the old Corbin Burnes thread, we have a new Burnes thread

[Ben Waffleson]

2 minutes ago, HOFHurt35 said:

This is why if the Sox were willing to get rid of Vaughn, Blake Snell would have have been the guy to go after using Vaughn as the lead piece.  

100% agreed,

[Bob Sacamano]

4 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

Who we trade Vaughn for is an important consideration for sure, but with who we have on the major league roster, and the kids on the way, 1B/DH is the last place I am worried about.  We are loaded with bats with no place to play.

There's also always a lot of options in free agency every year that you could easily fill 1B with. It's definitely the least concerning position to have a hole at.

Edited January 21, 2021 by manbearpuig

[bmags]

I think Chris Archer would be a good pickup.

https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/savant-player/chris-archer-502042?stats=statcast-r-pitching-mlb

He opted out last year, where he missed an opportunity to work with new pitching coach in Pitt where Musgrove saw some success when it clicked.

Look at this quote from February of last year:

Quote

He has also quickly connected with new pitching coach Oscar Marin during the early days of spring training.

“I went to just being myself,” Archer said. “I went back to the windup. I went back to predominantly forcing fastballs and sliders. My changeup’s come a long way, too. I’m just getting back to myself and pitching like me. The new staff has been great about encouraging that.”

https://pittsburgh.cbslocal.com/2020/02/14/pirates-pitcher-chris-archer-is-ready-for-new-season/

In his 4 IP in spring training last year, he had 2 IP, 4 ks, 1 hit, 0 runs. Hardly something to hang your hat on, but still it's something.

In Pitt, Searage forced the sinker into his rotation and a curve. Neither were good, and it seemed like they made his slider less effective. His changeup went from excellent sink to below average.

Get him back to being a 3-pitch pitcher and see what he can do.

[Bob Sacamano]

2 minutes ago, bmags said:

I think Chris Archer would be a good pickup.

https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/savant-player/chris-archer-502042?stats=statcast-r-pitching-mlb

He opted out last year, where he missed an opportunity to work with new pitching coach in Pitt where Musgrove saw some success when it clicked.

Look at this quote from February of last year:

https://pittsburgh.cbslocal.com/2020/02/14/pirates-pitcher-chris-archer-is-ready-for-new-season/

In his 4 IP in spring training last year, he had 2 IP, 4 ks, 1 hit, 0 runs. Hardly something to hang your hat on, but still it's something.

In Pitt, Searage forced the sinker into his rotation and a curve. Neither were good, and it seemed like they made his slider less effective. His changeup went from excellent sink to below average.

Get him back to being a 3-pitch pitcher and see what he can do.

I'm good with taking a chance on him too. Leaning more towards options like this than trading away 3-5 prospects right now.

Edited January 21, 2021 by manbearpuig

[soxfaninfl]

At some point we do need to realistic about Vaughn. I like Vaughn and, like many, I was really excited about him last spring but is there really a place for him on this team? I guess the vision is to use him as a DH and part-time fill for Abreu and he is a RH power bat in a lineup full of them. Abreu has shown no sign of decline and, yes, six years is a long time but if you can use him as a chip to bring in a pitcher like Burnes, you have to consider it, don't you??? I guess I just look at the market even now. Much easier to get a DH/1B than a starting pitcher.

 

[turnin' two]

3 minutes ago, bmags said:

I think Chris Archer would be a good pickup.

https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/savant-player/chris-archer-502042?stats=statcast-r-pitching-mlb

He opted out last year, where he missed an opportunity to work with new pitching coach in Pitt where Musgrove saw some success when it clicked.

Look at this quote from February of last year:

https://pittsburgh.cbslocal.com/2020/02/14/pirates-pitcher-chris-archer-is-ready-for-new-season/

In his 4 IP in spring training last year, he had 2 IP, 4 ks, 1 hit, 0 runs. Hardly something to hang your hat on, but still it's something.

In Pitt, Searage forced the sinker into his rotation and a curve. Neither were good, and it seemed like they made his slider less effective. His changeup went from excellent sink to below average.

Get him back to being a 3-pitch pitcher and see what he can do.

I'd be in on Archer too.  I think I'd go Tanaka (ha), Paxton, then Archer/Leake on my wish list.  I like Richards a lot to be honest, but he is just so risky.  I'd be good with him for sure, but I think I'd personally prioritize other guys.

[bmags]

1 minute ago, turnin' two said:

I'd be in on Archer too.  I think I'd go Tanaka (ha), Paxton, then Archer/Leake on my wish list.  I like Richards a lot to be honest, but he is just so risky.  I'd be good with him for sure, but I think I'd personally prioritize other guys.

I don't really care if they DO go Richards, but I do think part of it may be compatibility with Katz who would have seen a lot of him last year. He's definitely a scout signing, there's a lot there, but you are wishing upon him and at a relatively advanced age. 

Pitchers constantly rewrite history though, so hard to ever be out.

[HOFHurt35]

2 minutes ago, soxfaninfl said:

At some point we do need to realistic about Vaughn. I like Vaughn and, like many, I was really excited about him last spring but is there really a place for him on this team? I guess the vision is to use him as a DH and part-time fill for Abreu and he is a RH power bat in a lineup full of them. Abreu has shown no sign of decline and, yes, six years is a long time but if you can use him as a chip to bring in a pitcher like Burnes, you have to consider it, don't you??? I guess I just look at the market even now. Much easier to get a DH/1B than a starting pitcher.

 

To give up a Top 20prospect, I wish it be for a pitcher with a little bit more of a track record than Burnes.  

 

[Rusty_Kuntz]

Have any of you seen Vaughn in person? I went to a couple Dash games in Myrtle Beach in 2019. 

Obviously this isn't based on his metrics, which are really good. He had a nice swing, hit a couple doubles in the first game I saw, has an easy ability to hit it all over the park. 

He was really, really small though. Clearly the shortest guy on the Dash as I was about 15 rows up along first base and you cold tell during the anthem. I'd guess he was 5'9 maybe 5'10. Obviously not a huge deal but it was striking to me. 

[Balta1701]

15 minutes ago, manbearpuig said:

There's also always a lot of options in free agency every year that you could easily fill 1B with. It's definitely the least concerning position to have a hole at.

You say that and I believe (outside of pitching) it still remains the position the White Sox have spent the most money on since 2010 by a lot, with very poor returns.

[soxfaninfl]

7 minutes ago, HOFHurt35 said:

To give up a Top 20prospect, I wish it be for a pitcher with a little bit more of a track record than Burnes.  

 

Not going to disagree though I do really like Burnes, especially with some of the veterans on our staff... but I just think we need to get over this idea Vaughn is untouchable, I agree with the other poster. He is the one chip we could use in a possible trade.

[Bob Sacamano]

5 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

You say that and I believe (outside of pitching) it still remains the position the White Sox have spent the most money on since 2010 by a lot, with very poor returns.

DH, yes. 1B no. There would be a difference in signing someone who would be the starting 1B instead of "old DH who can play 1B" (LaRoche, Alonso (bad signing all around), etc.).

Edited January 21, 2021 by manbearpuig

[Balta1701]

1 minute ago, manbearpuig said:

DH, yes. 1B no. There would be a difference in signing someone who would be the starting 1B instead of "old DH who can play 1B".

Freeman, Belt, and Rizzo currently have contracts that end after 2021. I guess CJ Cron is available now and probably winds up with a 1 year deal. Spotrac includes Ryan Braun and Daniel Murphy as possibles there.

[Squirmin' for Yermin]

24 minutes ago, soxfaninfl said:

At some point we do need to realistic about Vaughn. I like Vaughn and, like many, I was really excited about him last spring but is there really a place for him on this team? I guess the vision is to use him as a DH and part-time fill for Abreu and he is a RH power bat in a lineup full of them. Abreu has shown no sign of decline and, yes, six years is a long time but if you can use him as a chip to bring in a pitcher like Burnes, you have to consider it, don't you??? I guess I just look at the market even now. Much easier to get a DH/1B than a starting pitcher.

 

In 2019 he showed decline, just to be clear.  

[iWiN4PreP]

Im in camp  trade vaughn asap

[SoxBlanco]

11 minutes ago, Squirmin' for Yermin said:

In 2019 he showed decline, just to be clear.  

Was it even possible to NOT decline after his ridiculous 2018 season?  His numbers were insane in 2018, and he's one of the best college hitters of the last 20 years. 

In 2019, his numbers were still awesome, and every opposing pitcher knew the type of hitter he was at that point. He increased his walks from 44 in 2018 to 60 in 2019, and still put up a crazy 1.243 OPS in 2019.  Sure, you can call 2019 a decline, but that's not painting a very fair picture.

[Rusty_Kuntz]

2 minutes ago, SoxBlanco said:

Was it even possible to NOT decline after his ridiculous 2018 season?  His numbers were insane in 2018, and he's one of the best college hitters of the last 20 years. 

In 2019, his numbers were still awesome, and every opposing pitcher knew the type of hitter he was at that point. He increased his walks from 44 in 2018 to 60 in 2019, and still put up a crazy 1.243 OPS in 2019.  Sure, you can call 2019 a decline, but that's not painting a very fair picture.

He was talking about Abreu.

[SoxBlanco]

1 minute ago, Rusty_Kuntz said:

He was talking about Abreu.

Ha!  I'm an idiot. That's what I get for not reading the full post he was quoting.

@Squirmin' for Yermin, I apologize!

[Rusty_Kuntz]

Just now, SoxBlanco said:

Ha!  I'm an idiot. That's what I get for not reading the full post he was quoting.

@Squirmin' for Yermin, I apologize!

Happens to everyone.

[Squirmin' for Yermin]

10 minutes ago, SoxBlanco said:

Was it even possible to NOT decline after his ridiculous 2018 season?  His numbers were insane in 2018, and he's one of the best college hitters of the last 20 years. 

In 2019, his numbers were still awesome, and every opposing pitcher knew the type of hitter he was at that point. He increased his walks from 44 in 2018 to 60 in 2019, and still put up a crazy 1.243 OPS in 2019.  Sure, you can call 2019 a decline, but that's not painting a very fair picture.

I am talking about Abreu

[SoxBlanco]

3 minutes ago, Squirmin' for Yermin said:

I am talking about Abreu

Look at the three posts above this one.

[Jerksticks]

4 minutes ago, SoxBlanco said:

Look at the three posts above this one.

He did.  Clearly a pile-on.  ?

[CWSpalehoseCWS]

If the Sox sign Archer, I’ll throw up. The injury he’s returning has a history of ending pitchers careers. He won’t make it through 162 game season.

[Balta1701]

1 minute ago, CWSpalehoseCWS said:

If the Sox sign Archer, I’ll throw up. The injury he’s returning has a history of ending pitchers careers. He won’t make it through 162 game season.

If the White Sox have confidence that a guy can get through June,  then he can swap out with Kopech and others. 

[Perfect Vision]

Enough of this.  Let's just sign La Stella, one of Richards or Wainwright, and roll!