the old Corbin Burnes thread, we have a new Burnes thread

[EloyJenkins]

This was always a far fetched rumor. But I am glad that some are finally defending Kopech. He WILL BE the Sox #2 starter by 2022. Unless it's third because...Bauer. 

[bmags]

We like, literally saw 60 major league innings of Burnes dominating MLB hitters en route to a cy young finish last year.

We still don't know if Kopech can command his pitches or if his secondary stuff will locate well enough to be effective. He had like a month of showing that 2 years ago in AAA.

And the response will be "he threw 101 so he's back". 

Back to what? He was never finished. He's got a great fastball. I hope it translates. It may very well not, no matter how alpha he is.

[bmags]

2 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

Has that been anything more than speculated about?

"Multiple sources told The Athletic that Kopech has not been deemed a high-risk individual for the COVID-19 pandemic and will thus not receive salary nor accrue service time for the 2020 season. When he reports to spring training in 2021, he will do so with one season and 41 days to his name, at least five years away from free agency."

"Sources indicate that an abbreviated three-week ramp-up period cast doubt on Kopech’s ability to be properly ready for the season. That lingering question and the uncertainty about his role in an abbreviated 60-game campaign factored into his decision to pass up what would’ve been his first season back from Tommy John surgery.

Of course, there’s also a deadly pandemic going on, and while Kopech himself is not medically high-risk, it does not make him immune from larger family health concerns when weighing whether to commit to a plan of persistent travel as COVID-19 cases continue to climb in most states.

It’s a decision that’s focused on the long-term for Kopech, though it comes at a time when the White Sox are compelling in the short-term for the first time in years. It’s been easy to imagine Kopech being stretched across the schedule as a multi-inning super-reliever helping the club edge ahead in a sprint to win the AL Central. Even without a clear role, Kopech is Kopech and he could help any team in any fashion."

https://theathletic.com/1922278/2020/07/10/why-is-white-sox-prospect-michael-kopech-sitting-out-the-2020-season/

[Jerksticks]

7 minutes ago, Wisebri224 said:

In all seriousness I guess I go with this too.  If we get a second half out of alpha Kopech and Katz can do ANYTHING with Cease, we are set and spent nothing.  If either is wrong, we probably take another step forward and lose in the LCS.  Dancing with the people you drafted for this very reason.  Just go get the vet you hope to get 60-70 innings out of, find your LH/Utility bat, and let's get to it.  Right?

Man I think so.  People forget that we are going to score about 2000 runs

[YourWhatHurts]

15 minutes ago, bmags said:

We like, literally saw 60 major league innings of Burnes dominating MLB hitters en route to a cy young finish last year.

We still don't know if Kopech can command his pitches or if his secondary stuff will locate well enough to be effective. He had like a month of showing that 2 years ago in AAA.

And the response will be "he threw 101 so he's back". 

Back to what? He was never finished. He's got a great fastball. I hope it translates. It may very well not, no matter how alpha he is.

And if it does translate, he's better than Burnes.  A lot better than Burnes.

[YourWhatHurts]

13 minutes ago, bmags said:

"Multiple sources told The Athletic that Kopech has not been deemed a high-risk individual for the COVID-19 pandemic and will thus not receive salary nor accrue service time for the 2020 season. When he reports to spring training in 2021, he will do so with one season and 41 days to his name, at least five years away from free agency."

"Sources indicate that an abbreviated three-week ramp-up period cast doubt on Kopech’s ability to be properly ready for the season. That lingering question and the uncertainty about his role in an abbreviated 60-game campaign factored into his decision to pass up what would’ve been his first season back from Tommy John surgery.

Of course, there’s also a deadly pandemic going on, and while Kopech himself is not medically high-risk, it does not make him immune from larger family health concerns when weighing whether to commit to a plan of persistent travel as COVID-19 cases continue to climb in most states.

It’s a decision that’s focused on the long-term for Kopech, though it comes at a time when the White Sox are compelling in the short-term for the first time in years. It’s been easy to imagine Kopech being stretched across the schedule as a multi-inning super-reliever helping the club edge ahead in a sprint to win the AL Central. Even without a clear role, Kopech is Kopech and he could help any team in any fashion."

https://theathletic.com/1922278/2020/07/10/why-is-white-sox-prospect-michael-kopech-sitting-out-the-2020-season/

Sounds like a thoughtful guy.

Hmm, I wonder if Melissa Rivers is the building and ready to spin this into a big negative?

[southsider2k5]

Just now, bmags said:

We like, literally saw 60 major league innings of Burnes dominating MLB hitters en route to a cy young finish last year.

We still don't know if Kopech can command his pitches or if his secondary stuff will locate well enough to be effective. He had like a month of showing that 2 years ago in AAA.

And the response will be "he threw 101 so he's back". 

Back to what? He was never finished. He's got a great fastball. I hope it translates. It may very well not, no matter how alpha he is.

See that is the thing.  Literally no one is penciling in Michael Kopech for 200 innings.  The discussion has always been him working back in slowly to work him through an artificial innings cap.

[bmags]

1 minute ago, southsider2k5 said:

See that is the thing.  Literally no one is penciling in Michael Kopech for 200 innings.  The discussion has always been him working back in slowly to work him through an artificial innings cap.

I'm not talking about innings either, I'm talking about effectiveness.

[southsider2k5]

2 minutes ago, bmags said:

I'm not talking about innings either, I'm talking about effectiveness.

The Sox are being configured to not require Kopech's presence until he is ready to go, or is able to be called upon at a later point.  The team recognizes that even if his stuff is ready to go from April 1, that his historic conditioning won't allow him to go a full season.  Spending a ton of assets on another guy in a similar boat, but then depending on him would be 180 degrees of contradictory to that.

[Jimmy25t]

I think Sox would be smart to not rush to judgement on any covid season results good or bad, burnes had a very good season last year but was so awful in 19 he lost his starting job after 4 starts 17 hrs in 49 innings pitched, also 20 season was all with NL and AL central not the greatest offenses

[yesterday333]

Man why would we trade Kopech at his lowest value. That’s just dumb. I believe it won’t be any lower than it is now.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

3 minutes ago, bmags said:

We like, literally saw 60 major league innings of Burnes dominating MLB hitters en route to a cy young finish last year.

We still don't know if Kopech can command his pitches or if his secondary stuff will locate well enough to be effective. He had like a month of showing that 2 years ago in AAA.

And the response will be "he threw 101 so he's back". 

Back to what? He was never finished. He's got a great fastball. I hope it translates. It may very well not, no matter how alpha he is.

If I go on MLB .com the 2020 ranking of Kopech in the top 100 prospects was 18. He had 3 other RHP ahead of him. Flash forward to a week ago an I see an article on MLB.com about the Top 10 RHP pitching prospects. Kopech wasn't on the list so that means now 9 RHP prospects are ahead of him at the least. There may be more depending how far down he has slid. The MLB Top 100 prospects for 2021 hasn't come out .

How that is all justified just because he sat out 2020, I guess ,is based on all the time not pitching but it doesn't seem like opting out should hurt his rank as much as it appears.

Whoever the Sox give up in a completed Burnes trade is going to hurt. How much pain depends on your love for whoever is traded. I can live with Crochet being traded but prefer Cease and Kopech be here to pitch in 2021 as depth and possible replacements for Lynn and Keuchel .If we can grab Burnes for lets say Crochet and Vaughn  then by next year we could be looking at Giolito, Burnes, Keuchel, Cease, Kopech. I can live with Vaughn being traded because Eloy and Robert haven't had a career year yet. Many think Moncada can also be very productive in his prime . 2019 showed his potential but I'd hate to think that is his career year. In other words the lineup can absorb the loss of Vaughn

All these "would be" trades suggestions of Madrigal ,Stiever, Kelley etc. probably don't get Burnes . Either accept the pain involved with getting Burnes or just decide he isn't worth the pain and deal with the 2nd half of the window losing Giolito, Keuchel, Lynn next year, and pray that we get a miracle. Cease ,Kopech , Crochet, Stiever all become big SP stars, we extend Lynn till he's 36 , and we extend Giolito.

If you think all that will happen or Reinsdorf or whoever is in charge ponies up for some top end FA starting pitcher then good luck to you. I'm sorry but take your best shots in 21,22,23 .

 

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

42 minutes ago, bmags said:

We talking about the guy that opted out for reasons not to do with covid last year?

 

36 minutes ago, bmags said:

"Multiple sources told The Athletic that Kopech has not been deemed a high-risk individual for the COVID-19 pandemic and will thus not receive salary nor accrue service time for the 2020 season. When he reports to spring training in 2021, he will do so with one season and 41 days to his name, at least five years away from free agency."

"Sources indicate that an abbreviated three-week ramp-up period cast doubt on Kopech’s ability to be properly ready for the season. That lingering question and the uncertainty about his role in an abbreviated 60-game campaign factored into his decision to pass up what would’ve been his first season back from Tommy John surgery.

Of course, there’s also a deadly pandemic going on, and while Kopech himself is not medically high-risk, it does not make him immune from larger family health concerns when weighing whether to commit to a plan of persistent travel as COVID-19 cases continue to climb in most states.

It’s a decision that’s focused on the long-term for Kopech, though it comes at a time when the White Sox are compelling in the short-term for the first time in years. It’s been easy to imagine Kopech being stretched across the schedule as a multi-inning super-reliever helping the club edge ahead in a sprint to win the AL Central. Even without a clear role, Kopech is Kopech and he could help any team in any fashion."

https://theathletic.com/1922278/2020/07/10/why-is-white-sox-prospect-michael-kopech-sitting-out-the-2020-season/

I can't quite reconcile your 1st post  with your 2nd especially this part:

Of course, there’s also a deadly pandemic going on, and while Kopech himself is not medically high-risk, it does not make him immune from larger family health concerns when weighing whether to commit to a plan of persistent travel as COVID-19 cases continue to climb in most states.

Seems to me it had plenty to do with Covid. If Covid isn't around you have the minor leagues, you have some type of plan with a defined role, you have a full season and you don't have to travel state to state with a bunch of guys who may or may not follow Covid Protocols.

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

11 minutes ago, yesterday333 said:

Man why would we trade Kopech at his lowest value. That’s just dumb. I believe it won’t be any lower than it is now.

It’s like some here want to trade Kopech at his lowest value and trade for Burnes at his highest. That’s not a great way of building sustained success. I’m sure some will argue that Kopech’s value COULD go lower yet still and Burnes’ value COULD go higher but IMO it’s more likely that Kopech’s value rises from here while Burnes’ falls.

[maloney.adam]

I didn’t know where to put this.

[iWiN4PreP]

Trying to keep up with you guys...

... Hoping that this rumor still has steam and maybe we see it happen tonight?

Anyway..

1) You do NOT trade Kopech. That's ridiculous. Someone already mentioned it, but that serves very little purpose -- acquire a SP only to trade a similar one. 

2) I have no problem trading Vaughn for a Burnes type. Gotta think the Brewers are much more interested in Vaughn than Madrigal. We have Eloy at DH for the future and Abreu at 1b for some time. Vaughn doesn't have a spot on this team. Trade him.

3) I'd keep Madrigal. Unless the Brewers are massively overvaluing Madrigal, I see no reason to trade him.

I'd do Vaughn + Stevier + lotto tickets or something?

 

[iWiN4PreP]

1 minute ago, maloney.adam said:

I didn’t know where to put this.

Twins literally just signed JA Happ. Good call out here. 

[Blackout Friday]

1 minute ago, maloney.adam said:

I didn’t know where to put this.

Twins probably going to sign rosenthal or some other good rp. 
 

but, really....nothing he said can’t be pieced together by anyone who follows the game closely. 

[Whisox05]

3 minutes ago, maloney.adam said:

I didn’t know where to put this.

Well they got JA happ

[Blackout Friday]

Just now, Blackout Friday said:

Twins probably going to sign rosenthal or some other good rp. 
 

but, really....nothing he said can’t be pieced together by anyone who follows the game closely. 

Or happ lol

[Whisox05]

Another lefty for sox to lit up

[kleedawg]

Just now, aeichhor said:

Well they got JA happ

Awesome! They need to sign more LHP's,,,yummers

[bmags]

5 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

 

I can't quite reconcile your 1st post  with your 2nd especially this part:

Of course, there’s also a deadly pandemic going on, and while Kopech himself is not medically high-risk, it does not make him immune from larger family health concerns when weighing whether to commit to a plan of persistent travel as COVID-19 cases continue to climb in most states.

Seems to me it had plenty to do with Covid. If Covid isn't around you have the minor leagues, you have some type of plan with a defined role, you have a full season and you don't have to travel state to state with a bunch of guys who may or may not follow Covid Protocols.

it doesn't make him immune, but that was also Fegan giving benefit of the doubt, and the more expliciti reason was concern about his role and getting yanked around in his first season back. Is that "covid related" because covid caused the season to be shortened and no minors? I think that's like the curb your enthusiasm episode where the pastor talks about how his son died on 9/11 but it was just in a car crash on the same day. If Kopech's decision was based off of health, everyone would have been more than willing to push that off the record. But they didn't.

[SoCalChiSox]

I will be royally pissed if Kopech is moved on this trade. Harold seemed to be implying he would. I sure hope not. 

Man Q was available for real cheap without destroying what is needed for the second part of the window. This is so dumb. Don't trade Kopech or Vaughn or Crochet 

[SonofaRoache]

2 minutes ago, kleedawg said:

Awesome! They need to sign more LHP's,,,yummers