Trevor Bauer Thread (Mazara Free Zone)

[michelangelosmonkey]

1 hour ago, The Hawk said:

That's pretty good. Thanks for the warning:) I've gotta be honest, though. I hated it when the Sox traded Sale and Q and waved the white flag. But my anger was and still gets directed at Reinny and not Hahn. I've always thought that the problem with the White Sox has always been Reinny not committing to winning by bringing in people who know talent and building a system to sustain a winning major league team over a long period of time. I think that Hahn is proving that he knows how to do that. Signing guys like Robert, Moncada, JImenez while they are babies in baseball was genius and the drafting of some other young talent, especially pitchers to me is building a team and its future the smart way.

I was late on the rebuild wagon.   I always thought there was a WS path like the 2001 Arizona Diamondbacks (Shilling, Randy Johnson, Luis Gonzalez with a combined 27 WAR...rest of the team garbage).   We stumbled into Abreu and Quintana and with Sale becoming a superstar it seemed you should be able to cobble together a playoff team.  The Shields trade was the Sox gambling, needing a 4 to complete their inside straight and ended up getting a 9 which meant they had nothing.  When that blew up which obviously in retrospect it did, I gave up and wanted the rebuild.   Playing for an inside straight again and again is a losers path.  I'm very happy with the way Hahn has played the game after that failure.  Kenny always wanted the White Sox to go for it every season and made us just good enough to not get top talent in the draft.   I agree the most valuable thing in any organization (in any sport) is the ability to judge talent and it sure seems like Hahn is good at that...the trades, the drafts and the free agent signings sure seem to have us on the cusp.  

[hi8is]

We should change this thread to the Offseason Catch-All ?

[SleepyWhiteSox]

7 hours ago, michelangelosmonkey said:

There is a LOUD faction of Hahn haters here.     

More like a really loud, really obnoxious, really fuckin annoying handful

[Balta1701]

2 hours ago, michelangelosmonkey said:

I was late on the rebuild wagon.   I always thought there was a WS path like the 2001 Arizona Diamondbacks (Shilling, Randy Johnson, Luis Gonzalez with a combined 27 WAR...rest of the team garbage).   We stumbled into Abreu and Quintana and with Sale becoming a superstar it seemed you should be able to cobble together a playoff team.  The Shields trade was the Sox gambling, needing a 4 to complete their inside straight and ended up getting a 9 which meant they had nothing.  When that blew up which obviously in retrospect it did, I gave up and wanted the rebuild.   Playing for an inside straight again and again is a losers path.  I'm very happy with the way Hahn has played the game after that failure.  Kenny always wanted the White Sox to go for it every season and made us just good enough to not get top talent in the draft.   I agree the most valuable thing in any organization (in any sport) is the ability to judge talent and it sure seems like Hahn is good at that...the trades, the drafts and the free agent signings sure seem to have us on the cusp.  

Ironically there might have been a path to competing. Developing guys like Semien, Bassitt, and then eventually Tatis would have filled in some of those gaps, but we traded all those guys away (while saying we didn’t give up much in the trades). We would have had to find some extra contributors and get lucky a couple times, but we had talent there we just didn’t want to work hard enough to develop it. People weren’t kidding when they said Rick Hahn had 3 teams in the playoffs this year.

Quintana falling apart, Rodon flopping, and a coach who was completely checked out probably, in the end, would have prevented that, but patience and development in 2015 and 2016 had a shot, rather than going all in and busting on those foolish gambles which prevented any of that.

[AJ'S Cousin]

I'm going to try to put this back on track as it relates to the title of this discussion, TREVOR BAUER UPDATES. AGAIN WITH ALL THIS BS ABOUT MAZARA. BAUER WINS GAMES, MAZARA TAKE UP SPACE ON THE ROSTER. JR will not sign BAUER.  BAUER IS DONE WITH 1 YEAR CONTRACTS WHEN THE METS WITH NEW OWNERSHIP, THE YANKEES, THE DODGERS THE PHILLIES AND LETS NOT FORGET THE PADRES.

THESE TEAMS SPEND LIKE DRUNKIN SAILORS AS THEY SAY. JERRY DOESN'T HAVE THE BALL TO COMPETE. NOW THE PRICE COULD COME DOWN IF WE DO NOT HAVE A NORMAL SEASON AND THE REVENUE IS NOT COMING IN BESIDES TV MONEY. 

WE have the money to sign 2 tier 2 pitchers ala JQ and Stroman. I don't know who else is available as a FA, please chime in with some names that i'm not aware of that may be better options I wouldn't mind going to war with a Rotation of Gio, Dallas, Stroman, Cease and whoever  until Kopech is ready or Crochet is stretched out. Kopech probably needs to be stretched out with taking the year off. Don't know if his head will be on straight. His Ex Wife i think really messed up his head. Lopez goes to the bullpen for long relief until he gets his head out of his ass along or shown the door or send him down to Birmingham if he still has options.. Dunning and Burdi, BULLPEN with Dunning as an emergency starter. Burdi may also need some time in minors also. Not interested in trading and giving up any of our up and coming stars unless it's a stud # 1 or #2 starter or a big time stud right fielder. if JR had the balls he'd sign GEORGE SPRINGER to play right but that's a separate discussion, this is supposed to be about pitching . The Money is there to sign Bauer or 2 tier 2 pitchers, Stroman and whoever. Stroman, because of his age and our offense. 

 Encarnacion, gone  13 Million

Mazara gone 5,5 Million

Gonzalez, gone 7 million

Rodon gone 2.5 to 3.5 million I believe

McCann gone 5.5 million

Colome probably gone  10.5 million  JR, won't get into a bidding war for him. I wouldn't mind him coming back but not a 20 mill for 2 years. 15 mill i can see, it 

 Worth the gamble on spending on 2 SP's. Huer and Bummer might be able to get it done as closer. Go with Engel in right until the trade deadline. We can carry him. if you add it up with who's gone from the list above, we'd have a ton of money to spend IF it's a normal season with people in the park, concessions, parking etc. IF WE HAVE A NORMAL SEASON. If not all bets are off. 

DON'T TRUST A TRADE FOR A PITCHER. REMEMBER TATIS FOR PRICE EVERYONE????  Where would we be with an outfield of Robert, Jiminez and Tatis, SCARY!!!!!

 FREE AGENCY IS THE WAY TO GO UNLESS SOMEONE IS LOOKING TO DUMP A SALARY and we can steal him. 

Looking forward to your thoughts.

 

Edited October 24, 2020 by AJ'S Cousin

[Chicago White Sox]

If I were GM and had ownership’s backing I’d go all out for Bauer.  Unfortunately I really don’t see Jerry agreeing to a contract with a pitcher for much more than we offered Wheeler, which means we probably don’t have a shot.  All of Trevor’s tough talk of going year to year is the only thing that thing that made us seem like a possibility and it appears he’s willing to be shot in the nuts with a paintball gun in exchange for a major payday.  I think we’ll have to look at other solutions to address our starting pitching needs.

[Two-Gun Pete]

1 hour ago, AJ'S Cousin said:

I'm going to try to put this back on track as it relates to the title of this discussion, TREVOR BAUER UPDATES. AGAIN WITH ALL THIS BS ABOUT MAZARA. BAUER WINS GAMES, MAZARA TAKE UP SPACE ON THE ROSTER. JR will not sign BAUER.  BAUER IS DONE WITH 1 YEAR CONTRACTS WHEN THE METS WITH NEW OWNERSHIP, THE YANKEES, THE DODGERS THE PHILLIES AND LETS NOT FORGET THE PADRES.

THESE TEAMS SPEND LIKE DRUNKIN SAILORS AS THEY SAY. JERRY DOESN'T HAVE THE BALL TO COMPETE. NOW THE PRICE COULD COME DOWN IF WE DO NOT HAVE A NORMAL SEASON AND THE REVENUE IS NOT COMING IN BESIDES TV MONEY. 

WE have the money to sign 2 tier 2 pitchers ala JQ and Stroman. I don't know who else is available as a FA, please chime in with some names that i'm not aware of that may be better options I wouldn't mind going to war with a Rotation of Gio, Dallas, Stroman, Cease and whoever  until Kopech is ready or Crochet is stretched out. Kopech probably needs to be stretched out with taking the year off. Don't know if his head will be on straight. His Ex Wife i think really messed up his head. Lopez goes to the bullpen for long relief until he gets his head out of his ass along or shown the door or send him down to Birmingham if he still has options.. Dunning and Burdi, BULLPEN with Dunning as an emergency starter. Burdi may also need some time in minors also. Not interested in trading and giving up any of our up and coming stars unless it's a stud # 1 or #2 starter or a big time stud right fielder. if JR had the balls he'd sign GEORGE SPRINGER to play right but that's a separate discussion, this is supposed to be about pitching . The Money is there to sign Bauer or 2 tier 2 pitchers, Stroman and whoever. Stroman, because of his age and our offense. 

 Encarnacion, gone  13 Million

Mazara gone 5,5 Million

Gonzalez, gone 7 million

Rodon gone 2.5 to 3.5 million I believe

McCann gone 5.5 million

Colome probably gone  10.5 million  JR, won't get into a bidding war for him. I wouldn't mind him coming back but not a 20 mill for 2 years. 15 mill i can see, it 

 Worth the gamble on spending on 2 SP's. Huer and Bummer might be able to get it done as closer. Go with Engel in right until the trade deadline. We can carry him. if you add it up with who's gone from the list above, we'd have a ton of money to spend IF it's a normal season with people in the park, concessions, parking etc. IF WE HAVE A NORMAL SEASON. If not all bets are off. 

DON'T TRUST A TRADE FOR A PITCHER. REMEMBER TATIS FOR PRICE EVERYONE????  Where would we be with an outfield of Robert, Jiminez and Tatis, SCARY!!!!!

 FREE AGENCY IS THE WAY TO GO UNLESS SOMEONE IS LOOKING TO DUMP A SALARY and we can steal him. 

Looking forward to your thoughts.

 

I think your use of caps lock is impressive. 

I also think that the two WS teams this year have shown the value of pitching depth, and I would like the White Sox to also acquire a metric fück-ton of it this offseason.

I also think I would rather eventually give the big contract to Giolito at some point, rather than watch him sign elsewhere, because the SOX blew their payroll flexibility wad on Bauer.

I think Stroman and Q are the two SPs the SOX need to provide a combined ~340 - 380 IP of ~3.0 - 4.0 FIP, while Cease sorts his shit out/Crochet gets stretched out in Charlotte.

Also, i think Rodon and his greedy agent would be better off to try to find a more competent team to figure him out elsewhere, while 2021 can be Lopez's last chance in this roster, since Lopez no longer has any option years remaining.

YMMV. 

Edited October 24, 2020 by Two-Gun Pete

[michelangelosmonkey]

4 minutes ago, Two-Gun Pete said:

I think your use of caps lock is impressive. 

I also think that the two WS teams this year have shown the value of pitching depth, and I would like the White Sox to also acquire  metric fück-ton of it this offseason.

I also think I would rather eventually give the big contract to Giolito at some point, rather than watch him sign elsewhere, because the SOX blew their payroll flexibility wad on Bauer.

I think Stroman and Q are the two SPs the SOX need to provide a combined ~340 - 380 IP of ~3.0 - 4.0 FIP, while Cease sorts his shit out/Crochet gets stretched out in Charlotte. Also, Rodon and his agent find a more competent team to figure him out elsewhere, while 2021 can be Lopez's last chance in this roster.

YMMV. 

I'm coming over to your side.  I think actually this might be the ONE year where Bauer agrees to a one year $35m contract which I think the Sox should do.  I think Bauer might go for that because I don't think the sort of 9 year $320 million deal Cole got last year is going to be available in a Covid world...at least this off season. Bauer would give us a one year window to see if the Rodon/Cease/Dunning/Lopez/Kopech/Lambert group all fighting to replace him for 2022.  Still you probably will have someone like the Angels that offer him 5-$150 and at that point you walk over to your very sensible S+Q alternative.  They would likely be affordable and have an upside to be very good.  Still for the playoffs...who is your second ace?  Seems like we would have a #1, 3 #3's and then a bunch of young arms.  

[hi8is]

1 hour ago, AJ'S Cousin said:

Looking forward to your thoughts.

Good luck.

[Chicago White Sox]

49 minutes ago, michelangelosmonkey said:

I'm coming over to your side.  I think actually this might be the ONE year where Bauer agrees to a one year $35m contract which I think the Sox should do.  I think Bauer might go for that because I don't think the sort of 9 year $320 million deal Cole got last year is going to be available in a Covid world...at least this off season. Bauer would give us a one year window to see if the Rodon/Cease/Dunning/Lopez/Kopech/Lambert group all fighting to replace him for 2022.  Still you probably will have someone like the Angels that offer him 5-$150 and at that point you walk over to your very sensible S+Q alternative.  They would likely be affordable and have an upside to be very good.  Still for the playoffs...who is your second ace?  Seems like we would have a #1, 3 #3's and then a bunch of young arms.  

If Bauer only gets 5/$150M we should be all over him.

[Balta1701]

49 minutes ago, michelangelosmonkey said:

I'm coming over to your side.  I think actually this might be the ONE year where Bauer agrees to a one year $35m contract which I think the Sox should do.  I think Bauer might go for that because I don't think the sort of 9 year $320 million deal Cole got last year is going to be available in a Covid world...at least this off season. Bauer would give us a one year window to see if the Rodon/Cease/Dunning/Lopez/Kopech/Lambert group all fighting to replace him for 2022.  Still you probably will have someone like the Angels that offer him 5-$150 and at that point you walk over to your very sensible S+Q alternative.  They would likely be affordable and have an upside to be very good.  Still for the playoffs...who is your second ace?  Seems like we would have a #1, 3 #3's and then a bunch of young arms.  

2021 there’s a potential lockout looming, so if you’re going to take a long term deal and one is actually on the table now you do so. If you’re going to take a 1 year deal this year, good chance you do so again in 2021 and then sign for longer the next year.

[Balta1701]

Just now, Chicago White Sox said:

If Bauer only gets 5/$150M we should be all over him.

After what Stras got last year yeah that’s a pretty dramatic market drop.

[Vulture]

16 hours ago, Balta1701 said:

After what Stras got last year yeah that’s a pretty dramatic market drop.

I don't think Bauer is comparable to Strasburg. Sure he had a hell of an 11 start stretch in 2020 but the track record isn't even close. 17.5 career war vs 33.2, not to mention Strasburg's post season success with a career 1.46 ERA and two world series wins in '19. Baseball reference has Cole, Kluber and Sale listed as similar to Stras, but guys like Chris Young and Mike Fiers to Bauer. Granted, he's turned a corner, but I'm not sure eleven starts is enough to justify the comparison when it comes to contract negotiations. He has been excellent, but he also has been exceedingly mediocre. Strasbourg has never had any seasons as weak as Bauer's '17 or '19. 

Edited October 25, 2020 by Vulture

[Sleepy Harold]

Keep checking this thread for Bauer updates and all I'm getting is hearty helpings of Mazara. No thank you.

[turnin' two]

Man, fool me once shame on you, fool me twice...  This is still Mazara talk??? Holy moly.

[Two-Gun Pete]

3 minutes ago, Sleepy Harold said:

STOP ? TALKING ? ABOUT ? NOMAR ? MAZARA ? IN ? THE ? TREVOR ? BAUER ? UPDATE ? THREAD ?. Factoring in the eye test, he's still below average. Let's move on, yes? 

Here's your Bauer update:

 

He ain't coming here, any more than Gerrit Cole, or Harper, or Machado.

 

Since it is an abject waste of time discussing Bauer coming here, some want to defend a below average player.

[maloney.adam]

5 minutes ago, Sleepy Harold said:

STOP ? TALKING ? ABOUT ? NOMAR ? MAZARA ? IN ? THE ? TREVOR ? BAUER ? UPDATE ? THREAD ?. Factoring in the eye test, he's still below average. Let's move on, yes? 

I agree, let’s move on people. I guess there’s nothing else to talk about while we wait for the World Series to finish.

[Chicago White Sox]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/sports.yahoo.com/amphtml/mlb-sources-could-land-free-130019190.html

This article speculates he gets something similar to Strasburg’s 7/$245M deal ($35M AAV).  I think that might be a year too rich given his personality and the current economic environment.  But if he was willing to take a 6/$210M deal I would be all over that.  It would greatly limit what else we could do, but he’d basically be the finishing piece to the rebuild.

[Sleepy Harold]

2 minutes ago, Two-Gun Pete said:

Here's your Bauer update:

 

He ain't coming here, any more than Gerrit Cole, or Harper, or Machado.

 

Since it is an abject waste of time discussing Bauer coming here, some want to defend a below average player.

Thanks for the update JR.

[Two-Gun Pete]

9 minutes ago, Sleepy Harold said:

Thanks for the update JR.

Hey, live in the real world, or delude yourself. Its entirely up to you.

Has this org ever signed anyone to a $150MM+ contract? Does this org like long term contracts for pitchers?

 

Just asking.

[Balta1701]

1 hour ago, Chicago White Sox said:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/sports.yahoo.com/amphtml/mlb-sources-could-land-free-130019190.html

This article speculates he gets something similar to Strasburg’s 7/$245M deal ($35M AAV).  I think that might be a year too rich given his personality and the current economic environment.  But if he was willing to take a 6/$210M deal I would be all over that.  It would greatly limit what else we could do, but he’d basically be the finishing piece to the rebuild.

Even regardless of this environment, I recoiled at the idea the White Sox would spend that money on a pitcher.

[AJ'S Cousin]

i agree with two gun Pete, Maloney and Sleepy. This is a Bauer blog not a Mazara blog. I've also tried to steer this conversation back to Bauer and at pitching which is are BIGGEST PRIORITY. 

 

 

[Balta1701]

21 minutes ago, AJ'S Cousin said:

i agree with two gun Pete, Maloney and Sleepy. This is a Bauer blog not a Mazara blog. I've also tried to steer this conversation back to Bauer and at pitching which is are BIGGEST PRIORITY. 

 

 

This is...not a blog?

[southsider2k5]

30 minutes ago, AJ'S Cousin said:

i agree with two gun Pete, Maloney and Sleepy. This is a Bauer blog not a Mazara blog. I've also tried to steer this conversation back to Bauer and at pitching which is are BIGGEST PRIORITY. 

 

 

 

[Sleepy Harold]

2 hours ago, Two-Gun Pete said:

Hey, live in the real world, or delude yourself. Its entirely up to you.

Has this org ever signed anyone to a $150MM+ contract? Does this org like long term contracts for pitchers?

 

Just asking.

I'm nowhere on record saying that they will sign him. The Sox should sign him, but we're all too familiar with the team's history in free agency. I'd just prefer to read about Trevor Bauer news in a Trevor Bauer thread, which doesn't seem like an outlandish request.

Edited October 26, 2020 by Sleepy Harold