Tony La Russa named Manager

[gusguyman]

2 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

What the fuck does his production as a left fielder have to do with how hard he works? You haven't made a reasonable point or statement since you started posting here but i know youre trying your hardest. 

You seem to be confusing effort and skill. Must be hard.

Makes sense since his trolling is high effort but low skill

[ChiSox1917]

5 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

What the fuck does his production as a left fielder have to do with how hard he works? You haven't made a reasonable point or statement since you started posting here but i know youre trying your hardest. 

You seem to be confusing effort and skill. Must be hard.

Is this a serious post?  What does production have to do with how hard he works?  Seriously?  Re-read that question.

Go look at Schwarber with the Cubs.  You think his defensive improvement was due to his "skill" and not his effort in improving? What about Arenado at 3B? The guy was projected to be borderline to stay at 3B as a prospect. His WORK, not his skill, led to him becoming the best defensive third baseman in the league.

On what planet do you live where you think a player's production doesn't have to do with how hard he works?

This is easily the dumbest thing I've read on here.  But what else can be expected from someone who doesn't even watch baseball games?

Edited October 31, 2020 by ChiSox1917

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

2 minutes ago, gusguyman said:

Makes sense since his trolling is high effort but low skill

Exactly! You'd think of all people who would understand, it would be him. Projection can be a pain for all of us!

[Thad Bosley]

3 minutes ago, ChiSox1917 said:

Haven't said anything about being a "disciplinarian". TLR's teams do not play sloppy. His Oakland teams didn't. His Cardinals teams didn't. 

Did you watch the games this year? I watched every single one. This team was not crisp. It was incredibly talented though, which overcame a lot of it. And part of the problem was that Rickey wasn't correcting it. TLR holds his players accountable, and makes them better by doing it. 

You were the one that brought up work ethic, and I gave a response to it. It's one thing to go out and practice a lot. It's another to practice the right way and improve. Eloy is the worst defensive outfielder I have ever seen. I have not seen any improvement in that aspect of his game. Moncada specifically has had questions about his work ethic since coming up in the minors. Yes he improved from 2018 - 2019, but is that his peak? Given his skill set, I hope not. 

What am I supposed to learn from that video? Wake me up when Eloy isn't a complete liability in left field. 

Is Eloy’s defense a result of lack of effort and/or lack of hard work to improve, or just that he doesn’t have the god-given talent to be a better defensive player?  The video that was shared with you shares explains Jimenez’ continuous improvement efforts.  Do you doubt his level of effort, and if so, why, and based on what?  
 

As for Moncada, can you provide a source to where his work ethic has been questioned even once since he came to the White Sox?  There is story after story about how he looks up to Abreu and tries to model his approach for readiness after his.  And why are you even questioning whether he at still the young age he is has peaked?  Do you think he has, and why?  Because he doesn’t work hard enough?  

And what, precisely (and I already know the answer to this) is fueling your questioning of the work ethic of this particular roster, such that you think the personal profile of the incoming manager is what they really need?  “Loafing” and “sloppy”.  Interesting choice of words.  

[TitoMB345]

At this point, I'm over it. Let's just hope it works out! World Series or bust!

[pcq]

One of the things going on this year was Jose newly inspired and leading the way. I thought it was a fine effort. Rizzo was shaking his head at Wrigley over Jose's production. 

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

6 minutes ago, ChiSox1917 said:

Is this a serious post?  What does production have to do with how hard he works?  Seriously.  Re-read that question.

Go look at Schwarber with the Cubs.  You think his defensive improvement was due to his "skill" and not his effort in improving? What about Arenado at 3B? The guy was projected to be borderline to stay at 3B as a prospect. His WORK, not his skill, led to him becoming the best defensive third baseman in the league.

On what planet do you live where you think a player's production doesn't have to do with how hard he works?

who the hell projected Nolan arenado to be a bad defender?

Arenado was a high school SS prospect who people weren't sure whether he'd stay at short, move to third or catcher as an 18 year old kid. Like most growing high school drafteez his position wasn't certain. 

He was ALWAYS an elite defensive athlete and from about day 2 at third base in the minors he was a star with the glove despite never playing there. 

Arenados problem was he had never played the position until pro ball. Eloy has played outgield his entire life. I just dont think you realize how ignorant you sound calling into question the work ethic of a + to ++ MLB hitter who is at the absolute peak of his career. 

Edited October 31, 2020 by Look at Ray Ray Run

[ChiSox1917]

Just now, Thad Bosley said:

Is Eloy’s defense a result of lack of effort and/or lack of hard work to improve, or just that he doesn’t have the god-given talent to be a better defensive player?  The video that was shared with you shares explains Jimenez’ continuous improvement efforts.  Do you doubt his level of effort, and if so, why, and based on what?  
 

As for Moncada, can you provide a source to where his work ethic has been questioned even once since he came to the White Sox?  There is story after story about how he looks up to Abreu and tries to model his approach for readiness after his.  And why are you even questioning whether he at still the young age he is has peaked?  Do you think he has, and why?  Because he doesn’t work hard enough?  

And what, precisely (and I already know the answer to this) is fueling your questioning of the work ethic of this particular roster, such that you think the personal profile of the incoming manager is what they really need?  “Loafing” and “sloppy”.  Interesting choice of words.  

Again, you're the one that brought up work ethic as justification for why a manager enforcing playing hard isn't needed, and that all they needed was to continue to look up to Abreu. It was a strange argument, but I gave a response to it. 

Eloy has been in the bigs for 2 years. He's had zero defensive improvement. Something isn't working. Other players do improve their defense, so either the coaching has sucked (honestly, this is pretty likely), or Eloy hasn't given enough effort (plausible - frankly no one knows - and a youtube video doesn't prove anything either way).  

Moncada regressed this year. Badly. I prefaced what I wrote saying that it could be due to covid fatigue, but it also could be lack of focus/effort. Neither of us know.

You want to say people are working hard because some article says guys look up to Abreu. I think that's meaningless if results on the field don't reflect any improvement. 

[ChiSox1917]

3 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

who the hell projected Nolan arenado to be a bad defender?

Arenado was a high school SS prospect who people weren't sure whether he'd stay at short, move to third or catcher as an 18 year old kid. Like most growing high school drafteez his position wasn't certain. 

He was ALWAYS an elite defensive athlete and from about day 2 at third base in the minors he was a star with the glove despite never playing there. 

Arenados problem was he had never played the position until pro ball. Eloy has played outgield his entire life. I just dont think you realize how ignorant you sound calling into question the work ethic of a + to ++ MLB hitter who is at the absolute peak of his career. 

Keith Law on Arenado:

Quote

He’s more “baseball athlete” than “true athlete,” a below-average runner with good hands and a strong arm but thick legs and slightly slow feet. To stay at third base, he’ll have to do everything right with his upper body to make up for what his lower half prevents him from getting, but he seems to have the work ethic and makeup to do it.

hmmm...specifically mentions that he might get there due to his WORK ethic. 

[Thad Bosley]

7 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

I was re-reading the thread and your post got no likes  or anything but you really nailed it when you said you didn't get the memo that the Reinsdorf Loyalty Program had ended so the overtures to LaRussa had to be legit.

Sometimes being anti Jerry means you are correct. Hiring LaRussa put your arch rival SS2K5 into a deep tailspin.

Ha!  I must be mellowing a bit because this move by Reinsdorf this week would have caused an aneurysm in me not too long ago, and yes, also would have resulted in a verbal fisticuffs with SS2K5.  (Although don’t tell him, but I’ve enjoyed watching his ire come out in Reinsdorf’s direction.  Vindication!).  =D
 

Now don’t get me wrong - I truly cannot stand Reinsdorf as owner of this team after watching 40 years of one frustrating incident after another, just like the one we witnessed this week.  Oh, for Soxtalk to have been around since the day this guy became owner!  I’m just at a point that even with this inexplicable decision to hire LaRussa, the days of Reinsdorf are likely numbered, and we just have to ride it out.  But in the meantime, hey, for the first time in a very long time, we have an exciting team to watch and follow!

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

Just now, ChiSox1917 said:

Keith Law on Arenado:

hmmm...specifically mentions that he might get there due to his WORK ethic. 

He was 18 years old. He had never played the position. He was a 2nd round pick as a SS. 

Good for Keith law. He also told me sale had a 40 grade slider. 

Now find me his draft day reports from BA (which I already read) and his showcase numbers which, you guessed it, were elite from arm strength to lateral movement. Speed means literally nothing at third. Arenado was a star within 1 year of milb baseball. He was a top 100 prospect despite being a 2nd round hs pick after 150 milb games. He was the best defensive 3rd baseman in a ball league at 20. Weird. Have a good night bud!

[Thad Bosley]

17 minutes ago, ChiSox1917 said:

Again, you're the one that brought up work ethic as justification for why a manager enforcing playing hard isn't needed, and that all they needed was to continue to look up to Abreu. It was a strange argument, but I gave a response to it. 

Eloy has been in the bigs for 2 years. He's had zero defensive improvement. Something isn't working. Other players do improve their defense, so either the coaching has sucked (honestly, this is pretty likely), or Eloy hasn't given enough effort (plausible - frankly no one knows - and a youtube video doesn't prove anything either way).  

Moncada regressed this year. Badly. I prefaced what I wrote saying that it could be due to covid fatigue, but it also could be lack of focus/effort. Neither of us know.

You want to say people are working hard because some article says guys look up to Abreu. I think that's meaningless if results on the field don't reflect any improvement. 

Can you name me one manager ever in the history of baseball who didn’t enforce playing hard?  Also, Eloy has improved defensively - no less a critic than Steve Stone has acknowledged that, and he wouldn’t if he didn’t believe it.  But there is no one other than you suggesting that any lack of improvement is due to a lack of effort - N-O O-N-E - so until a more reliable source comes in that suggests he’s not working hard enough, I’m going to set your trivial observation aside.  No offense.
 

Finally, you are right about something, that any article just stating that the players are working hard is meaningless if the results on the field don’t reflect any improvements.  Couldn’t agree more!  That’s why we have undeniable evidence right before our very eyes of the hard work this team has put in to go from the sub .500 team they were last year to the playoff team they were this year.  
 

The individual and collective hard work is paying off, it will continue, and bigger and better things are yet to come.  That is going to happen whether Tony LaRussa is the manager or not.  He’s more of a shiny hood ornament at this stage simply in place to placate the current owner.  

Edited October 31, 2020 by Thad Bosley

[ChiSox1917]

11 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

He was 18 years old. He had never played the position. He was a 2nd round pick as a SS. 

Good for Keith law. He also told me sale had a 40 grade slider. 

Now find me his draft day reports from BA (which I already read) and his showcase numbers which, you guessed it, were elite from arm strength to lateral movement. Speed means literally nothing at third. Arenado was a star within 1 year of milb baseball. He was a top 100 prospect despite being a 2nd round hs pick after 150 milb games. He was the best defensive 3rd baseman in a ball league at 20. Weird. Have a good night bud!

There are plenty of articles out there with quotes from Colorado execs who were thinking of moving him to Catcher prior to his defensive improvement in 2011, even quotes by Arenado admitting that he was slow and out of shape for an infielder.  

No one looked at Arenado as a prospect and thought that he would be as good defensively as he is today.  

Still wondering how he became so good? A little thing called....WORK.  

[ChiSox1917]

3 minutes ago, Thad Bosley said:

Can you name me one manager ever in the history of baseball who didn’t enforce playing hard?

Rickey Renteria 

[Thad Bosley]

1 minute ago, ChiSox1917 said:

Rickey Renteria 

So wrong, and not one player, or anyone in the front office, would agree with you.  
 

You need to sit closer to your TV when watching the games from now on.

[southsider2k5]

3 hours ago, Chisoxfn said:

Honestly - If I was TLR - I'd literally get on a zoom and just say, you boys like these (and show a hand with 3 rings).  I'd wait a second and say - we are about to put some more of these on my fingers and yours. This is an awesome club and you all are going to take things next level.  I'm excited to work with all of you and build a coaching staff that will work with you and leverage data and skills, etc, to make you the best players you can be and this team the best team we can be.  But remember - winning isn't hard and consistent winning is even harder - this is going to take a ton of work and I know you all are capable and the staff I build is going to push you like hell to be great. Because that is what we are going to be GREAT and I'm going to hold you to that standard and I will hold myself and my coaches to that standard.  

Going to guess the phone would be an easier choice for him.

[Balta1701]

16 minutes ago, Thad Bosley said:

Can you name me one manager ever in the history of baseball who didn’t enforce playing hard?  

11 minutes ago, ChiSox1917 said:

Rickey Renteria 

 

Jfc people the answer is Robin Ventura and it isn’t close.

They did so little fielding practice in spring training 2013 that they had to start trying to do it before games during May to make up for it. Somehow they didn’t notice until April 2014 that Jose Abreu was putting his foot in a spot that would make him lose his foot on plays at 1b. Avi Garcia nearly tore apart his shoulder diving for a ball in RF because he didn’t know how to do it, so no one coached him and a couple weeks later he tore apart his shoulder. Marcus Semien needed work and that was too hard so they traded him. 

Ricky Renteria was one of the worst in game strategists I’ve seen and he was completely unprofessional when it came to learning new information and dealing with the press or frankly anyone. But his teams always played hard and works hard.

[southsider2k5]

1 hour ago, ChiSox1917 said:

Have Moncada and Eloy shown a hard work ethic at this point?  I haven't seen it.  I like Eloy but he has made zero improvement defensively.  Moncada is harder to tell.  It very well may be the case that he was really plagued this year by Covid fatigue, but he also has reports out about him eating 50 twinkies a week and concerns he can't play through minor bumps and bruises.  

I love Abreu, and he's shown a ton of personal work ethic (also Anderson).  But I don't believe that it has necessarily inspired others.  Not to mention that work ethic and personal improvement aren't all there is to it.  Some of these guys need to be called out for loafing, and making mental errors in game.  We had an insanely talented team last year (on the offensive end), but there was still a lot of sloppy play.  TLR's teams don't play sloppy baseball.  

Wait, I thought it was Ray who didn't watch games.

[ChiSox1917]

12 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

Jfc people the answer is Robin Ventura and it isn’t close.

They did so little fielding practice in spring training 2013 that they had to start trying to do it before games during May to make up for it. Somehow they didn’t notice until April 2014 that Jose Abreu was putting his foot in a spot that would make him lose his foot on plays at 1b. Avi Garcia nearly tore apart his shoulder diving for a ball in RF because he didn’t know how to do it, so no one coached him and a couple weeks later he tore apart his shoulder. Marcus Semien needed work and that was too hard so they traded him. 

Ricky Renteria was one of the worst in game strategists I’ve seen and he was completely unprofessional when it came to learning new information and dealing with the press or frankly anyone. But his teams always played hard and works hard.

lol yeah Robin was worse.  But Rickey's teams were pretty damn sloppy too.

neither of them had any business being MLB managers

[Balta1701]

7 minutes ago, ChiSox1917 said:

lol yeah Robin was worse.  But Rickey's teams were pretty damn sloppy too.

neither of them had any business being MLB managers

I never felt I had to use the ? music for Ricky. I feel like that should follow Ventura around the rest of his life, playing constantly. These two were both terrible hires, like LaRussa is, but each of them is an awful hire for a different reason. Blame RR for what he was bad at, like the bullpen moves that lost what, 1/12 of the games this season? But, they at least hit a cutoff man occasionally.

[Chicago White Sox]

6 hours ago, manbearpuig said:

I know. Why is their managerial search always a joke.

Because it’s a Jerry Reinsdorf franchise unfortunately

[Chicago White Sox]

4 hours ago, Harold's Leg Lift said:

I’m sorry, I guess a GM firing an incompetent manager and trying to replace him with arguably the top available guy on the market is a power play.  Luckily Uncle Jerry checked his ass right?!

[TheBlackSox8]

4 hours ago, poppysox said:

Time will tell if it was a smart move by JR or not.  We will see.

As a Sox fan in 2020, time isn't something many of us have with this squad of guys.  I don't feel like wasting 3 or 4 years rooting for this team if this move was a mistake.  if it isn't a mistake then whatever, but this move wasn't the chance as a fan I was willing to accept for these guys to exceed.  There was a plan that Hahn had and I was on board for.  He didn't get his chance to finish it his way...so I feel like I was cheated seeing this thing through with the current tools.  Fuck Time, and Fuck JR.  I pray this move pays off, but I don't have time to hope...

[Orlando]

44 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

I’m sorry, I guess a GM firing an incompetent manager and trying to replace him with arguably the top available guy on the market is a power play.  Luckily Uncle Jerry checked his ass right?!

?? yeah man shame on Hahn. I’m glad Jerry checked him by making the team he owns look like the dumbest club in baseball. 

Edited October 31, 2020 by Orlando

[TheBlackSox8]

2 hours ago, Balta1701 said:

Jfc people the answer is Robin Ventura and it isn’t close.

They did so little fielding practice in spring training 2013 that they had to start trying to do it before games during May to make up for it. Somehow they didn’t notice until April 2014 that Jose Abreu was putting his foot in a spot that would make him lose his foot on plays at 1b. Avi Garcia nearly tore apart his shoulder diving for a ball in RF because he didn’t know how to do it, so no one coached him and a couple weeks later he tore apart his shoulder. Marcus Semien needed work and that was too hard so they traded him. 

Ricky Renteria was one of the worst in game strategists I’ve seen and he was completely unprofessional when it came to learning new information and dealing with the press or frankly anyone. But his teams always played hard and works hard.

Right?  Hell I'd say Konerko was more of a coach(leader more than anything) of that team then Ventura was.  Ventura was there because a name was needed to be put in place of manager for the MLB  club...at least that's what it felt like.   5 years of Limbo I'd say...