MLB 2020-21 off season catch all

[SonofaRoache]

27 minutes ago, Harold's Leg Lift said:

First Chris Young now Sam Fuld.  This is where baseball is heading.  They finally figured out that having non-baseball people making basball decisions is a bad thing.  Baseball people who also understand analytics and can explain and apply them in a practical way is where this thing is going and I for one say thank f'ing god.  

Let's wait for Young and Fuld to do something first before changing the GM game. 

[Harold's Leg Lift]

13 minutes ago, bmags said:

It may have been a necessary transition, but I'm glad it's now swinging back to the players developing into front office.

It's the players game.  The ivy leaguers tried their damndest to push them out but they're gonna make their way back in and not only in the FO but in player development too.  It can't happen soon enough.  

[bmags]

26 minutes ago, Dick Allen said:

Chris Young went to Princeton, and Fuld went to Stanford, so these are pretty bright guys.

I'm sorry does saying "players" indicate idiots?

[bmags]

23 minutes ago, oldsox said:

So you don't like non ex-players in the Front Office?  You sound like Hawk.  He fired everyone who wasn't an ex-player.  And as a GM, Hawk was a great announcer.  He was not very good as a GM.  There are others, too.  Conversely, there are many great Front  Office execs who never played professionally.  The Dodgers sure like their guy.  Tampa has done well with non-jocks.  Some people say Branch Rickey was successful.

Maybe there is room for nuance in this world. Not on this board though.

[Dick Allen]

8 minutes ago, bmags said:

I'm sorry does saying "players" indicate idiots?

No, but Young is an Ivy Leaguer, and Stanford is pretty close to that status. It's not like they are hiring some guy who was drafted out of HS or a JUCO but seems to have some baseball acumen. They aren't hiring baseball lifers that "paid their dues" and learned their way up.

Edited December 22, 2020 by Dick Allen

[bmags]

5 minutes ago, Dick Allen said:

No, but Young is an Ivy Leaguer, and Stanford is pretty close to that status. It's not like they are hiring some guy who was drafted out of HS or a JUCO but seems to have some baseball acumen. They aren't hiring baseball lifers that "paid their dues" and learned their way up.

I didn't say they were. These aren't the first smart baseball players in history. The new front office crop are players that retired and learned modern baseball strategies in a variety of different positions and now are the leads for manager and front office roles. And I think that is a good thing instead of teams pulling from consulting and finance industries. And I'd much rather it than agents moving into f.o. roles.

[Dick Allen]

2 minutes ago, bmags said:

I didn't say they were. These aren't the first smart baseball players in history. The new front office crop are players that retired and learned modern baseball strategies in a variety of different positions and now are the leads for manager and front office roles. And I think that is a good thing instead of teams pulling from consulting and finance industries. And I'd much rather it than agents moving into f.o. roles.

You can say that, but 2 hires don't make a trend, and they are going to run out of Ivy League major leaguers who want a career in a front office pretty quickly. Dombrowski is Fuld's boss and he is pretty much the opposite. 

Edited December 22, 2020 by Dick Allen

[bmags]

Just now, Dick Allen said:

You can say that, but 2 hires don't make a trend, and they are going to run out of Ivy League major leaguers who want a career in a front office pretty quickly.

Cool I bet you are wrong. And stanford isn't ivy league.

[Dick Allen]

4 minutes ago, bmags said:

Cool I bet you are wrong. And stanford isn't ivy league.

I never said it was. I said it was pretty close to that status as an academic institution. 

[bmags]

Just now, Dick Allen said:

I never said it was. I said it was pretty close to that status as an academic institution. 

So is Vanderbilt. I wonder if they get any players to MLB.

[Dick Allen]

1 minute ago, bmags said:

So is Vanderbilt. I wonder if they get any players to MLB.

How many Vandy GMs are there? The  other problem is being a GM isn't a big career goal for a major leaguer that has banked a lot of cash. It pays a lot less than playing, and you get a lot more blame if things don't work out.  The fact is Dombrowski is going to get all of the credit or all of the blame depending how the Phillies perform. Young may get some credit, I don't know how Daniels role will evolved, but they didn't give Dombrowski $20 million to lay the blame or give the credit to someone else. 

[bmags]

4 minutes ago, Dick Allen said:

How many Vandy GMs are there? The  other problem is being a GM isn't a big career goal for a major leaguer that has banked a lot of cash. It pays a lot less than playing, and you get a lot more blame if things don't work out.  The fact is Dombrowski is going to get all of the credit or all of the blame depending how the Phillies perform. Young may get some credit, I don't know how Daniels role will evolved, but they didn't give Dombrowski $20 million to lay the blame or give the credit to someone else. 

This is such silly garbage. First your point is that these new GMs are some sort of unicorns because they are well educated, as if there isn't a plethora of baseball pipelines from top schools like Vandy, Stanford, Duke and Notre Dame, and many across smaller programs like Tulane, ivys, and more. But then its that not all baseball players want to be GMs.

It's weird how so many former players are willing to sign on to become coaches, starting out in minor league cities driving a bus, being away from their families for 6 figure salaries after making millions - but they wouldn't be able to find baseball players willing to go to the front office in the same cities they've played, and getting paid more. 

Thank god we have the finance/consulting pipeline. Two industries that are very well known for handling criticism with class.

[pcq]

23 minutes ago, bmags said:

So is Vanderbilt. I wonder if they get any players to MLB.

Joey Cora

[Chicago White Sox]

10 minutes ago, bmags said:

This is such silly garbage. First your point is that these new GMs are some sort of unicorns because they are well educated, as if there isn't a plethora of baseball pipelines from top schools like Vandy, Stanford, Duke and Notre Dame, and many across smaller programs like Tulane, ivys, and more. But then its that not all baseball players want to be GMs.

It's weird how so many former players are willing to sign on to become coaches, starting out in minor league cities driving a bus, being away from their families for 6 figure salaries after making millions - but they wouldn't be able to find baseball players willing to go to the front office in the same cities they've played, and getting paid more. 

Thank god we have the finance/consulting pipeline. Two industries that are very well known for handling criticism with class.

I’m not sure I get the bottom comment, but the part you & Harold are ignoring is in the case of the Rangers it’s an Ivy Leaguer / business type guy bringing on a former baseball player to work underneath him.  I think people are starting to acknowledge the game shifted too much down the analytics / big business path and that better balance is required in terms of having baseball people in important roles.  That doesn’t mean all the billionaire owners are going to start hiring former baseball players to be the lead decision makers in their organizations.  IMO, most of them will continue to want a business-oriented or “Ivy League” type guy at the very top.

[bmags]

3 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

I’m not sure I get the bottom comment, but the part you & Harold are ignoring is in the case of the Rangers it’s an Ivy Leaguer / business type guy bringing on a former baseball player to work underneath him.  I think people are starting to acknowledge the game shifted too much down the analytics / big business path and that better balance is required in terms of having baseball people in important roles.  That doesn’t mean all the billionaire owners are going to start hiring former baseball players to be the lead decision makers in their organizations.  IMO, most of them will continue to want a business-oriented or “Ivy League” type guy at the very top.

I'm not ignoring it. These things take time. Per your bolded, let's be clear about how this goes. The billionaire owners weren't plucking people out of finance and ivy league business schools and putting them in president and GM roles. Luhnow is probably the closest to a story like that and he was put in charge of scouting. They started getting hired into the analytics and ops positions, were successful at showing these competitive advantages, and then got hired into those roles. Then they hired people who they thought could do the new strategies. Then billionaire owners hired people out of the successful front offices to lead their front offices. So now we have the new breed of former players who are fluent in player development and use of data, and are now being targeted as the group to move into front office and management roles.

My contention is this is not going to stop. Is there a president that wasn't a former GM for years? There is going to be a lag. But instead of GMs going to people like Elias and Girsch, you have people like Fuld and Young making their way in, and in a different direction, you have someone like Ng. Is she an u of c analytics hire, or an example of someone whose been around the game for a long time getting a shot.

[Harold's Leg Lift]

56 minutes ago, bmags said:

So is Vanderbilt. I wonder if they get any players to MLB.

Craig Breslow is an asst GM with the Cubs. Another organization hired an ex player in the FO too.  I think it was the Mariners.  

[bmags]

3 minutes ago, Harold's Leg Lift said:

Craig Breslow is an asst GM with the Cubs. Another organization hired an ex player in the FO too.  I think it was the Mariners.  

Not sure but I remember the Mariners literally drafted a player out of MIT to move them into the scouting dept.

[Sleepy Harold]

"As many as 20 teams" sent reps to watch his workout. I hope one was sent from the Sox. 

[Chicago White Sox]

9 minutes ago, Sleepy Harold said:

"As many as 20 teams" sent reps to watch his workout. I hope one was sent from the Sox. 

Paxton would be a fantastic get on a one year deal.

[Jack Parkman]

1 hour ago, Sleepy Harold said:

"As many as 20 teams" sent reps to watch his workout. I hope one was sent from the Sox. 

If he's topping out at 94 mph that would make his velo down 5 mph or so. He was topping at 98-99 before his injury. 

[bmags]

11 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

If he's topping out at 94 mph that would make his velo down 5 mph or so. He was topping at 98-99 before his injury. 

He’s a mid 90s pitcher. He was low 90s last year. We weren’t at session but I doubt this means what you jump to thinking it does.

[Jack Parkman]

16 minutes ago, bmags said:

He’s a mid 90s pitcher. He was low 90s last year. We weren’t at session but I doubt this means what you jump to thinking it does.

Paxton usually sat around 95-96 and topped at 99. 

The question is if he was sitting at 94 or topping at 94. Sitting at 94 means his velo is down 1-2 mph. Topping at 94 is a huge difference. 

They said he "hit" 94 mph which I take to mean topping at. That would mean he's sitting around 91-92 mph, which is  HUGE red flag. 

https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/savant-player/james-paxton-572020?stats=statcast-r-pitching-mlb

I didn't realize that he was sitting 92-93 in 2020. So he's stayed there. That's a far cry from sitting 95-96 as he did every season previous to 2020. 

Edited December 23, 2020 by Jack Parkman

[Harold's Leg Lift]

It's December 22.  

[southsider2k5]

15 minutes ago, bmags said:

He’s a mid 90s pitcher. He was low 90s last year. We weren’t at session but I doubt this means what you jump to thinking it does.

The three previous years he was either 95.5 or 95.4 on fb average.

[Jack Parkman]

 

Edited December 23, 2020 by Jack Parkman