Spring Training thread

[Harold's Leg Lift]

4 minutes ago, bmags said:

I was annoyed by the "makeup is what sets you apart" stuff from Hostetler, because so does athleticism and talent,

Talent is the floor makeup is the ceiling.  

[flavum]

Is Jimmy Cordero still suspended for 3 games for hitting Willson Contreras, or did that get lowered?

[MiddleCoastBias]

12 minutes ago, bmags said:

It's hard to believe he's only 10 lbs lighter than where he was at draft. Looks new.

That's really, really impressive to go through the last three years and keep his mental edge like this to throw it all in. Same with Sheets.

I was annoyed by the "makeup is what sets you apart" stuff from Hostetler, because so does athleticism and talent, but you can't listen to sheets and not come away impressed. Either through his dad or whatever, he knew what it would take to become a big leaguer. But his production wasn't close to there.

Now this outfield possibility and noise about his exit velos starting to catch up to loft, and it's all what you'd like to see from picks I'd pretty much written off. It's not like zombie courtney hawkins last years, refusing to change.

The bolded part is it for me. We've had two years of people on the board saying how Burger has given up, doesn't care about baseball, disappeared from the face of the earth, just wants to eat his signing bonus, etc. and written him off as a person, let alone a player.

Just goes to show how much we don't see or hear about these players in what they're truly doing to get better as a player and person. Just because we didn't get live video of his at-home workouts doesn't mean the guy has stopped caring about the sport. We're quick to judge these kids, I'm guilty of that as well, but it serves to show that the *professionals that work for the team* see and know a whole lot more than we do.

[Jack Parkman]

Not sure where to put this, but Sox brass is showing their contempt for their fanbase yet again by insulting our intelligence:

 

Edited February 25, 2021 by Jack Parkman

[caulfield12]

31 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

Not sure where to put this, but Sox brass is showing their contempt for their fanbase yet again by insulting our intelligence:

 

He needs to spend less time on social media and more time exhaustively assessing all options for DH beyond internal ones if Vaughn is deemed to be at least a half-season away. 

[poppysox]

TL called Madrigal "an artist"...he is very perceptive.?

[Jack Parkman]

A lot depends on Robert figuring out how to adjust, Moncada bouncing back after Covid and Lynn being as good as he was in 2019 and 2020.

If all of those things don't happen, then yeah, 80-83 wins seems pretty likely. If all of them happen, then 95 wins seems likely. 

The big ones are the 1st two guys. If Robert is what he was in August '20 and even if Moncada is close to what he was in 2019, then the Sox should be fine, unless Giolito gets hurt and/or Keuchel sucks or something like that. 

Usually in a season there are a few unexpected positive developments and a few negative ones. 

Edited February 26, 2021 by Jack Parkman

[RTC]

8 hours ago, Harold's Leg Lift said:

Talent is the floor makeup is the ceiling.  

And JR’s budget is the walls .....

[RTC]

1 hour ago, Jack Parkman said:

Not sure where to put this, but Sox brass is showing their contempt for their fanbase yet again by insulting our intelligence:

 

Rick Hahn can bite me 

[South Side Hit Men]

1 hour ago, caulfield12 said:

He needs to spend less time on social media and more time exhaustively assessing all options for DH beyond internal ones if Vaughn is deemed to be at least a half-season away. 

 

1 hour ago, Jack Parkman said:

Not sure where to put this, but Sox brass is showing their contempt for their fanbase yet again by insulting our intelligence:

 

Jerry Reinsdorf to fans: Fuck You!

Rick Hahn to fans: Fuck You!

Steve Stone to fans: Fuck You!

This is White Sox Baseball.

I do agree the money isn’t necessarily the issue. The primary issue is the way Hahn has spent it during his tenure that has resulted in his abysmal record, even during the years the team actually “tried”.

[ScootsMcGoots]

20 minutes ago, RTC said:

Rick Hahn can bite me 

If it wasn't for Rick Hahn you literally wouldn't have any player on the current roster except for maybe Tim Anderson, Leury Garcia and Carlos Rodon, because they never would have rebuilt. So I don't really think Rick Hahn gives a rat's ass as to what anyone thinks about him. He built this team and this juggernaut is going to destroy the league this year.

Plus, it wasn't his money to spend. It was Jerry's.

Edited February 26, 2021 by ScooterMcGee

[35thstreetswarm]

I do wish RH would fly above this kind of stuff. Leave the puzzling, gratuitous anti-fan aggression to Stone, Jerry and Co. 

[Balta1701]

1 hour ago, Jack Parkman said:

A lot depends on Robert figuring out how to adjust, Moncada bouncing back after Covid and Lynn being as good as he was in 2019 and 2020.

If all of those things don't happen, then yeah, 80-83 wins seems pretty likely. If all of them happen, then 95 wins seems likely. 

The big ones are the 1st two guys. If Robert is what he was in August '20 and even if Moncada is close to what he was in 2019, then the Sox should be fine, unless Giolito gets hurt and/or Keuchel sucks or something like that. 

Usually in a season there are a few unexpected positive developments and a few negative ones. 

You gotta add Dylan Cease to the list of really big things. If he struggles, the team is in real trouble. If he’s solid, then there’s rotation depth, the 5th starter being weak doesn’t destroy the bullpen, things don’t immediately fall apart if Keuchel gets hurt for a while, etc. if Cease struggles or gives a lot of 4 inning outings, things would be on a knife edge at best the whole year - no one else can get hurt or struggle.

To me that seems to be one spot where things could cascade, either everyone gets on a roll together or everything falls apart because they can’t cover for that many weak spots.

[35thstreetswarm]

1 hour ago, poppysox said:

TL called Madrigal "an artist"...he is very perceptive.?

Yeah, I think he specializes in that painting-on-a-grain-of-rice trick.  And I hear he can build a ship in a bottle...from the inside.

[Chicago White Sox]

10 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

You gotta add Dylan Cease to the list of really big things. If he struggles, the team is in real trouble. If he’s solid, then there’s rotation depth, the 5th starter being weak doesn’t destroy the bullpen, things don’t immediately fall apart if Keuchel gets hurt for a while, etc. if Cease struggles or gives a lot of 4 inning outings, things would be on a knife edge at best the whole year - no one else can get hurt or struggle.

To me that seems to be one spot where things could cascade, either everyone gets on a roll together or everything falls apart because they can’t cover for that many weak spots.

Cease is definitely the fulcrum of the 2021 season.  Obviously there are more important or impactful players, but Dylan can totally change the complexion of the rotation if he takes a major step forward.

[iWiN4PreP]

Welp, Rick Hahn just went to the shit list. Wish I could put him on ignore. 

[YourWhatHurts]

The biggest limiting factor on the Sox success in 2021 will be the starting rotation.  The 2nd biggest limiting factor is the health and strength of the bullpen.  The 3rd biggest limiting factor is probably LF defense IMO.  The offense will be good enough and could be historically great for the franchise if Robert, Eloy, and Moncada have big years while Eaton is healthy.

If Hahn doesn't think Sox fans should be cynical after his offseason then he can go suck a dick.  Certainly I hope I'm wrong, but I'm not betting on Lance Lynn being an ace, and I'm not betting on Keuchel being better than about 80% of his quality last year, and I'm not betting on Cease becoming a #3+ SP in 2021, and I'm not betting on Rodon doing shit other than missing games and being ineffectively wild while he's on the mound **or** finding the zone more with diminished stuff.  

Also, spending money on Hendriks isn't exciting at all to me.  Not only is this very likely to turn into a shit contract, but he's replacing a guy whose numbers in 2020 were sick.  Colome gave up basically nothing.  Even though in people's minds they *think* Hendriks is a better player, it will actually be difficult for him to even equal Colome's 2020, much less better it.  The pen is better with Crochet in it, but I'd argue that move is missing the forest for the trees and is a bad long-term decision.  Outside of those 2 there have been no additions to the pen.  The Sox are hanging their hopes on guys like Marshall and Foster being as good or better along with Bummer and Heuer continuing to be dominant.  But a couple off-years from guys in the front of their pen and they could be in especially big trouble from an IP perspective if their #4 SP is a 4-5IP starter, their #5 is garbage, and Lopez is the 6th starter "mop-up" guy or "gasoline spreader" more appropriately.

Knowing what we know now as far as what players signed for, if the Sox signed both Eaton and Pederson, and had Robert in CF with those other guys on the corner, with Engel in a platoon with Pederson and acting as the 4th OF, and with Leury as the 5th OF, they might have the best OF defense in baseball.  But they're going to keep running Eloy out there so they certainly didn't address LF defense.

[Buehrle>Wood]

9 hours ago, flavum said:

Is Jimmy Cordero still suspended for 3 games for hitting Willson Contreras, or did that get lowered?

"If a tree falls in the woods..."

[poppysox]

29 minutes ago, 35thstreetswarm said:

Yeah, I think he specializes in that painting-on-a-grain-of-rice trick.  And I hear he can build a ship in a bottle...from the inside.

Wow!  

[quickman]

So anything new in spring training despite everyone hating larussa, JR and Hahn? I mean all those people probably have there own thread . 

Edited February 26, 2021 by quickman
Misspell

[Vulture]

2 hours ago, 35thstreetswarm said:

Yeah, I think he specializes in that painting-on-a-grain-of-rice trick.  And I hear he can build a ship in a bottle...from the inside.

You gots to pick him just to say hello

[iWiN4PreP]

8 hours ago, quickman said:

So anything new in spring training despite everyone hating larussa, JR and Hahn? I mean all those people probably have there own thread . 

better get used to it... at this point ANY struggle the white sox go through will go right back to one of those three. 

it's going to be a fun year, but it's going to be a longggg year

[Y2Jimmy0]

11 hours ago, South Side Hit Men said:

 

Jerry Reinsdorf to fans: Fuck You!

Rick Hahn to fans: Fuck You!

Steve Stone to fans: Fuck You!

This is White Sox Baseball.

I do agree the money isn’t necessarily the issue. The primary issue is the way Hahn has spent it during his tenure that has resulted in his abysmal record, even during the years the team actually “tried”.

I disagree with this. The amount of money they’re allowed to spend is definitely the biggest issue 

[Balta1701]

1 hour ago, Y2Jimmy0 said:

I disagree with this. The amount of money they’re allowed to spend is definitely the biggest issue 

I very much disagree with this. If built correctly, teams can with with a controlled payroll, or at least they could (the Dodgers may have changed this last year by being that good). The Astros only had a $130 million ish payroll the year they won the title (slight assist from a cheap trash can noted). Cleveland made the World Series then won 100 games the next year. Tampa Bay made the World Series last year and had a legit shot at it. Kansas City.

The decisions, the professionalism of the front office are key in whether that is possible.  That includes when to rebuild, what players to hold onto and extend, how you behave with the press, fans, and players, and how to deploy your resources when they are limited (do you buy the best closer in the league and the second highest paid catcher if your payroll has strong limits?).

[poppysox]

1 hour ago, Y2Jimmy0 said:

I disagree with this. The amount of money they’re allowed to spend is definitely the biggest issue 

None of us even know that number.  It's just easier to hate on the FO.  This team may well win the WS and we have the salary room to extend contracts going forward.  Works for me.