Jose Abreu Posted November 25, 2020 Share Posted November 25, 2020 8 hours ago, Harold's Leg Lift said: I'd honestly be surprised if any of these guys are traded this off season. I think teams see a really shitty FA pitching market so they're throwing these guys out there to see if they get an offer that blows them away and I doubt they get one. I know the Rays operate different than other clubs but it's really hard to believe they remove Morton and Snell from a WS team. I assume by "these guys", you mean Blake Snell, Sonny Gray types? Because I feel pretty confident that Lance Lynn and Joe Musgrove will be moved Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harold's Leg Lift Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 15 minutes ago, Jose Abreu said: I assume by "these guys", you mean Blake Snell, Sonny Gray types? Because I feel pretty confident that Lance Lynn and Joe Musgrove will be moved Correct Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheCommish Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 I'm really not a fan of dealing for Snell. TB is going to require a Chris Archer like deal where they want 2-3 top prospects that are major league ready. I don't think Snell is worth Vaughn and Kopech, which is what they would require. If it was someone along the lines of Chris Sale... established as a dominant pitcher and eating up innings (when we traded him), then I'd be willing. I'd much rather go into the season with an upgrade in RF (Springer, Pederson, Bradley JR), and signing 2 above average pitchers that we can easily throw in the bullpen when our young guys are ready. Quintana, Odorizzi. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarava Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 I wouldn't make a move for Snell. I wouldn't like our chances of winning a trade with Tampa. And if you do give up Kopech and Vaughn, and then Snell doesn't work out (he's only thrown more than 129 IP once)...you may of just ruined the rebuild with this trade. Just open up the checkbook Jerry and sign Bauer. Then we have a more reliable #1 than Snell, and we get to keep Vaughn and Kopech. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orlando Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 1 hour ago, Sarava said: I wouldn't make a move for Snell. I wouldn't like our chances of winning a trade with Tampa. And if you do give up Kopech and Vaughn, and then Snell doesn't work out (he's only thrown more than 129 IP once)...you may of just ruined the rebuild with this trade. Just open up the checkbook Jerry and sign Bauer. Then we have a more reliable #1 than Snell, and we get to keep Vaughn and Kopech. Is the goal to win the trade or get better? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarava Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 16 minutes ago, Orlando said: Is the goal to win the trade or get better? Both? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarava Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 The Sox don't have the payroll might to make a Sale type trade, where you expect to ultimately lose the trade value-wise. They gotta hold on tight to cheap controllable talent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 30 minutes ago, Orlando said: Is the goal to win the trade or get better? This is a great point. The point of a deal like this isn't to win the trade, it is to win the World Series. Even if you trade someone who turns out to be the next someone, isn't it worth it if you get a parade? Does anyone think as Theo was hanging it up he was regretting losing Eloy as basking in winning it all? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 1 hour ago, southsider2k5 said: This is a great point. The point of a deal like this isn't to win the trade, it is to win the World Series. Even if you trade someone who turns out to be the next someone, isn't it worth it if you get a parade? Does anyone think as Theo was hanging it up he was regretting losing Eloy as basking in winning it all? The Cubs traded Eloy the year after winning the World Series, so not sure how much basking Theo was really doing about that move 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron883 Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, southsider2k5 said: This is a great point. The point of a deal like this isn't to win the trade, it is to win the World Series. Even if you trade someone who turns out to be the next someone, isn't it worth it if you get a parade? Does anyone think as Theo was hanging it up he was regretting losing Eloy as basking in winning it all? Many people here think the Chapman trade Theo made was atrocious. I think it was worth it, but many here call it a loss for the Cubs. Also, the Eloy trade didn't result in them winning another WS. I don't understand what you're getting at. Edited November 26, 2020 by Yearnin' for Yermin 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarava Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 OK you guys are splitting hairs a bit more than I had in my mind when I worried about 'losing the trade'. If it was close and pushed you over the edge, of course it would be worthwhile. My bigger concern is that the Rays front office usually makes the right move - and if they're all of the sudden wanting to move Snell - I'm suspicious as to why. I know they like to recycle their assets, but I would be concerned that there might be more to this from their point of view. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 The point is clear, if you are scared, get a dog. If you think you can get a guy that gets you closer to a World Series you do it, it doesn't matter who they deal is with. If you are a coward, find a new job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poppysox Posted November 27, 2020 Share Posted November 27, 2020 9 hours ago, Sarava said: OK you guys are splitting hairs a bit more than I had in my mind when I worried about 'losing the trade'. If it was close and pushed you over the edge, of course it would be worthwhile. My bigger concern is that the Rays front office usually makes the right move - and if they're all of the sudden wanting to move Snell - I'm suspicious as to why. I know they like to recycle their assets, but I would be concerned that there might be more to this from their point of view. One thing for sure...Snell is not Sale. Don't pay a Sale like price. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
35thstreetswarm Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 Man, Sox Twitter is full of arguments this week in response to that graphic from MLBtv suggesting Vaughn + Kopech + Stiever (yes, that's our #1 hitting prospect, #1 pitching prospect, PLUS another MLB-ready arm) for Snell...with the majority seeming to like it! Makes me happy to spend my time here with you folks. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Look at Ray Ray Run Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 4 minutes ago, 35thstreetswarm said: Man, Sox Twitter is full of arguments this week in response to that graphic from MLBtv suggesting Vaughn + Kopech + Stiever (yes, that's our #1 hitting prospect, #1 pitching prospect, PLUS another MLB-ready arm) for Snell...with the majority seeming to like it! Makes me happy to spend my time here with you folks. This is how White Sox twitter goes: Sign every FA Trade for every star available Who cares what we give up. Just get star players for big money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCCWS Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 3 minutes ago, 35thstreetswarm said: Man, Sox Twitter is full of arguments this week in response to that graphic from MLBtv suggesting Vaughn + Kopech + Stiever (yes, that's our #1 hitting prospect, #1 pitching prospect, PLUS another MLB-ready arm) for Snell...with the majority seeming to like it! Makes me happy to spend my time here with you folks. I think the issue may be Kopech. Tampa always seems to be looking to trade established players for a "young" return. I think the problem is how big of a question does Tampa think Kopech is. They must think Vaughn is a sure thing despite no AAA but my guess is they will want another sure thing and that would depend on where Kopech is physically and mentally. If they are confident w Kopech , that would seem to be a match. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capital G Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 That would be a terrible trade. How many times has Snell sniffed 200 innings? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
35thstreetswarm Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 4 minutes ago, SCCWS said: I think the issue may be Kopech. Tampa always seems to be looking to trade established players for a "young" return. I think the problem is how big of a question does Tampa think Kopech is. They must think Vaughn is a sure thing despite no AAA but my guess is they will want another sure thing and that would depend on where Kopech is physically and mentally. If they are confident w Kopech , that would seem to be a match. I think the issue may be that it's f***ing crazy, with all due respect. I'm not worried about how big of a question mark Tampa thinks Kopech is. This would be a massive overpay. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Chappas Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 Would you rather be the Indians/Twins or White Sox. Personally I'd rather have a shot going into every season as opposed to once every 10 years. If the cubs don't make the Chapman and Quintana trades they are looking much better right now that what they did. They may not have the World Series but they have talent currently. I may be the exception though of wanting sustained success over a title. Once the title season is completed, it does nothing for me. I take the Dodgers 2010-2019 over the cubs same run even though the cubs won the title. I'd take the Indians and Twins 2000-2020 over the White Sox. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
35thstreetswarm Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 1 minute ago, Capital G said: That would be a terrible trade. How many times has Snell sniffed 200 innings? Exactly. This is a Sale-like return. If I trade Vaughn AND Kopech (and I don't want to), PLUS MORE, I better be getting a DeGrom caliber pitcher in return. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 1 minute ago, Harry Chappas said: Would you rather be the Indians/Twins or White Sox. Personally I'd rather have a shot going into every season as opposed to once every 10 years. If the cubs don't make the Chapman and Quintana trades they are looking much better right now that what they did. They may not have the World Series but they have talent currently. I may be the exception though of wanting sustained success over a title. Once the title season is completed, it does nothing for me. I take the Dodgers 2010-2019 over the cubs same run even though the cubs won the title. I'd take the Indians and Twins 2000-2020 over the White Sox. 100 percent in your camp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harold's Leg Lift Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 7 minutes ago, Harry Chappas said: Would you rather be the Indians/Twins or White Sox. Personally I'd rather have a shot going into every season as opposed to once every 10 years. If the cubs don't make the Chapman and Quintana trades they are looking much better right now that what they did. They may not have the World Series but they have talent currently. I may be the exception though of wanting sustained success over a title. Once the title season is completed, it does nothing for me. I take the Dodgers 2010-2019 over the cubs same run even though the cubs won the title. I'd take the Indians and Twins 2000-2020 over the White Sox. So you just want a bunch of participation trophies? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 25 minutes ago, 35thstreetswarm said: Man, Sox Twitter is full of arguments this week in response to that graphic from MLBtv suggesting Vaughn + Kopech + Stiever (yes, that's our #1 hitting prospect, #1 pitching prospect, PLUS another MLB-ready arm) for Snell...with the majority seeming to like it! Makes me happy to spend my time here with you folks. Are they throwing in Wander? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
35thstreetswarm Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 6 minutes ago, Harry Chappas said: Would you rather be the Indians/Twins or White Sox. Personally I'd rather have a shot going into every season as opposed to once every 10 years. If the cubs don't make the Chapman and Quintana trades they are looking much better right now that what they did. They may not have the World Series but they have talent currently. I may be the exception though of wanting sustained success over a title. Once the title season is completed, it does nothing for me. I take the Dodgers 2010-2019 over the cubs same run even though the cubs won the title. I'd take the Indians and Twins 2000-2020 over the White Sox. No way for me - flags fly forever. I take no joy looking back on seasons where my team got close but lost. I can summon pure joy from memories of the 2005 title run now and for the rest of my life. Now if we're talking about approaches going forward, I totally agree that sustained success is the way to go, rather than cashing in all chips for a short window. But that's because I think it's the best way to maximize the chance for a ring. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HOFHurt35 Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 There's an elite level SP out there that would cost you not a single one of your prized prospects, Bauer. Time to play with the big boys and hang out a 9 figure contract for once. Enough with this nonsense. 3 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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