Texsox Posted January 10, 2021 Share Posted January 10, 2021 Just now, Jack Parkman said: The voters in their states agree with them, that's the huge issue. They're actually representing their constituents. Not all their constituents. That's like saying America agreed with Trump because he was elected. Cruz was on the ropes against Beto two years ago. There was a lot of ground support and I believe we can defeat him in two years. I'll be back on the phones and working hard to make that happen. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted January 10, 2021 Share Posted January 10, 2021 2 minutes ago, StrangeSox said: Democracies can fall to coups and you're extremely naive if you think the United States are somehow immune to that. I do not believe we are immune to it. I just believe we will survive this and the next four years will be better. I believe we will have investigations and people will be sent to prison. I believe that because the Dem has control for the next two years. You don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted January 10, 2021 Share Posted January 10, 2021 2 minutes ago, Balta1701 said: I believe that US law has no ability to handle a situation like that, and you cannot write and pass a new law to establish what to do if the electoral college information has been destroyed without the Presidents signature. This is why there is a “Designated Survivor”. Because there are scenarios where the US government has made no law to cover them, and if one of them happens, there is no legal way to clean things up. If the entire line of Presidential succession is gone, this country has no legal way to fix it. OK, write Cruz he is your senator and he's fired up about fixing the system. Obviously you don't trust that the lawfully elected person will become president. Let's make certain that scenario is covered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted January 10, 2021 Share Posted January 10, 2021 4 minutes ago, Texsox said: Not all their constituents. That's like saying America agreed with Trump because he was elected. Cruz was on the ropes against Beto two years ago. There was a lot of ground support and I believe we can defeat him in two years. I'll be back on the phones and working hard to make that happen. While I agree with you here, there are enough of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted January 10, 2021 Share Posted January 10, 2021 Just now, Texsox said: OK, write Cruz he is your senator and he's fired up about fixing the system. Obviously you don't trust that the lawfully elected person will become president. Let's make certain that scenario is covered. Thankfully Cruz is no longer my Senator. He’s your problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted January 10, 2021 Share Posted January 10, 2021 How about this law. If the president elect and his VP are assassinated before they have a chance to convene a cabinet the state governors from their party will meet to designate a replacement? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted January 10, 2021 Share Posted January 10, 2021 6 minutes ago, Balta1701 said: Thankfully Cruz is no longer my Senator. He’s your problem. I have faith in our system, you are the one that believes an election can be stolen from the rightful winner. So now we have some insight on how polls can show so many Americans believing it's possible that an election could be stolen. I would call these scenarios far fetched, but a lot of people here seem to believe it. So perhaps a bipartisan commission to review our election laws is necessary to restore faith in the election process after all. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 10, 2021 Share Posted January 10, 2021 6 minutes ago, Texsox said: So you believe that the person elected could have the election taken from him in this manner? So you don't have trust in our system. I do. So you might want to write Cruz and let him know you agree that Americans don't trust our system. This isn't a procedural question on the like of Robert's Rules of Order. The President tried to have the government toppled by force. The what ifs don't matter here. You treat this like sedition and treason, not like an objection out of order. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted January 10, 2021 Share Posted January 10, 2021 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Texsox said: I have faith in our system, you are the one that believes an election can be stolen from the rightful winner. So now we have some insight on how polls can show so many Americans believing it's possible that an election could be stolen. I would call these scenarios far fetched, but a lot of people here seem to believe it. So perhaps a bipartisan commission to review our election laws is necessary to restore faith in the election process after all. A Republican hasn't won the popular vote since 1988, yet they've been president for 12 years in that span. The Electoral college and gerrymandering are anti-democratic and need to be outlawed. They only exist to uphold minority rule. In terms of the current system, legally, I do not think that an election has been stolen, while the argument could be made for Bush v Gore being a stolen one. That precedent is why this current situation can happen. Edited January 10, 2021 by Jack Parkman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted January 10, 2021 Share Posted January 10, 2021 6 minutes ago, Texsox said: I have faith in our system, you are the one that believes an election can be stolen from the rightful winner. So now we have some insight on how polls can show so many Americans believing it's possible that an election could be stolen. I would call these scenarios far fetched, but a lot of people here seem to believe it. So perhaps a bipartisan commission to review our election laws is necessary to restore faith in the election process after all. After the 9/11 attacks, a commission including members of the moderate left wing Brookings institution and the right wing American Enterprise Institute took a look at potential ways that the US government could be completely broken by a terrorist attack, such as situations where Congress needs to approve a President or Vice President but there is no quorum, as required by the law for a vote to happen, and recommended a number of legal changes that would make things more secure in the face of a possible mass casualty event in DC. The commissions chairs were Ford and Carter. The recommendations, for the most part, have not been adopted. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Continuity_of_Government_Commission Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted January 10, 2021 Share Posted January 10, 2021 1 minute ago, southsider2k5 said: This isn't a procedural question on the like of Robert's Rules of Order. The President tried to have the government toppled by force. The what ifs don't matter here. You treat this like sedition and treason, not like an objection out of order. Indeed. The siccing a mob on the capitol to violently intimidate lawmakers to rule your way is technically not in the constitution. So saying "the system works" doesn't make any sense. And when violence becomes acceptible the rules really start to breakdown. Had the OKC bombing happened and half of a party voted to say "yes we should murder all federal employees" still it would also be concerning even if it didn't pass. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted January 10, 2021 Share Posted January 10, 2021 5 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: This isn't a procedural question on the like of Robert's Rules of Order. The President tried to have the government toppled by force. The what ifs don't matter here. You treat this like sedition and treason, not like an objection out of order. Exactly. Balta is suggesting if they took the ballot box with the state results that somehow the election would be taken from Biden. To me it's an act of treason and it would be dealt with and Biden would still be president. I do not see a way, short of actually killing Biden, that the seditious and treasonous folks that stormed the capital would prevent Biden from becoming president. Balta met the challenge with an example. In fact several posters mentioned ways that the election could be stolen from Biden. I still disagree and believe we would fight treason and install the lawfully elected person. But clearly people disagree and find ways that trump could stay in power. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted January 11, 2021 Share Posted January 11, 2021 Listen if you think this mob could steal the election from Biden you do not have faith in the process and should support those that want a full and comprehensive look at the system. This is too important. I'm shocked at how many people believe the election could be stolen from Biden. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxbadger Posted January 11, 2021 Share Posted January 11, 2021 Im just glad the traitors decided to exercise their freedom and not wear masks, making it much easier to identify them. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted January 11, 2021 Share Posted January 11, 2021 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Texsox said: Listen if you think this mob could steal the election from Biden you do not have faith in the process and should support those that want a full and comprehensive look at the system. This is too important. I'm shocked at how many people believe the election could be stolen from Biden. Quite frankly, we believe that because it has sorta been done before by the SCOTUS in Bush v Gore. They did not allow the recount to go all the way through. As long as the politicians in robes are on the side of the batshit crazies, it is possible. Edited January 11, 2021 by Jack Parkman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted January 11, 2021 Share Posted January 11, 2021 Just now, Soxbadger said: Im just glad the traitors decided to exercise their freedom and not wear masks, making it much easier to identify them. And even posted about it. Which is kind of an interesting side note. Should the various internet platforms that were used be considered as aiding the mob to plan and organize or as heroes for allowing the traitors to turn themselves in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangeSox Posted January 11, 2021 Share Posted January 11, 2021 28 minutes ago, Texsox said: OK, write Cruz he is your senator and he's fired up about fixing the system. Obviously you don't trust that the lawfully elected person will become president. Let's make certain that scenario is covered. Cruz is a fascist who's fired up about fascism Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted January 11, 2021 Share Posted January 11, 2021 9 minutes ago, Texsox said: Exactly. Balta is suggesting if they took the ballot box with the state results that somehow the election would be taken from Biden. To me it's an act of treason and it would be dealt with and Biden would still be president. I do not see a way, short of actually killing Biden, that the seditious and treasonous folks that stormed the capital would prevent Biden from becoming president. Balta met the challenge with an example. In fact several posters mentioned ways that the election could be stolen from Biden. I still disagree and believe we would fight treason and install the lawfully elected person. But clearly people disagree and find ways that trump could stay in power. To be clear, that doesn't mean that Trump would stay in power. Rather, it means that the US Government has broken. There would be no one in the country who could give a legal order to the military as of noon on January 20. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted January 11, 2021 Share Posted January 11, 2021 1 minute ago, Jack Parkman said: Quite frankly, we believe that because it has sorta been done before by the SCOTUS in Bush v Gore. They did not allow the recount to go all the way through. As long as the politicians in robes are on the side of the batshit crazies, it is possible. Then Cruz and company that have been calling for a systematic review aren't crazy for wanting a review. I still have complete confidence in the system, but I do believe congress should take up an investigation and identify areas of concern and address them. Y'all have convinced me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangeSox Posted January 11, 2021 Share Posted January 11, 2021 13 minutes ago, bmags said: Indeed. The siccing a mob on the capitol to violently intimidate lawmakers to rule your way is technically not in the constitution. So saying "the system works" doesn't make any sense. And when violence becomes acceptible the rules really start to breakdown. Had the OKC bombing happened and half of a party voted to say "yes we should murder all federal employees" still it would also be concerning even if it didn't pass. We already know the system didn't work because there was a counter coup!! We're told that there are assurances the President doesn't currently control the nuclear arsenal! This is the system breaking down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangeSox Posted January 11, 2021 Share Posted January 11, 2021 1 minute ago, Texsox said: Then Cruz and company that have been calling for a systematic review aren't crazy for wanting a review. I still have complete confidence in the system, but I do believe congress should take up an investigation and identify areas of concern and address them. Y'all have convinced me. The areas of concern are the fascists and the lies they tell about our system. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted January 11, 2021 Share Posted January 11, 2021 Just now, Balta1701 said: To be clear, that doesn't mean that Trump would stay in power. Rather, it means that the US Government has broken. There would be no one in the country who could give a legal order to the military as of noon on January 20. Do you really think Congress wouldn't install Biden and let the courts sort it out later? And do you think anyone other than Biden would eventually be president? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted January 11, 2021 Share Posted January 11, 2021 Just now, StrangeSox said: The areas of concern are the fascists and the lies they tell about our system. Sure. Do you believe the election could have been stolen from Biden and what should be done about it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted January 11, 2021 Share Posted January 11, 2021 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Texsox said: Then Cruz and company that have been calling for a systematic review aren't crazy for wanting a review. I still have complete confidence in the system, but I do believe congress should take up an investigation and identify areas of concern and address them. Y'all have convinced me. The areas of concern are the GOP gaming the system and suppressing the vote. The GOP plays dirty, the Dems play by the rules and that is the only issue. This is a right wing problem. Don't try to both sides this. Edited January 11, 2021 by Jack Parkman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted January 11, 2021 Share Posted January 11, 2021 2 minutes ago, StrangeSox said: The areas of concern are the fascists and the lies they tell about our system. Correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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