Chisoxfn Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 7 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said: But if you’re operating under lame duck status and don’t want to draft a rookie QB, why not just trade a mid round pick or two for him or even Minshew? My point is these guys can’t think Dalton on his own is the answer for 2021, so why not trade away a bit from a future that isn’t promised to you for a solution with more upside today. I think the reason is they plan to draft a QB in the 1st round. That being said, it’s very possible they are just horrible at QB evaluation and plan to rock & roll with Dalton and Alex Smith as their QB room, but I just don’t buy it. I think my other scenario holds true - Foles will be moved - and basically we will be in the exact same spot the franchise started the day with - except Dalton is your incumbent (vs. Foles) - and cap wise you are in essentially the same position. Bottom line - if Dalton>Foles - you have slightly increased your floor at a small increase in price (as Dalton + minor hit you take for moving Foles - if you can) is a net negative - but big picture - very small cap implication for having a better QB as your starting point while you continue to aggressively target other LT upgrades at the position (draft / Wilson / Watson / D'Arnold / Tua). Probably me trying to find the glass full / scenario where this actually makes a ton of strategic sense. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 Watson lawsuit just hitting the news wire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beast Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 5 hours ago, Chicago White Sox said: The Bears are 100% drafting a QB in the draft, so for now this remains a TBD from my perspective. Don’t get me wrong, at face value this move is completely underwhelming, but if we end up with Jones or Lance then Dalton is a perfectly fine bridge guy IMO. Also, we need to see what ends up happening with Williams as his addition plus one of those QB prospects would be a passable alternative to trading a ton of assets for Wilson. I can’t grade Dalton or have much of an opinion until I know the rest of the offseason moves. I don’t see how Foles stays after they have signed Dalton, they might just have to cut him and then draft a quarterback. I guess my opinion of this move really hinges on who they draft at quarterback in the draft. Does someone fall in their range, do they trade up or do they take a tackle and then swoop in to draft the quarterback they want? 6 hours ago, Chisoxfn said: I won't jump to conclusion(s) - yet. I don't think this stops them from grabbing another guy and not sure how this deal is structured. It just might mean if they get a wilson or someone else that they will need to move Nick Foles as part of that deal and quite frankly - that shouldn't be an issue. It seems like if anything - they wanted to hedge their bets - because - I get it - you can't just assume you'll get Wilson and/or have access to a top flight 1st round pick. Plus - for all of you who rip on Pace - isn't this what a new GM would have probably done anyway - bring in a bridge QB and start to churn the roster and/or make other decisions - so worse case - Pace doesn't make a big swing at a young QB and or one of the all pro's available - and it is kind of one of those - depending on health/defense/schedule this team will win anywhere from 6 to 10 games. I’m not really sure what to think about the Dalton signing. An Adam Schefter tweet seems to suggest Seattle wouldn’t move Wilson right now which leads me to believe they didn’t want to take the dead cap they would for trading him. Maybe they could trade him this summer or next offseason when the cap is lower but I doubt it. Dalton seems to be the same quarterback as Foles, so I bet Foles is the odd man out and will be released. They’ll draft another one high in the draft. Tyrod Taylor might have been a better acquisition to mix up the kind of quarterback they have on the roster, so you have the quarterback with legs and a pocket passer. I’m very interested to see what they do with the draft. I also want to see specifically how Dalton’s deal is structured. 2 hours ago, bmags said: hahahahaHahaHaahHAHAHAHA Maybe he replaces Massie? He didn’t play poorly last year. I would have wanted Williams but evidently the Biggs has spoken against that. Also, the one year deal makes sense in this market, I think for many players we are going to see a lot of them. 1 hour ago, Chisoxfn said: This - but in the court of public opinion - this move basically magnifies how bad the Foles move was. Reality is it is why all of the fan base is up in arms (and I don't blame them). But I'm just glad - if this was their panic move - it was a move that doesn't kill future cap space nor cost draft picks. Like I wanted Winston - but lets say Pace got into a bidding war with the Saints and offered Winston like $30M guaranteed and tied up cap space for the next 3-4 years. That would have been a far bigger disaster (on paper) - even if I liked the upside of the player more. Aside from the people on this board, I haven’t heard from many people who want to blow this up and realistically that wasn’t going to happen after that January news conference where Pace and Nagy were brought back. I can see how people could be disappointed with this move, but those Watson and Wilson trades were a bit out of reach to begin with. Aside from getting one of them or blowing things up, I’m not sure what would satisfy people, which is why the draft makes such a difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 Should the bears look at Juju and trade Robinson? Seems like strategically juju and a 2nd rounder (if they could get it for Robinson) might be a better option. Just throwing this out there - Juju is younger but obviously hasn’t quite replicated his one stud season - but he is still pretty good. Step down but if you can get him for a little less plus get pick - net net it might be better. Replace Juju with other free agent receiver you like more. The pick would be huge - gives Pace more ability to maneuver up to get a qb while adding a tackle and potentially another wide out in a deep wide out draft. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 3 hours ago, The Beast said: I can’t grade Dalton or have much of an opinion until I know the rest of the offseason moves. I don’t see how Foles stays after they have signed Dalton, they might just have to cut him and then draft a quarterback. I guess my opinion of this move really hinges on who they draft at quarterback in the draft. Does someone fall in their range, do they trade up or do they take a tackle and then swoop in to draft the quarterback they want? Dalton seems to be the same quarterback as Foles, so I bet Foles is the odd man out and will be released. They’ll draft another one high in the draft. Tyrod Taylor might have been a better acquisition to mix up the kind of quarterback they have on the roster, so you have the quarterback with legs and a pocket passer. I’m very interested to see what they do with the draft. I also want to see specifically how Dalton’s deal is structured. Aside from the people on this board, I haven’t heard from many people who want to blow this up and realistically that wasn’t going to happen after that January news conference where Pace and Nagy were brought back. I can see how people could be disappointed with this move, but those Watson and Wilson trades were a bit out of reach to begin with. Aside from getting one of them or blowing things up, I’m not sure what would satisfy people, which is why the draft makes such a difference. I feel like I’m taking crazy pills here. You believe Andy Dalton is the same QB as Foles. You also think if the Bears take a QB high in the draft, they cut Foles. And if they do that and it’s a QB drafted you like...your opinion of this move will be positive. Then why sign Dalton at all? If they are the same QB (your words) and you already have Foles on the roster...why are spending another 10 million on Dalton? And why does who they draft at QB matter at all in relation to Dalton vs Foles? If they draft a QB you like, and just had Foles on the roster..aren’t you in the same spot as you would be with Dalton on the roster? With that logic, I can’t fathom how you could endorse this move in any way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CentralChamps21 Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 So I just looked up 2020 stats and Trubisky had a better completion %, yards/attempt, and TD/INT ratio than Dalton. Is this just a case of the grass being greener (or is it redder?) on the other side? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 I'm going to defend Foles a bit. He plays up to the team he's on, and his stretch for the bears featured a) the best defenses they faced all year and b) the worst offensive line the bears had all year. Trubs had the opposite. Foles is not good, but playing with Coward I can't even remember some of the guards wasn't going to make any QB look good. Dalton has been in offenses that had a lot of talent with the exception of 2019 and certainly trended that way in 2018. But despite offensive line decline last year due to injuries, he won't have one of the best RBs in the game, and the type of WR core he had last year. I really just think they should have waited. He's not that much better than foles that you would be lost in a lurch. See who is available post draft. Maybe San Fran gets a QB and Jimmy G throws a fit. Maybe Darnold becomes available. This doesn't prevent them, no, but it may prevent some other FAs we could have gotten with 10 mill (not to mention we just lost a 5th round comp pick for Dalton lol) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 So the Bears went from Wilson and Williams to Dalton and Ifedi. They must be consulting with Jerry Reinsdorf. Not that Wilson and/or Williams was even a slightly realistit, but they got it out there enough to really piss off Bears fans when it didn't happen. I 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beast Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 4 hours ago, Tony said: I feel like I’m taking crazy pills here. You believe Andy Dalton is the same QB as Foles. You also think if the Bears take a QB high in the draft, they cut Foles. And if they do that and it’s a QB drafted you like...your opinion of this move will be positive. Then why sign Dalton at all? If they are the same QB (your words) and you already have Foles on the roster...why are spending another 10 million on Dalton? And why does who they draft at QB matter at all in relation to Dalton vs Foles? If they draft a QB you like, and just had Foles on the roster..aren’t you in the same spot as you would be with Dalton on the roster? With that logic, I can’t fathom how you could endorse this move in any way. Sorry, same KIND of quarterback as Nick Foles, a pocket passer. I want to know more about the overall plan the Bears have and want to see the rest of the moves made. I’m not thrilled about the move and think it’s probably garbage but I’m willing to see what happens first. They seem to need someone with legs if they want to run Nagy’s offense as opposed to a pocket passer if Lazor is in charge of the play calling. Why not have both types of quarterbacks on the roster? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 (edited) 9 minutes ago, The Beast said: Sorry, same KIND of quarterback as Nick Foles, a pocket passer. I want to know more about the overall plan the Bears have and want to see the rest of the moves made. I’m not thrilled about the move and think it’s probably garbage but I’m willing to see what happens first. They seem to need someone with legs if they want to run Nagy’s offense as opposed to a pocket passer if Lazor is in charge of the play calling. Why not have both types of quarterbacks on the roster? I think last offseason Nagy wanted Foles, Pace preferred Dalton. Now, leaving no stone unturned, they have them both. They weren't going to get a star, so I think they are just trying to find someone, anyone, that won't cost them games at that position. If the defense is good enough, it can make for an interesting season, and buy some time to more realistically find the QB they ultimately need to be consistently winning. But it won't happen with Pace and Nagy. Edited March 17, 2021 by Dick Allen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 50 minutes ago, WhiteSoxFan1993 said: So I just looked up 2020 stats and Trubisky had a better completion %, yards/attempt, and TD/INT ratio than Dalton. Is this just a case of the grass being greener (or is it redder?) on the other side? Yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knightni Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 14 hours ago, Tony said: Jason, will all due respect...piss off. In no order: 1. Mahomes 2. Josh Allen 3. Kyler Murray 4. Lamar Jackson 5. DeShaun Watson 6. Dak Prescott 7. Aaron Rodgers 8. Justin Herbert 9. Ryan Tannehill 10. Tom Brady 11. Matthew Stanford 12. Joe Burrow 13. Matt Ryan 14. Kirk Cousins 15. Baker Mayfield 16. Derek Carr 17. Trevor Lawrence 18. Ben Rotheslberger 19. Jared Goff 20. Carson Wentz 21. Sam Darnold 22. Daniel Jones 23. Jimmy G 24. Cam Newton 25. Teddy Bridgewater 26. Ryan Fitzpatrick 27. Jameis Winston 28. I’d take Tua over Dalton at this point. 29. maybe Dalton at this point? Where would you rank Russell Wilson on this list? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 27 minutes ago, Balta1701 said: Yes. Are you suggesting Mitch is better than Dalton? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 5 minutes ago, knightni said: Where would you rank Russell Wilson on this list? Lol, good call. So Dalton gets moved to at least 30 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CentralChamps21 Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 6 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said: Are you suggesting Mitch is better than Dalton? 2015 Dalton >> 2020 Mitch > 2020 Dalton. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 1 minute ago, WhiteSoxFan1993 said: 2015 Dalton >> 2020 Mitch > 2020 Dalton. Yep Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NWINFan Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 I wasn't aware of the fact that Jerry Reinsdorf now owns the Bears. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 Super Bowl Super Bears Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 Why would anyone think Ryan Pace could fix the QB situation especially this offseason, when he has very little wiggle room with the cap and doesn't have a high draft pick. We will forget his previous solutions of Glennon, Trubisky, and Foles. And why would anyone think Matt Nagy is a guy who can develop one? I mentioned this Nagy's first season. One of my best friends is a football genius. A true football genius. Watching games with him is entertaining and educational. He told me near the end of Nagy's first season when the Bears were riding high and everyone thought Nagy was the greatest hire in team history, that the league had caught up to him and figured him out. His gimmicks weren't going to work anymore. He would have to adjust. Since then, unless the Bears are playing the dregs of the NFL, their offense is shit. My guy was as right as can be. Not getting rid of these guys exposes the the franchise to more damage they can do, while just delaying the inevitable Maybe George realized the QB postion couldn't be solved this offseason and left them there to die on the sword. Put the new guy in a better position not to fail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangeSox Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 11 hours ago, bmags said: For the record; Biggs says Bears may not be done remaking their QB room. They may go after Alex Smith! gotta be satire. has to be. my brain can't process it being sincere. didn't think I could still be surprised at how terrible Bears ownership and management are and will always be, but here we are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 4 minutes ago, WhiteSoxFan1993 said: 2015 Dalton >> 2020 Mitch > 2020 Dalton. Mitch Trubisky is a terrible QB and an aged Dalton is most definitely better. How much better is certainly up for debate, but people using stats alone from last year to act like Mitch wasn’t a horrible decision-maker who couldn’t throw the ball downfield must not have watched any of our games. Again, I’m not suggesting Dalton is something that he’s not at this point in his career, but if I’m GM and my job is on the line there is zero debate I’m going with Andy over Mitch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 15 hours ago, Tony said: Jason, will all due respect...piss off. In no order: 1. Mahomes 2. Josh Allen 3. Kyler Murray 4. Lamar Jackson 5. DeShaun Watson 6. Dak Prescott 7. Aaron Rodgers 8. Justin Herbert 9. Ryan Tannehill 10. Tom Brady 11. Matthew Stanford 12. Joe Burrow 13. Matt Ryan 14. Kirk Cousins 15. Baker Mayfield 16. Derek Carr 17. Trevor Lawrence 18. Ben Rotheslberger 19. Jared Goff 20. Carson Wentz 21. Sam Darnold 22. Daniel Jones 23. Jimmy G 24. Cam Newton 25. Teddy Bridgewater 26. Ryan Fitzpatrick 27. Jameis Winston 28. I’d take Tua over Dalton at this point. 29. maybe Dalton at this point? I just saw this - and I am basing this on Bengals Dalton - so like I said that could be wrong. But I don’t think Dalton is different than a ton of guys you have on that list (including every player you have after 21) plus people like Baker Mayfield. I think there are a ton of qbs who I just bucket in that camp (that blend together). Now if you are saying who may be better...than the list changes as to who I would rather have and Dalton moves down, because he is on downside of his career with little to not upside projection. Dalton is not an exciting move and is at best a modet upgrade over what they had and quite frankly if Father Time caught up with him - no different than what they have. If that is all they are doing - than let the new regime come in next year. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangeSox Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said: Mitch Trubisky is a terrible QB and an aged Dalton is most definitely better. How much better is certainly up for debate, but people using stats alone from last year to act like Mitch wasn’t a horrible decision-maker who couldn’t throw the ball downfield must not have watched any of our games. Again, I’m not suggesting Dalton is something that he’s not at this point in his career, but if I’m GM and my job is on the line there is zero debate I’m going with Andy over Mitch. this is like arguing about whether cans of purina or friskies cat food tastes better. both are going to be awful. The Chicago Bears have spent $40,000,000 and a fourth round pick to bring us the Dalton v. Foles 2021 Training Camp Competition. Edited March 17, 2021 by StrangeSox Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 1 hour ago, Chicago White Sox said: Are you suggesting Mitch is better than Dalton? Yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.