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So let's talk about Quintana shall we


bmags

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With the food accounts circling a possible Q addition, that's something that has been received warmly by sox fans who remember his time here. I loved me some quintana, and was someone who would get angry when teams would not want to hand over their entire farm system for him.

That said, I am not that keen on him returning.

Let's get the easy stuff out first:

- Yes, it is likely he outperforms the extremely bad signing of gio gonzalez. Had we had a full year, gio would have been a big nothingburger.

And here is the good: Jose Quintana has pitched 175 innings for most of his career until he tried to cut fruit or whatever last year. For those that need it, I think the Ivan Nova comp for what he gives is legit. 

BUT:

- One thing that was interesting with Q and the sox was how his velocity continued to increase each year, but on the cubs it retreated, now settling in around 91.5 mph on average.

- The thing that made Q amazing was his home run suppression. During his sox years through 2016, his HR/FB rate was under 10%, it increased starting 2017 and stayed there during his time with the cubs.

- The cubs have generated more whiffs but I don't know if it made him a better pitcher. Quintana's stuff is not great, his command is. But cubs moved him to the recent trend of high fastballs to take advantage of his curve. It has made his curve much more effective, but as we pointed out earlier, that velo drop may matter here as his fastball is getting crushed. And I worry that when he's missing high, he's leaving the ball in the heart of the plate. His hard hit rate has increased recently, up to near 40%. His command keeps people from barreling him up too much, but he still gets crushed when he does leave it out. His hard hit % used to be above average, now it's below.

So he'll give you innings, he won't walk batters. That is still true. But I don't know that this doesn't keep getting worse.

Nice guy though!

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10 minutes ago, bmags said:

But we still have the uncertainty of Cease.

True. I guess they can role with Cease and if he isn't good, they can let him work in the minors and replace him with Kopech. Going withca better starter than Q is probably the way to go.

Edit: unless of course he loves Chicago and just wants to pitch for a contender in some capacity and is willing to sign as a long-reliever giving us more depth when we add someone else too.

Edited by manbearpuig
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12 minutes ago, DH in the NL said:

I’d rather remember what he was and what he got us in return than bring him back this stage in his career. 

I’d rather remember him for pitching well for the Sox, getting a great trade return and then bombing against the Dodgers in 2017.  With that said, he has far more left in the tank than Gio did last year.

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Just now, fathom said:

I’d rather remember him for pitching well for the Sox, getting a great trade return and then bombing against the Dodgers in 2017.  With that said, he has far more left in the tank than Gio did last year.

He absolutely does. My only point there was that was not my standard here. I would like us to get the best talent.

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11 minutes ago, bmags said:

He absolutely does. My only point there was that was not my standard here. I would like us to get the best talent.

Most white sox fans consume way too many of these.

 

member_berries_apology.jpg?resize=768,43

 

This is why we lust after former sox players who we forget have aged or even regressed a bit.  Its the same reason whenever a coaching spot opens up we get few threads on how this ex white sox player is a perfect fit even though they have never coached or shown a propensity for coaching.  I want the best possible pitcher to be aquired.  Not just a guy because I can member him in a white sox uniform.  Your post is spot on.  I like Quintana, I liked him as a whitesox pitcher when he was here. I just have a higher threshold for a team trying to win a world series than old trusty.  

Edited by southsideirish71
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Yeah, I really don't want a reunion with Q.  I would much rather acquire Richards or Kluber. 

There is comfort between the FO and Q. And vice versa. Maybe the sox aren't to worried if Q's era rises and plateaus near 5. They probably figure that the offense is good enough to overcome at least half of his starts. And he is good for 175 innings.  Again,  much rather go with the other guys. 

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I’m good with Quintana. I like the guy and I think he’ll be a rock solid 4/5.
 

But in totality, the Lynn trade + Q + Joc makes me sick. Just more of the same BS from the Sox right when they’re on the precipice of greatness they get in their own way. Just spend some fucking money on more than role players you cowards. And don’t trade long term assets for 1 year fixes. Hahn preached this for years, and now I’m supposed to like a deal when he does the opposite? 
 

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6 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

I’m good with Quintana. I like the guy and I think he’ll be a rock solid 4/5.
 

But in totality, the Lynn trade + Q + Joc makes me sick. Just more of the same BS from the Sox right when they’re on the precipice of greatness they get in their own way. Just spend some fucking money on more than role players you cowards. And don’t trade long term assets for 1 year fixes. Hahn preached this for years, and now I’m supposed to like a deal when he does the opposite? 
 

This is the part where an 84-year old, who won't spend money, owning the team worries me.

Edited by manbearpuig
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Why are we so enamored by Q? He pitched ok for us at one point and may have been a huge part of Sox rebuild when he was traded. He has served his purpose....

 

Why do we want to take a spot away from either one of MIke K, Lopez, Cease to give to Q?? You have a stud top 3 of rotation. We need MK, Lopez, and Cease to develop in 4/5 spot for us to be crazy good. Q should not be taking a spot away from any of the above mentioned 3

 

We need to get over the Q love.....someone of you are what you accuse Kenny Williams to be.....you fall in love with guys who are beyond their best years. 

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Posted this in another thread, but what if we signed one of Paxton/Kluber/Richards and then signed Q to be a long-reliever/spot starter (maybe he wants to pitch for a contender and doesn't want to leave Chicago?). Then your depth would be:

1. Giolito

2. Keuchel

3. Lynn

4. Paxton/Kluber/Richards

5. Cease

Kopech to come up when he is ready for Cease if he is struggling or to replace someone who is injured

Quintana long-relief/spot starter

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4 minutes ago, manbearpuig said:

Posted this in another thread, but what if we signed one of Paxton/Kluber/Richards and then signed Q to be a long-reliever/spot starter (maybe he wants to pitch for a contender and doesn't want to leave Chicago?). Then your depth would be:

1. Giolito

2. Keuchel

3. Lynn

4. Paxton/Kluber/Richards

5. Cease

Kopech to come up when he is ready for Cease if he is struggling or to replace someone who is injured

Quintana long-relief/spot starter

I think getting Lynn sets you up better take a big swing at a Paxton/Kluber/Richards because those guys have a more boom or bust risk to them.  Also Lynn is not expensive to where you can pay those guys the 1 year flier.

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1 minute ago, BFirebird said:

I think getting Lynn sets you up better take a big swing at a Paxton/Kluber/Richards because those guys have a more boom or bust risk to them.  Also Lynn is not expensive to where you can pay those guys the 1 year flier.

I agree, I am circling paxton, though his fb was awful last year. But still feel slightly more confident than Kluber. 

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I'm fine with Quintana as a 4/5 that will eventually give way to Kopech or Crochet. I could see the following happening with the pitching

Giolito
Keuchel*
Lynn
Quintana*
Cease

FA - Bradley/Hendriks/Colome/Hand
Bummer*
Heuer
Marshall
Foster
Fry*
Cordero
Lopez

with Crochet getting stretched out at AAA with Kopech. I see Stiever and Burdi as the first up in case of emergency

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