet, Kelly, and Stiever all IMO as blue chipper SP prospects, regardless of where they are nationally ranked, and Dunning, Thompson, Dalquist, Lambert, and Vera as as very good SP prospects also who very likely have an MLB future and aren't just the kind of fringe guys that we're used to. Vaughn is an elite hitting prospect and the best 1B prospect in baseball, and one of if not the best pure hitting prospect in baseball. Then there is still maybe some life in other areas, like perhaps Collins, Rutherford, Burger, etc. We still have a good system that may actually be a bit underrated ATM. Let's not just piss it away. In all likelihood if we manage it very well it will gradually diminish to a bottom third system over the next 2 or 3 years, and after that, it will really be a struggle to keep it on the high side of the bottom third instead of the middle or lower portion of the bottom third. Isn't international money a measure of what size market team you are? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted October 7, 2020 Share Posted October 7, 2020 2 minutes ago, Flash said: Trade proposal...who says no? Cease, Stiever and Fry for Darvish and Ed Howard The Cubs laugh us out of the building. That deal is light without Howard in it. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YourWhatHurts Posted October 7, 2020 Share Posted October 7, 2020 Just now, Flash said: Trade proposal...who says no? Cease, Stiever and Fry for Darvish and Ed Howard Not sure but it would be an emotional conversation for all involved IMO. Everyone in it besides Fry I can see multiple execs on both sides loving and pushing for. Ballsy and dangerous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YourWhatHurts Posted October 7, 2020 Share Posted October 7, 2020 3 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: Isn't international money a measure of what size market team you are? I don't think so. The Sox have had high pools and I believe it is because they have sucked in the standings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted October 7, 2020 Share Posted October 7, 2020 12 minutes ago, Flash said: Trade proposal...who says no? Cease, Stiever and Fry for Darvish and Ed Howard Probably the Cubs, but why would we trade major league assets for a HS shortstop? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sleepy Harold Posted October 8, 2020 Share Posted October 8, 2020 1 hour ago, YourWhatHurts said: I don't think so. The Sox have had high pools and I believe it is because they have sucked in the standings. It used to be determined based on standings, whereas it now seems it's determined by market size, at least that's what I gathered from this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted October 8, 2020 Share Posted October 8, 2020 54 minutes ago, Sleepy Harold said: It used to be determined based on standings, whereas it now seems it's determined by market size, at least that's what I gathered from this. Yea it is this. If only jerry threw his weight around on this stuff. So infuriating the leg up the cardinals, for example, get in the CBA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A-Train to 35th Posted October 8, 2020 Share Posted October 8, 2020 On 10/1/2020 at 8:47 PM, HahnsKiddieTable said: Yep. This team needs to land it’s big fish one way or another this offseason. Enough of 2nd place bids, whether that’s via trade or free agency. Now is the time to strike. Not a fan of management but they did put in a bigger bid for Zach Wheeler this year and a competitive bid overall for the Machado fiasco last year. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BamaDoc Posted October 8, 2020 Share Posted October 8, 2020 (edited) On 10/6/2020 at 6:57 PM, soxfan49 said: Dunning for Blackmon? The Sox shouldn't think twice about that, imo. Are you saying you would want Blackmon for Dunning? Blackmon 34 years old and owed over fifty million over next three? Coors field/ bad away splits Blackmon? Couple years ago, I could see. Edited October 8, 2020 by BamaDoc Misspelled/autocorrect Coors Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox1917 Posted October 8, 2020 Share Posted October 8, 2020 (edited) 3 hours ago, BamaDoc said: Are you saying you would want Blackmon for Dunning? Blackmon 34 years old and owed over fifty million over next three? Coors field/ bad away splits Blackmon? Couple years ago, I could see. The only rockies players we should be inquiring about are marquez and freeland Edited October 8, 2020 by ChiSox1917 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dominikk85 Posted October 8, 2020 Share Posted October 8, 2020 13 hours ago, striker said: You try filling out the roster first via free agency, then you fall back on trades. The only way you do trades first is if you get a can't miss long term piece. Why trade all those pieces to Boston when you can just sign JBJ and Q for the same net WAR but you keep your prospects. I don't know, many of the successful rebuilding teams of the last few years did trade a ton. The rays and As do tons of trades. The cubs, red Sox and Yankees too. You just need to trade the right guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
striker Posted October 8, 2020 Share Posted October 8, 2020 Give me JBJ ($8m), LeMahieu ($18m/3) and Gausman ($16m/3) and call it day. That gives us a great bat, a good LH bat, 180 innings and outfield/infield depth. This gets us to the trade deadline where we can plug any additional holes. SS Anderson 3B/DH/2B LeMahieu CA/1B/DH Grandal 1B/DH Abreu LF/DH Jimenez 3B/DH Moncada CF Robert RF/LF/CF JBJ 2B Madrigal SP Giolito SP Keuchel SP Gausman SP Dunning SP Cease/Kopech Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirmin' for Yermin Posted October 8, 2020 Share Posted October 8, 2020 14 hours ago, Flash said: Trade proposal...who says no? Cease, Stiever and Fry for Darvish and Ed Howard The best two players in that deal are Cubs players.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted October 8, 2020 Share Posted October 8, 2020 So definitely seems like Bauer is angling to get PAID, I doubt his 1-year schtick survives guaranteed bucks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted October 8, 2020 Share Posted October 8, 2020 (edited) 7 minutes ago, bmags said: So definitely seems like Bauer is angling to get PAID, I doubt his 1-year schtick survives guaranteed bucks. Exactly. Never bought into it really. There was some article I read somewhere yesterday about how the Sox and Trevor Bauer make sense for each other on a one year deal. I was like no...it really doesn't make sense from his standpoint at all. Edited October 8, 2020 by soxfan2014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted October 8, 2020 Share Posted October 8, 2020 20 minutes ago, bmags said: So definitely seems like Bauer is angling to get PAID, I doubt his 1-year schtick survives guaranteed bucks. If ever there was a year to sign a one year deal, this is it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rey21 Posted October 8, 2020 Share Posted October 8, 2020 Cease+Adolfo+Stiever for Michael Conforto OR Cease+James Beard for Brandon Nimmo Sign Stroman + Keone Kela Sign Tommy La Stella Re-Sign Colome If Jerry is all in and open then go sign Michael Brantley too Decline Mazara’s option C - Grandal/Collins/Mercedes 1B - Abreu/Vaughn 2B - Madrigal/La Stella SS - TA/Mendick 3B - Moncada LF - Eloy/Brantley CF - Robert/Engel RF - Conforto/Nimmo DH - Brantley/Vaughn SP Giolito/Stroman/Kuechel/Dunning/Kopech 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox59 Posted October 8, 2020 Share Posted October 8, 2020 18 hours ago, Eminor3rd said: My criticism applies equally to your proposal. Short of acquiring two leigitmate SP this offseason, I agree, the sox can't afford to trade from their SP depth. But if they can go a sign a mid to TOR starter (Stroman more likely than Bauer) and another solid backend piece like Quintana, trading Cease for a legit RF that solves a lot of problems and a closer makes plenty of sense IMO (per my proposal). Big ifs, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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