Sox should replace Renteria with Ozzie Guillen

[VAfan]

I'm sure Ozzie's name has come up in multiple "fire Ricky" posts, but I don't see a post dedicated to a debate about hiring Ozzie to replace him, so I'm starting one. 

My case for firing Renteria is as follows.

1. Renteria has to go because down the stretch in the series in Cleveland and in the playoff series against Oakland, he had no concept of how to manage in a tight game. As long as his guys were hitting homers and taking leads and he had good starting pitching and a deep bullpen, he could manage. But if things went off track and he needed to manufacture a run or two, or sort out his bullpen usage in a tight game, he failed miserably.  If he can't win these kinds of games, he can't ever get the Sox to the World Series, because playoff series will inevitably be tight. 

My case for Ozzie is as follows.

1. Ozzie did exceedingly well managing the White Sox pitching during 2005. Granted, it was a staff with 4 stud starting pitchers who each threw more than 200 innings that year. In the ALCS, those 4 - Contreras, Buehrle, Garcia, and Garland threw 4 complete games in a row, which will never be done again, playoffs or regular season. But that doesn't mean Ozzie couldn't manage a bullpen. The Sox used 3 different primary closers in 2005, so Ozzie was able to adapt to what he had.

2. The 2005 Sox were tremendous in 1-run games. 

Quote

The Sox were 35-19 in one-run games. That will usually help a team exceed its Pythagorean projection. But at the halfway point, their record in one-run games was 22-8 (even better than their overall first-half record of 55-26).

They also swept the Astros in the World Series, while only outscoring them by 6 total runs. They won three 1-0 games of note in that 2005 season - first game of year, first game after the All-Star break and last game of the World Series. 

This requires good managing. 

3. The 2005 Sox knew how to bash home runs. But they also knew how to manufacture runs. Just think of a couple of runs that won postseason games.

In the second game against the Angels in the ALCS, in the bottom of the 9th, after AJ Pierzynski reached first on a controversial dropped third strike, Ozzie pinch ran Pablo Ozuna for AJ, who stole second, and scored the walk-off win on a Joe Crede double to left field. 

In the WS clinching win against the Astros, Willie Harris hit a single, stole second, and scored on Jermaine Dye's single up the middle. It was the only run of the game. 

This also shows how Ozzie was able to use the "smurfs" - Harris, Ozuna, and Geoff Blum - in ways that helped the Sox to 3 postseason wins. In addition to Ozuna and Harris above, Geoff Blum hit the game winning HR in extra innings in game 3 of the World Series. 

Again, Ozzie knew what he was doing.  

4. The 2005 White Sox were an excellent defensive team, so Ozzie knows the value of defense in winning games. That offseason, the Sox traded offense for defense, and it paid off. This White Sox team has been excellent defensively with Anderson making great strides at SS, and with Luis Robert in CF. 

5. Ozzie is the only Sox manager alive today who has won a playoff series with the Sox. He was 11-1 in 2005, which is still the best postseason record in baseball. under that 3-round format. 

6. Yes, Ozzie quit on the team at the end of his tenure and should have been fired. He was angling to manage Miami, which turned into a disaster. After 10 years, I don't hold this against Ozzie, and the Sox shouldn't either. Ozzie is back in the Sox fold as an announcer and would not mess up like this again. 

7. If Renteria is replaced, the Sox need an Hispanic manager given how central the Cuban players are to the success of the team. 

8. Ozzie is a loudmouth manager, who says a lot of crazy things. But there is a method to his madness. He always takes the pressure onto himself, and off of his players. He has their backs. 

I'm sure some will question whether Ozzie is fully up to speed on the new analytics which didn't exist when Ozzie was managing. But I think he would be based on the fact that he knew how to manage pitching, had a team that could bash HRs and play for a run, and excelled in 1-run games. 

Lastly, I will confess I don't live in Chicago, so I don't know much about what Ozzie has been doing lately outside of providing TV commentary. But whatever that may be, I think Ozzie would be laser focused should he get another shot at managing the Sox. It's not likely a marriage that will last 10 years. But there's no reason it can't last for the next 5, which is the Sox window to compete for World Series titles. 

My vote: Fire Ricky. Hire Ozzie. 

 

Edited October 3, 2020 by VAfan

[southsider2k5]

Hell no. Ozzie quit on this franchise.  He is the absolute last person who should be around these kids.

[soxfaninfl]

I would be fine with it and actually think these players may respond to Ozzie. 2011 was a crazy year and while Ozzie did quit with two games remaining, I think it is unfair to blame him solely for the whole fiasco. Time for everyone to move on and win another championship, I say, but I am also open to other ideas.

 

[ron883]

1000%. Oz needs to be managing this team next year, without question. 

[Jack Parkman]

22 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

Hell no. Ozzie quit on this franchise.  He is the absolute last person who should be around these kids.

+1

[ShoeLessRob]

No and 0% chance. He’s fine doing the post game. He quit on the team near the end, was a terrible manager in Miami, and the last thing we need is people digging up all the old things he said/will say. 

[Dominikk85]

The game has passend by him. Today you don't want flamboyant managers but guys who keep the players happy and do what the analytics people tell them. Even if people don't believe it ricky likely mostly does what the front office wants

[Buehrle>Wood]

Nobody cares that he quit in 2011

[Vote4Pedro]

Never going to happen.

[NWINFan]

I don't understand the fascination with Guillen. It is really time to cut ties with the past. 2005 was a long time ago.

If the FO wants to make a change, I'd prefer they get someone outside the organization. At the very least interview a handful of candidates and come up with a choice. But just handing the job to Guillen doesn't make sense. This has to be an intelligent decision, not something based on emotion.

Guillen does know a great deal about the game. I just don't want him managing the White Sox. Not now. Not ever.

[Sleepy Harold]

Counterpoint: No. 

[ron883]

Billy Martin was a successful manager that got hired then fired multiple times. Give Ozzie another chance

[soxfaninfl]

I do wonder how TA would respond to Ozzie as manager. Just a side thought....

[Jack Parkman]

 

Edited October 3, 2020 by Jack Parkman

[pcq]

Sandy Alomar. People forget that Kenny dislikes Ozzie. That is kind of important. 

[Jack Parkman]

3 minutes ago, pcq said:

Sandy Alomar. People forget that Kenny dislikes Ozzie. That is kind of important. 

Also fits the category of "former White Sox player" And unlike AJ Hinch or Alex Cora, he won't piss off Bauer. 

Edited October 3, 2020 by Jack Parkman

[Eminor3rd]

No

[Eminor3rd]

4 minutes ago, pcq said:

Sandy Alomar. People forget that Kenny dislikes Ozzie. That is kind of important. 

After seeing how Sandy Alomar managed their elimination game the other night, I am way off the Alomar train.

[soxfan49]

34 minutes ago, soxfaninfl said:

I do wonder how TA would respond to Ozzie as manager. Just a side thought....

Keep wondering since it'll never happen

[Tnetennba]

Ozzie Guillen hasn't managed in the bigs in 8 years.  If he were a commodity at all he wouldn't be doing post-game shows.  

Ozzie Guillen was a terrible manager from about 2009 on.  Whatever magical touch he had with this team was long gone before he left.

Ozzie Guillen QUIT on the Chicago White Sox.  He negotiated a deal with Miami  while still employed.  That bridge is burned.  

Rick Renteria being terrible is no justification to bring back a bad manager who hasn't worked in nearly a decade.  Thanks for 2005 and a fun run, but replacing one catastrophe with another is not the change this young squad needs.  

Ozzie Guillen will never manage the White Sox ever again.  Fin.  

[soxfaninfl]

51 minutes ago, soxfan49 said:

Keep wondering since it'll never happen

It was just an amusing thought, not to be taken seriously. I am just not sure how I feel about Ozzie, honestly. He has a lot of baggage.

[jamesdiego]

Yes, you are absolutely right that Ricky is 100% not the guy to lead this team to the promised land.  
 

And yes, Ozzie was brilliant in 2005, best season for a manager had in Sox history.  He made all the right moves that season and if a clown like Renteria was the manager then I firmly believe we don’t win the Series, let alone make it there.  
 

But Ozzie also had the worst manager season in Sox history in his final season.  He not only quit he flew off the handle stirring bullshit pure drama because Kenny asked Oney, an employee of the Sox, not to talk shit on his employer on Twitter.   His ego got out of control and thought he was the most important piece of the organization.   
 

There is a reason why no team given him a chance for over a decade, why would they trust a guy who backstabbed a team in the middle of a season?  
 

Ozzie is in his proper place on the post game.  It would be entertaining to see him manage a baseball, but let someone else experiment with that.  

[Orlando]

 

[Orlando]

If you go through Steve’s responses on Twitter, it seems like he is replying to everyone that is bringing up Cora and Hinch. Not squashing the idea at all.

[ron883]