Tnetennba Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 15 hours ago, Balta1701 said: At this point, Passans article has now had space on ESPN.com and on their app main pages for 3 days, so readership and interest in that article must be pretty big. I can’t read them, but the Tribune is running articles saying “deal with it” because that’s all they can do. There seems to have been, aside from LaRussa’s sincerely held comments about being sincere, zero effort at damage control. They haven’t given the fans anything. They haven’t made any of the players available for an interview. They haven’t provided quotes from any of the players. They didn’t bother to track down any of LaRussa’s former players to give a quote praising him on any of the things we’d have called baggage. They didn’t announce any of his staff or anything neW that the fans could get excited about. Notably, when the Tigers hired Hinch, they did a couple of these - gave a positive story about his interview for the press (we called him 30 minutes after the World Series!) and they had a comment from a former player named Justin Verlander, who has some connection to Detroit. The White Sox did none of the basic PR efforts other than a press conference where LaRussa got publicly called on his bullsh*t by basically every major baseball writer and angry fans literally put them as the top trending story on Twitter after they did it. So, either the white Sox did not anticipate an intensely angry reaction from their fan base (and players and league) to this, or they did and didn’t care if they look bad to the rest of the league and country. I'm not sure which would be worse. ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tnetennba Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 I haven't followed the news much over the weekend, but is anyone excoriating or eviscerating the Tigers for hiring AJ Hinch? No? Anything close to the derision the Sox received for hiring La Russa? No? No Reaction? Huh. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThirdGen Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 Lots of people think Reinsdorf should remain out of team decisions, I assume because he is not a "baseball man". He's been heavily involved in baseball for approximately 40 years now. Bill Veeck was considered a "baseball man" because he was involved in baseball management for around the same amount of time (when he re-purchased the Sox). He had won one World Series, same as Reinsdorf. Yet when he owned the team, he was heavily involved in team decisions, more so than Reinsdorf IMO, despite having a well regarded GM in Roland Hemond. Two of the managers he hired, Doby and Lemon had strong ties to previous ownership stints. Paul Richards was also a friend of his, and was a White Sox returning manager. I don't have any recollection of anyone questioning Hemond's role, suggesting he had been neutered, suggesting that he quit, suggesting that Veeck should stay out of his way. At some point does Reinsdorf become a "baseball man", or is he always a real estate guy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirmin' for Yermin Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 On 11/1/2020 at 9:53 AM, Dick Allen said: I bet Jose Oquendo is coaching 3b. What's the deal with him? I hear him a lot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 14 minutes ago, ThirdGen said: Lots of people think Reinsdorf should remain out of team decisions, I assume because he is not a "baseball man". He's been heavily involved in baseball for approximately 40 years now. Bill Veeck was considered a "baseball man" because he was involved in baseball management for around the same amount of time (when he re-purchased the Sox). He had won one World Series, same as Reinsdorf. Yet when he owned the team, he was heavily involved in team decisions, more so than Reinsdorf IMO, despite having a well regarded GM in Roland Hemond. Two of the managers he hired, Doby and Lemon had strong ties to previous ownership stints. Paul Richards was also a friend of his, and was a White Sox returning manager. I don't have any recollection of anyone questioning Hemond's role, suggesting he had been neutered, suggesting that he quit, suggesting that Veeck should stay out of his way. At some point does Reinsdorf become a "baseball man", or is he always a real estate guy? Is there some thought out there that Veeck was good at that? People, years removed, liked his gimmicks. But he made horrible baseball decisions, especially the Roy Sievers trade. Who knows if they could have captured a few more penants in the 60s, especially 64. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 44 minutes ago, ThirdGen said: Lots of people think Reinsdorf should remain out of team decisions, I assume because he is not a "baseball man". He's been heavily involved in baseball for approximately 40 years now. Bill Veeck was considered a "baseball man" because he was involved in baseball management for around the same amount of time (when he re-purchased the Sox). He had won one World Series, same as Reinsdorf. Yet when he owned the team, he was heavily involved in team decisions, more so than Reinsdorf IMO, despite having a well regarded GM in Roland Hemond. Two of the managers he hired, Doby and Lemon had strong ties to previous ownership stints. Paul Richards was also a friend of his, and was a White Sox returning manager. I don't have any recollection of anyone questioning Hemond's role, suggesting he had been neutered, suggesting that he quit, suggesting that Veeck should stay out of his way. At some point does Reinsdorf become a "baseball man", or is he always a real estate guy? Rick Hahn actually made an incredibly inciteful thought that sadly too many people have completely misunderstood when he said that he didn't think he would be able to be a GM in 10 years. He was referring to the amount of change and information that has flowed into the job since he started doing it. He flat out said that despite starting out working with arbitration hearings, that today he would no longer be qualified to be able to do the job. It was his next sentence where he said (not that he would be GM for the next decade) that he thought with the amount of data and change happening, that he would no longer be able to do the job. I think this is great point when talking about how involved ownership is. Back in the 70's? Sure one guy could probably manage and understand everything going on within a baseball franchise in great detail, because there wasn't the amount of detail happening that there is today. In 2020, you have to surround yourself with people who understand their own piece in incredible detail, and then trust them to do their jobs. JR, nor any other owner today, is capable of doing so alone. It felt like we had been moving that way with the people we had hired, and the modernizations that had happened all over the franchise. The TLR thing is the complete opposite. There is a real feel that the job has changed so much since TLR last did it, that he might not have the ability to do it anymore. His public statements only help to enflame those thoughts. So while you can call Jerry a "baseball" guy or a "real estate" guy, it isn't the title that matters, it is the interference with his people on the ground level who hold information in their heads that Jerry doesn't full get. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThirdGen Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 1 minute ago, bmags said: Is there some thought out there that Veeck was good at that? People, years removed, liked his gimmicks. But he made horrible baseball decisions, especially the Roy Sievers trade. Who knows if they could have captured a few more penants in the 60s, especially 64. IMO he was fairly terrible at the baseball side of things. One World Series title in an era of only 16 teams for the most part, and no free agency issues to deal with. And that's my point: no one questioned him being involved in baseball decisions, yet everyone freaks when Reinsdorf does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 1 minute ago, ThirdGen said: IMO he was fairly terrible at the baseball side of things. One World Series title in an era of only 16 teams for the most part, and no free agency issues to deal with. And that's my point: no one questioned him being involved in baseball decisions, yet everyone freaks when Reinsdorf does. Well different time though. Owners actually making roster decisions was typical. But Veeck also did grow up around the game and was basically a lifer. Reinsdorf also makes clear from his invisibility to media, and mostly hands-offness that it is in charge of his pres/GM to make decisions even if he sets budget and has parameters on contracts to sign. So jumping over them so publicly brings questions to why now? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orlando Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 Has La Russa mentioned any White Sox players by name yet? I know he mentioned Anderson once (fed to him) but no one else. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiddleCoastBias Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 In this morning's interview on MLBN, he mentioned how strong our lineup is "at shortstop, first base, and the outfield", but didn't use anyone's name throughout. I thought it was curious at the time but didn't put too much into it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orlando Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 12 minutes ago, MiddleCoastBias said: In this morning's interview on MLBN, he mentioned how strong our lineup is "at shortstop, first base, and the outfield", but didn't use anyone's name throughout. I thought it was curious at the time but didn't put too much into it. I know. So far when making an example about a player he used Kenny Williams and Harold Reynolds lol 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oneofthemikes Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 11 minutes ago, MiddleCoastBias said: In this morning's interview on MLBN, he mentioned how strong our lineup is "at shortstop, first base, and the outfield", but didn't use anyone's name throughout. I thought it was curious at the time but didn't put too much into it. Perfect. That'll match up really well with the "young guys, prime guys, and veteran guys" that he mentioned in the introductory presser. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 12 hours ago, Yearnin' for Yermin said: I'm sure this got posted... But I'll do it anyway. https://www.thenation.com/article/archive/vacuum-tony-la-russa-loves-arizonas-sb-1070/ "In 2010, Arizona governor Jan Brewer signed a law that required police officers to investigate the immigration status of anyone they interact with “where reasonable suspicion exists that the person is an alien who is unlawfully present in the United States.” It also restricted local governments from enforcing federal immigration law to anything less than its fullest extent. When put into action, that law, SB 1070, effectively gave police the power to stop anyone who looked Latin American and demand to see their papers. This law was so unpopular nationally that it sparked threats of an economic boycott of Arizona, including from several MLB players and then–White Sox manager Ozzie Guillen, who said they wouldn’t attend the 2011 All-Star Game if it were held in Phoenix. La Russa publicly endorsed the law. Later in 2010, La Russa appeared at Glenn Beck’s “Restoring Honor” rally in Washington, where he presented Pujols with an award." TY for posting this. This is top level garbage human being behavior. Or "Very fine people" in the modern parlance. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron883 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 14 minutes ago, Balta1701 said: TY for posting this. This is top level garbage human being behavior. Or "Very fine people" in the modern parlance. Sounds like he is a fan of Sheriff Joe Arpaio, which is a red flag to say the least 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ducksnort Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 14 hours ago, Yearnin' for Yermin said: I'm sure this got posted... But I'll do it anyway. https://www.thenation.com/article/archive/vacuum-tony-la-russa-loves-arizonas-sb-1070/ "In 2010, Arizona governor Jan Brewer signed a law that required police officers to investigate the immigration status of anyone they interact with “where reasonable suspicion exists that the person is an alien who is unlawfully present in the United States.” It also restricted local governments from enforcing federal immigration law to anything less than its fullest extent. When put into action, that law, SB 1070, effectively gave police the power to stop anyone who looked Latin American and demand to see their papers. This law was so unpopular nationally that it sparked threats of an economic boycott of Arizona, including from several MLB players and then–White Sox manager Ozzie Guillen, who said they wouldn’t attend the 2011 All-Star Game if it were held in Phoenix. La Russa publicly endorsed the law. Later in 2010, La Russa appeared at Glenn Beck’s “Restoring Honor” rally in Washington, where he presented Pujols with an award." Look, I'm not a fan of La russa being the manager as much as most on here, but this was over 10 years ago. People do change. This is like a person in a relationship bringing up some shit the other person did a decade ago. It's illogical. People of color obviously respected La Russa when he managed. All you need to do is listen to the most recent Sox Talk Podcast to gather that insight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 26 minutes ago, ScooterMcGee said: Look, I'm not a fan of La russa being the manager as much as most on here, but this was over 10 years ago. People do change. This is like a person in a relationship bringing up some shit the other person did a decade ago. It's illogical. People of color obviously respected La Russa when he managed. All you need to do is listen to the most recent Sox Talk Podcast to gather that insight. Well some did. He did have problems with others. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SleepyWhiteSox Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 4 hours ago, ThirdGen said: IMO he was fairly terrible at the baseball side of things. One World Series title in an era of only 16 teams for the most part, and no free agency issues to deal with. And that's my point: no one questioned him being involved in baseball decisions, yet everyone freaks when Reinsdorf does. What does what happened 100 years ago have to do with today?? What good is being called a "baseball guy" if you're terrible at it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 4 hours ago, ThirdGen said: IMO he was fairly terrible at the baseball side of things. One World Series title in an era of only 16 teams for the most part, and no free agency issues to deal with. And that's my point: no one questioned him being involved in baseball decisions, yet everyone freaks when Reinsdorf does. Again, baseball is different now on pretty much all fronts. In this era, owners aren't doing all of these jobs like they used to in the olden days. They can't. And it doesn't seem to be a coincidence that when you look around pro sports, the teams that have owners trying to do more of those jobs themselves, are the ones that are struggling the most. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ducksnort Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 43 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: Well some did. He did have problems with others. Which manager doesn't have problems with some players though? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jose Abreu Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 2 minutes ago, Jose Abreu said: This. Why do I get the feeling the Sox somehow hire a 2nd mgr this year. I don't know why - I just see it happening. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superstar Lamar Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 somehow, i feel worse today about this than I did last week 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxBlanco Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 10 minutes ago, Jose Abreu said: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maloney.adam Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 (edited) Here we go...the sky is falling! Edited November 2, 2020 by maloney.adam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 18 minutes ago, Jose Abreu said: The fact that he feels the need to post this is not making me feel any better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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