MiddleCoastBias Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 Just now, Balta1701 said: Especially if they are expecting Kopech to start at AAA for service time manipulation. I assume starter #5 right now has to be Lopez right? Without making a move, I think they still tell Lopez that he's in the pen and work on getting him into the mindset of a being a reliever. For someone that seems to struggle with focus, having him wonder if he's starting or relieving this week wouldn't seem to help him. Sit him down and focus on preparing to pitch one inning at a time. My guess is that they'll mentally pencil Stiever in at #5 on January 18th with the intention that he'll be bumped by a vet signing before spring training. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 4 minutes ago, Y2Jimmy0 said: It's not service time manipulation. It doesn't make any sense to start him in the majors on an innings limit. Fine it's because he's on an innings limit nudge nudge wink wink I promise not to testify before an arbitrator when it just so happens that it also limits his service time. Yes there's other motives that play a role, but the fact that it happens to save the org a year of control...yeah that's as high as any. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poppysox Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 22 minutes ago, bmags said: Right I’m in favor of another starter. Without one, we are playing with fire. If we need one anyway...let's get Bauer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2Jimmy0 Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 1 minute ago, Balta1701 said: Fine it's because he's on an innings limit nudge nudge wink wink I promise not to testify before an arbitrator when it just so happens that it also limits his service time. Yes there's other motives that play a role, but the fact that it happens to save the org a year of control...yeah that's as high as any. I mean usually I would agree with you in this case but not on Kopech or Vaughn this year. Starting Kopech with the big league club would be stupid. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 2 minutes ago, Balta1701 said: Fine it's because he's on an innings limit nudge nudge wink wink I promise not to testify before an arbitrator when it just so happens that it also limits his service time. Yes there's other motives that play a role, but the fact that it happens to save the org a year of control...yeah that's as high as any. Let's take service time out of the equation for a moment. Given the last pitch Kopech threw in competitive play was September 5, 2018 and has a total of 14.1 IP, along with the Sox trying to compete for a World Series this season....I still think he starts in AAA taking out any service time "manipulation" It's just the right move given where he is in his comeback attempt. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 Just now, Tony said: Let's take service time out of the equation for a moment. Given the last pitch Kopech threw in competitive play was September 5, 2018 and has a total of 14.1 IP, along with the Sox trying to compete for a World Series this season....I still think he starts in AAA taking out any service time "manipulation" It's just the right move given where he is in his comeback attempt. If it wasn't for that, I'd say "Let's see how he looks in spring training, and figure things out when we have more up to date information". Hell, AAA might not even exist for all we know. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2Jimmy0 Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 1 minute ago, Balta1701 said: If it wasn't for that, I'd say "Let's see how he looks in spring training, and figure things out when we have more up to date information". Hell, AAA might not even exist for all we know. He's on an innings limit though. So starting him with the big league club, using the 26 man roster spot and shutting him down early makes no sense. If there was an unlimited roster, I might agree with you. There isn't though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 17 minutes ago, Tony said: We need to teach these young pups the history of Soxtalk... People don't know trolling and shit posting until they know about VictoryMC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 9 minutes ago, Quin said: People don't know trolling and shit posting until they know about VictoryMC. Was that the dude who lied about having 49ers season tickets? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thxfrthmmrs Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 1 minute ago, Chicago White Sox said: Was that the dude who lied about having 49ers season tickets? SoxObama. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 Just now, thxfrthmmrs said: SoxObama. Lol...that was him! Didn’t he somehow get caught lying about it too? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thxfrthmmrs Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 6 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said: Lol...that was him! Didn’t he somehow get caught lying about it too? He definitely caught lying several times, I think that was it, and also that he had sources, IIRC. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 51 minutes ago, Y2Jimmy0 said: I mean usually I would agree with you in this case but not on Kopech or Vaughn this year. Starting Kopech with the big league club would be stupid. Yes. He hasn't pitched in real games in 2 1/2 years. A contending team does not want him to get back into the routine of starting at thr MLB level. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox59 Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 Don't really care to read the 12 pages - is there anything to this? Cruz rumbling still the thought that the first page seemed to think? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tray Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 There are always options for a fifth starter. It's no big deal for a club that should blow out a lot of opposing 4 and 5 starters. Stand pat. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joejoesox Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 thread derailed ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted January 18, 2021 Author Share Posted January 18, 2021 11 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said: Don't really care to read the 12 pages - is there anything to this? Cruz rumbling still the thought that the first page seemed to think? Shockingly quiet today Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 1 hour ago, Balta1701 said: If it wasn't for that, I'd say "Let's see how he looks in spring training, and figure things out when we have more up to date information". Hell, AAA might not even exist for all we know. That's not unreasonable, but as Jimmy mentioned with his assumed innings limit, I'd like them to come up with a plan for IP's down in AAA, and if all goes right, they have an idea of when he can arrive back with the ML club. Honestly, there isn't a "right" answer in this situation as it's fairly unique and a bunch of variables at play. Kopech pitching well and looking strong will take care of a lot of the concerns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 1 hour ago, Tony said: Let's take service time out of the equation for a moment. Given the last pitch Kopech threw in competitive play was September 5, 2018 and has a total of 14.1 IP, along with the Sox trying to compete for a World Series this season....I still think he starts in AAA taking out any service time "manipulation" It's just the right move given where he is in his comeback attempt. Yeah, especially because of how wild Kopech was early in 2018 before he got injured. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YourWhatHurts Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 18 minutes ago, tray said: There are always options for a fifth starter. It's no big deal for a club that should blow out a lot of opposing 4 and 5 starters. Stand pat. It's much smarter to hold onto the extra money and wait for a difference-making SP to become available before the trade deadline than it is to spend all of the resources pre-season on a guy who might only be worth another 1-2 extra wins over in-house and MiLB contract options between the beginning of the season and the trade deadline. At the deadline that available $$ can go much further when it's only paying part of a contract, and another trading team may be willing to pick up the rest. OTOH if Tanaka will take 1 year $15M then the Sox should do that and forget the idea of a both an extra bat to block Vaughn and a back-end SP. The Sox really don't need any special reason to start Vaughn in AA given the fact that he has never played above A ball, and I would guess a big part of the interest in another bat is having a stronger excuse for blocking Vaughn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mqr Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 I thought it would have been pretty messed up to start Kopech in the minors 2020. Not so much in 2021 though. The guy hasn’t thrown a competitive pitch in 2 years 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beast Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 So this was a rumor ginned up about Nelson Cruz and now we are talking about pitching? Or is there a rumor about pitching too? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eminor3rd Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 16 hours ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said: I am actually very sympathetic to your post. I too think pitching is the top priority over anything else. However the Sox could ve decided that with the best lineup in baseball and a top BP that it can carry them pretty far this year in a year that FA pitching is a crapshoot. Cruz would be a bridge to Vaughn just as Lynn is a bridge to Cease, Kopech and other youngster who need another year to develop . I gave up on the hashtags you used a while ago thinking it's just to difficult to do for a franchise that has never done it and an owner who doesn't seem to care about it very much. Of course it may not be about Cruz at all . My thing is, based on everything I've read, Vaughn is ready to "take his lumps" to make the transition, and I think the best time to have an important player go through that is when the offense is already amazing and doesn't need to put pressure on him to produce. Also, with Yermin/Collins are almost aging out of being prospects without ever being given a shot -- they are the perfect dup to sink or swim as the 30-60 day service time bridge they need to find for Vaughn anyway. And then again with such an obvious need to spend the money on in SP, idk, it just seems really obvious that splurging on a veteran rental DH is almost literally the last thing the roster needs. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eminor3rd Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 9 minutes ago, YourWhatHurts said: It's much smarter to hold onto the extra money and wait for a difference-making SP to become available before the trade deadline than it is to spend all of the resources pre-season on a guy who might only be worth another 1-2 extra wins over in-house and MiLB contract options between the beginning of the season and the trade deadline. At the deadline that available $$ can go much further when it's only paying part of a contract, and another trading team may be willing to pick up the rest. OTOH if Tanaka will take 1 year $15M then the Sox should do that and forget the idea of a both an extra bat to block Vaughn and a back-end SP. The Sox really don't need any special reason to start Vaughn in AA given the fact that he has never played above A ball, and I would guess a big part of the interest in another bat is having a stronger excuse for blocking Vaughn. Tanaka or similar @ 1/$15mm or similar is PRECISELY what this team needs. In the current era/meta, good teams simply do not ever find success when they have exactly 5 SPs that need to work out all year. The fact that our back-end is promising but raw prospects is perfect. There will be plenty of opportunities for them to pitch their way into a spot, but they won't be REQUIRED to do so for the team to succeed. They should be deployed as depth with upside, the BEST kind of depth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiddleCoastBias Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 3 minutes ago, Eminor3rd said: Tanaka or similar @ 1/$15mm or similar is PRECISELY what this team needs. In the current era/meta, good teams simply do not ever find success when they have exactly 5 SPs that need to work out all year. The fact that our back-end is promising but raw prospects is perfect. There will be plenty of opportunities for them to pitch their way into a spot, but they won't be REQUIRED to do so for the team to succeed. They should be deployed as depth with upside, the BEST kind of depth. Tanaka may be what we need, but he ain't happenin'. Rumors are that he's considering going back to Japan on a 4-year deal. If he's staying here, it's to re-sign with the Yankees. He's 32. He doesn't want a 1-year deal from a new club that he doesn't know if he's ultimately looking to go back to Japan eventually. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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