Indians will be no more

[Balta1701]

8 minutes ago, Perfect Vision said:

Actual Native Americans have never had a problem with any of these team names.  In fact, many have indicated that they feel honored by them.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/new-poll-finds-9-in-10-native-americans-arent-offended-by-redskins-name/2016/05/18/3ea11cfa-161a-11e6-924d-838753295f9a_story.html

This has nothing to do with appeasing Native Americans and everything to do with appeasing silly white liberals.

https://news.berkeley.edu/2020/02/04/native-mascots-survey/

Quote

Contrary to polls showing that relatively few Native Americans take offense at the Washington Redskins’ name, a new UC Berkeley study has found that at least half of more than 1,000 Native Americans surveyed are offended by the football team’s 87-year-old moniker and Native mascots in general.

https://www.washingtonian.com/2020/02/21/a-new-study-contradicts-a-washington-post-poll-about-how-native-americans-view-the-redskins-name/

Quote

One of the things that we know in science is that the questions you ask before and after influence the response. For example, if I asked you a really serious question about people who are dying in your community, and then I say, “By the way, are you offended by Native mascots?” you see how you can really influence people. People have requested to know what the items were and what order they were in. The second issue is that they called people. There’s very good data that shows when you do a call versus online, it changes peoples’ responses. When you call, people are more likely to give positive and socially desirable answers. And then they only allowed as answers to their question, “are you offended, are you indifferent, are you not bothered?” Native people telling a person they don’t know that they’’re “offended,” that’s a strong emotion.

We took the same question [the Post asked], but we gave participants a one-to-seven scale. So you can answer, “I’m somewhat offended, I’m moderately offended, I’m extremely offended.” We also didn’t call them, we allowed them to do it online. There’s no stranger or other person you’re trying to account for, [worrying] what they’re going to think about your response. Many Native scholars have reached out and asked for the [Post’s] data. Or, better yet, show us what your questionnaire was, what are all of the items that you asked? They won’t share it. None of that.

 

[Perfect Vision]

5 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

https://news.berkeley.edu/2020/02/04/native-mascots-survey/

https://www.washingtonian.com/2020/02/21/a-new-study-contradicts-a-washington-post-poll-about-how-native-americans-view-the-redskins-name/

 

UC Berkeley study.  LOL.  Everyone can always find some "study" that supports their position.  Especially from the whitest most liberal place in the world.

Point remains.  This movement to change team names is not and has never been led by Native Americans.

 

[Quin]

10 minutes ago, poppysox said:

Nail meet hammer.

Meet bigger hammer.

Here's a letter from the National Congress of American Indians.

Quote

July 6, 2020

VIA ELECTRONIC MAIL

Roger Goodell, Commissioner
National Football League
280 Park Avenue
New York, NY 10017

Dear Mr. Goodell,

The undersigned are Native American leaders and organizations that have worked tirelessly and substantively for over half a century to change the racist name of the Washington team. We appreciate the statements made in recent days regarding the league and the team’s intention to revisit the name, but we are deeply concerned that the process or decision to rename is being made in absence of any discussion with the concerned leadership.

Specifically, we, the undersigned, request that the NFL immediately:

1. Require the Washington NFL team (Owner- Dan Snyder) to immediately change the name R*dsk*ns, a dictionary defined racial slur for Native Peoples.
2. Require the Washington team to immediately cease the use of racialized Native American branding by eliminating any and all imagery of or evocative of Native American culture, traditions, and spirituality from their team franchise including the logo. This includes the use of Native terms, feathers, arrows, or monikers that assume the presence of Native American culture, as well as any characterization of any physical attributes.
3. Cease the use of the 2016 Washington Post Poll and the 2004 National Annenberg Election Survey which have been repeatedly used by the franchise and supporters to rationalize the use of the racist r-word name. These surveys were not academically vetted and were called unethical and inaccurate by the Native American Journalist Association as well as deemed damaging by other prominent organizations that represent Native Peoples. The NFL team must be held accountable to the various research studies conducted by scientists and scholars which find stereotypical images, names and the like are harmful to Native youth and the continued progress of the wellbeing of Native Peoples.
4. Cease the use of the offensive, racial slur name “R*dsk*ns” immediately, and encourage journalists, writers and reporters to use the term in print only by using asterisks “R*dsk*ns” and to refer to the term verbally as the “r-word”.
5. Ban all use of Native imagery, names, slur names, redface, appropriation of Native culture and spiritually as well as violence toward Native Peoples from the League.
6. Apply the NFL’s “zero tolerance” for on-field use of racial and homophobic slurs to all races and ethnic groups, especially Native Peoples.
7. Complete a full rebranding of the Washington team name, logo, mascot, and color scheme, to ensure that continuing harm is not perpetuated by anyone.

Finally, we note that the above items are non-negotiable and not subject to consultation or dialogue “processes”, however, we expect the NFL to engage in a robust, meaningful reconciliation process with Native American movement leaders, tribes, and organizations to repair the decades of emotional violence and other serious harms this racist team name has caused to Native Peoples.

Link to letter with signees, including additional context.

[Quin]

1 minute ago, Perfect Vision said:

UC Berkeley study.  LOL.  Everyone can always find some "study" that supports their position.  Especially from the whitest most liberal place in the world.

Point remains.  This movement to change team names is not and has never been led by Native Americans.

 

 

1 minute ago, Quin said:

Meet bigger hammer.

Here's a letter from the National Congress of American Indians.

Link to letter with signees, including additional context.

Just in case you ignore this, I want to direct you to this.

[Vulture]

20 minutes ago, poppysox said:

Nail meet hammer.

More like heel meet horse shit

[Balta1701]

7 minutes ago, Perfect Vision said:

UC Berkeley study.  LOL.  Everyone can always find some "study" that supports their position.  Especially from the whitest most liberal place in the world.

Point remains.  This movement to change team names is not and has never been led by Native Americans.

 

Hmph. “The only poll that can possibly count is the one that confirms my bias and if you present any other polls that disagree I will not evaluate them at all”.

 

[Saufley]

How about the Cleveland Czechs? I'd back that name change.

[RibbieRubarb]

Am I the only one going to say "Steamers"??

Fine...I'll say it.

STEAMERS.

 

[Quin]

13 hours ago, southsider2k5 said:

Cleveland Major League Team would be perfect. 

Circling back to this: The Cleveland Wild Things.

It's both terrible and wonderful at the same time.

[southsider2k5]

13 hours ago, Yearnin' for Yermin said:

The Cleveland Politically Correct Baseball Team

So let me put it this way, if The Cleveland N-words was an option, you'd be in favor of it/  How about the Cleveland Burning Crosses or Holocausts?

[fathom]

2 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

So let me put it this way, if The Cleveland N-words was an option, you'd be in favor of it/  How about the Cleveland Burning Crosses or Holocausts?

How about Cleveland United Nations Team?  Have fun with that ESPN

Edited December 14, 2020 by fathom

[ron883]

22 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

So let me put it this way, if The Cleveland N-words was an option, you'd be in favor of it/  How about the Cleveland Burning Crosses or Holocausts?

Lol, talk about a massive stretch

[southsider2k5]

2 minutes ago, Yearnin' for Yermin said:

Lol, talk about a massive stretch

Why though?  

[Bob Sacamano]

Cleveland Spiders (old name), Cleveland Tribe (not offensive, can stick with the C logo), Cleveland Major League Team (Major League reference) have my votes. 

[ChiSox1917]

1 hour ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Tell me why the blackhawks are named the Blackhawks since you've become so educated on native Americans due that lol 

You ever think maybe we should be taught about what really happened to natives in school instead of, you know, through professional sports caricatures?

Named after the first owners ww1 regiment that was named after chief black hawk.

not sure what quality of education you received but i learned about the trail of tears, indian wars, and how they were ravaged by exposure to diseases they had no immunity to when i was in school. 

Edited December 14, 2020 by ChiSox1917

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

59 minutes ago, Perfect Vision said:

Actual Native Americans have never had a problem with any of these team names.  In fact, many have indicated that they feel honored by them.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/new-poll-finds-9-in-10-native-americans-arent-offended-by-redskins-name/2016/05/18/3ea11cfa-161a-11e6-924d-838753295f9a_story.html

This has nothing to do with appeasing Native Americans and everything to do with appeasing silly white liberals.

LOL this is kind of like when people would cite BP studies to show that oil use wasn't causing global warming. 

This is my favorite line from the article you linked:

"The results — immediately celebrated by team owner Daniel Snyder and denounced by prominent Native American leaders"

Again, if it offends just one out of every ten natives, that's one too many for a stupid team name. I honestly don't understand why this is difficult to understand. 

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

7 minutes ago, ChiSox1917 said:

Named after the first owners ww1 regiment that was named after chief black hawk.

not sure what quality of education you received but i learned about the trail of tears, indian wars, and how they were ravaged by exposure to diseases they had no immunity to when i was in school. 

If you think you learned a non-white washed Native American history then I really can't help you. I can link you some books if you'd like to read about real history - not just the few incidents we felt the need to teach. For example, did you know we are occupying vast land that we agreed to give up in many agreements? That we have robbed and pillaged native Communities within the last 100 years?

Why do you care what the Cleveland baseball team is named? Why is it so difficult for people like you to have some respect for people who disagree with you and feel strongly about something that is personal to them but not to you? It's truly baffling. 

Oh, and what tribe was Chief Black Hawk a part of? I'm sure you'll look it up now, but the point remains.

Edited December 14, 2020 by Look at Ray Ray Run

[Rowand44]

I say go with the Cleveland Football Team.  Just cause.

[StrangeSox]

12 hours ago, Yearnin' for Yermin said:

Should the Blackhawks and fighting irish go?

The Fighting Irish got their name from when a bunch of ND students went hog wild on the Klan, so no

[Texsox]

14 hours ago, Yearnin' for Yermin said:

PC is ruining this country! Smh

They should be the Cleveland Catholics. Have a priest as a mascot. During big moments have him come out with incense and Latin chants. Maybe recreate the crusades. Can you imagine him giving last rites during the 9th inning! That would be so awesome. Pope races during the 7th inning stretch. He could offer communion before the closer comes in. 

Dancing nuns as cheerleaders. 

"Terry Francona is taking Shane Beiber to the confessional after that shot to center . . ."
 

[ChiSox1917]

45 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

Hmph. “The only poll that can possibly count is the one that confirms my bias and if you present any other polls that disagree I will not evaluate them at all”.

 

Thats exactly what youre doing also. Rather than acknowledging one studies results you just bring up another without any context or explanation. Just heres another study that contradicts yours. It comes off as you being dismissive of the study you dont like. 
 

[Stinky Stanky]

13 hours ago, Yearnin' for Yermin said:

Should the Blackhawks and fighting irish go?

One of them should.  Has this thread outlived its usefulness?

Edited December 14, 2020 by Stinky Stanky

[he gone.]

10 hours ago, caulfield12 said:

 

We’re not talking about the Guardians, the Fighting Walleyes, the Blue or Green Sox, the Midges, the Spiders or the Cleveland Baseball Team. Any connection to the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame – Rocks, Rock Stars, North Coast Rockers – has been disallowed as well.

We’re not even talking about jewels such as the Cleveland Rock-a-Fellers. Think about that, one name covers the Rock Hall, Hall of Famer Bob Feller and former Cleveland millionaire John D. Rockefeller. That took some doing, but that ground has been turned over more than once.

City on the lake: Belters (after the Rust Belt and the home runs they hopefully hit, and not from The Expanse/Sci-Fi Network), Centrals (best location in the nation), Rapids (as in RTA), Municipals and Native Sons (not to be confused with James Baldwin novel).

 

https://www.cleveland.com/tribe/2020/10/some-new-suggestions-to-rename-the-cleveland-indians-the-week-in-baseball.html

18 different categories of names listed, majority are pretty darned awful

 

All team names sound stupid at first. 

The Detroit Lions? Are there a lot of Lions in Detroit?

The Chicago White Sox? THat's like calling the Indians the Blue Pants. 

Chicago Bulls? Yes, all the Bulls running around the Midwest. 

It's grown men throwing, kicking, hitting, a ball for fake points in almost all sports. It's all silly

[Texsox]

So the owner of the company has a name that has big fans and big detractors. If he rebrands he may sell more merchandise. Will he lose any fans? I doubt it. Seems like a nice win for the owners. 

[ScootsMcGoots]

4 minutes ago, BrianAnderson said:

All team names sound stupid at first. 

The Detroit Lions? Are there a lot of Lions in Detroit?

The Chicago White Sox? THat's like calling the Indians the Blue Pants. 

Chicago Bulls? Yes, all the Bulls running around the Midwest. 

It's grown men throwing, kicking, hitting, a ball for fake points in almost all sports. It's all silly

If you take all bias out of it, The White Sox is pretty stupid lmao. Only thing cool about it is the logo and the colors.