What we learned from Opening Day

[RagahRagah]

1 hour ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

That was a great game thread. Gio was pitching great and a lot of people were loving it . At the end if was a typical game thread but  that's to be expected. Even if you have stuck up for Madrigal you have to be disappointed in the guy. Turns out Leury did nothing to make anyone believe he should be batting 6th from the left side. There were a few Collins haters but it wasn't too bad. I think most are OK with him, showing he can make more contact  and he'll show power and get walks.

Ragah you'd be a lot better off if you just talked baseball and left the social commentary  and the "poor me" I'm always getting attacked thing at home. Everyone knows game threads are hotbeds of meatball comments but yesterdays was mild and a lot of funny stuff was said.

Obviously it's in your nature to argue but once you start arguing about how other people argue like they aren't following some crazy argument rules it gets pretty bad. No one follows rules. We take potshots, use sarcasm,  insult. You really need to just let it go . I can see getting into extended arguments once in a while but you do it all the time. Learn to let go. So what if you think someone is being illogical or their analogies suck. After a couple of exchanges just say "this is getting nowhere" and just stop or agree to disagree. You also put yourself on a pedestal like you are better than others. That never goes over very well. Just sayin' bro a look in the mirror once in a while helps  and that goes for everyone .

Of all people, if you think that I'm disappointed. It's not that at all. I'm trying to get people to understand where they are cherry picking who and what they are applying their logic to. 

But yes, I am annoyed that some (not a giant many, honestly, IMO) people see fit to vilify me when they engage in a certain behavior far more than they accuse me of doing and fail to see the differences. And I have every right to be.

I won't apologize for having the need to try to make sense rather than just be self absorbed and oblivious. 

 

More to the point: I get that bad play will illicit frustration and I'm not new to gamethreads but last night was ridiculous; like a room full of scorned grade school kids.

Edited April 2, 2021 by RagahRagah

[Balta1701]

2 minutes ago, EloyJenkins said:

We learned Nomar Mazara went 0-4 and his replacement played much better!

LOL I just learned he actually made a major league roster.

[EloyJenkins]

7 minutes ago, RagahRagah said:

but last night was ridiculous; like a room full of scorned grade school kids.

I got home late after a delayed flight, I was drinking, I was getting frustrated with the game events and you let everyone know you were going to bed, then came back to bring up the cheapness of the offseason as a gotcha moment (which you have soapboxed for months).  I used it as an opportunity to pick on you. I am sorry it came down to that and hopefully that is the last of it. I apologize for my style and aggression, but my intentions were from a pretty justified place.  

Edited April 2, 2021 by EloyJenkins

[greg775]

29 minutes ago, Dick Allen said:

I don't understand why people are already starting with the bitching. 

Let's give a history of Yasmani Grandal on Soxtalk. 2019, Sox sign James McCann. Soxtalk: WTF? We have Narvaez and Kevan Smith, why sign this bum. If you're going to sign a catcher, sign Grandal. 2020  Sox sign Grandal. Soxtalk: WTF? We have James McCann. Now Grandal can't do anything right. Of course Gio didn't pitch too badly with Grandal catching, something Soxtalk was silent about. If you recall, Gio can't pitch to Grandal.  

Madrigal made a bad throw. It cost the Sox the game. We didn't learn anything. Soxtalk has always wondered how the career .340 hitter is on the team.

Leury is great, until he goes 0-4, then he should no longer be on a major league field.

At least Adam Eaton, who has no power, and bat is so slow, he looks like he's 50 years old, hit a homer. 

And as I predicted when he got hired, the HOFer baseball person got criticized game one. He doesn't know as much as a message board poster.

Great post. Fans are who they are. That's why I like the Randy Quaid character in Major League so much. I do wish we had Eloy's bat in the lineup. We are noticeably weaker without his lumber.

[Ducksnort]

Here's what I learned from OD:

Defense needs to keep it together. We are going to have a lot of nailbiters this year, especially with Eloy out. These games are ultimately going to come down to the bullpen, the defense, and some timely hitting. The performance of the Chicago White Sox during the 7th, 8th and 9th innings will dictate how successful they are during the 2021 season.

[Kalapse]

Imagine bitching about overreactions in game threads in 2021. I've been on this site for 17 years, the game threads have sucked for 17 years, game threads by their very nature will inherently suck, there is no getting around this.

[chitownsportsfan]

6 minutes ago, EloyJenkins said:

I got home late after a delayed flight, I was drinking, I was getting frustrated with the game events and you let everyone know you were going to bed, then came back to bring up the cheapness of the offseason as a gotcha moment (which you have soapboxed for months).  I used it as an opportunity to pick on you. I am sorry it came down to that and hopefully that is the last of it. I apologize for my style and aggression, but my intentions were from a pretty justified place.  

That's a good post, takes some guts.  I quit drinking after a couple glasses of wine and did some chess puzzles to blow off some steam after the Madrigal error.  We can rip Nick, and god knows he deserved it last night, but he's an important piece to the present and future and for know I will try and lay off him a bit in the game threads.

@Kalapse, nailed it!  Game thread are their own entity.  Quite a few forums have a "what happens in the game thread stays in the game thread" policy and it works pretty well. 

Edited April 2, 2021 by chitownsportsfan

[Bob Sacamano]

17 minutes ago, EloyJenkins said:

We learned Nomar Mazara went 0-4 and his replacement played much better!

Really sucks that we fill the RF hole only to have LF open up.

[Dick Allen]

32 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

LOL I just learned he actually made a major league roster.

It's the Tigers, so not really.

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

How does anyone listen to talk radio? Hopped in the car to grab lunch, 670 was on and all I heard was Lawrence Holmes talking about how dumb Robert was for stealing 3rd base because the process and thought was poor, even though the outcome was good. 

Lol

Guy was safe by a mile and then scored on a passed ball but somehow that was a bad and stupid decision. 

[YoYoIsMyHero]

2 hours ago, chitownsportsfan said:

I think that yourself, fathom and myself were the main brake pumpers last year.  I bought into the hype until I saw his in game athleticism last year against MLB talent.  It is average at best and his arm is also borderline.  It makes me wonder about the draft scouts (paid and otherwise) who kept telling us he was only playing 2B because of an elite SS next to him at OSU.  

Nah he was at 2B because he's not a SS, at all.  At least the Sox realized this when he got in the system.

There was an interesting moment on a popup last night with TA where Madrigal fought the lights and called off Tim.  It looked like Madrigal called Tim off, correctly, then almost dropped it and he laughed it off.  it was a prelude to a couple innings later when he almost threw it into LF on a routine fielders choice.

He seems like a borderline starter unless he's hitting 300.  Good luck.

That's not really what I remember. His arm was always a question and his future was destined at 2B barring a breakout in the minors.

https://www.soxmachine.com/2018/04/30/mlb-draft-report-nick-madrigal/

Quote

No matter what people say though, his short stature does play a part in where Madrigal can help teams. He doesn’t have the range to be an everyday shortstop, and some say that he doesn’t have the arm strength to make the necessary throws especially moving to his right. Hence why Grenier plays shortstop and Madrigal is at second base.

Draft profile on MLB.com doesn't exactly scream a SS playing 2B, and his arm grade is also a 50. :

http://m.mlb.com/prospects/2018?list=draft

Quote

While Madrigal has played mostly second base in deference to Cadyn Grenier at Oregon State, some feel he could handle shortstop if need be. If not, he has the chance to be a Gold Glove caliber second baseman in the future.

Either way, I definitely agree his D, baserunning, and IQ is definitely not as advertised so far. I would like to see where he's at by the ASB and evaluate from there. 

[Dick Allen]

1 minute ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

How does anyone listen to talk radio? Hopped in the car to grab lunch, 670 was on and all I heard was Lawrence Holmes talking about how dumb Robert was for stealing 3rd base because the process and thought was poor, even though the outcome was good. 

Lol

Guy was safe by a mile and then scored on a passed ball but somehow that was a bad and stupid decision. 

Yeah, if it's a gimme, might as well take it.. It worked out pretty well.  But if he got thrown out, and/or was hurt, he'd be getting the business for the attempt last night and today.

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

Just now, Dick Allen said:

Yeah, if it's a gimme, might as well take it.. It worked out pretty well.  But if he got thrown out, and/or was hurt, he'd be getting the business for the attempt last night and today.

He got an incredible jump and he has elite speed. He should use it to disrupt the game.

[Dick Allen]

During the year Yolmer won the GG, wasn't he god awful defensively the first couple weeks of the season?

[Dick Allen]

1 minute ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

He got an incredible jump and he has elite speed. He should use it to disrupt the game.

He wears an oven mitt, and dove into 3rd. Getting hurt is the main worry for me. He got hurt a couple years ago in spring training stealing 2nd with a feet first slide.

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

6 minutes ago, Dick Allen said:

He wears an oven mitt, and dove into 3rd. Getting hurt is the main worry for me. He got hurt a couple years ago in spring training stealing 2nd with a feet first slide.

I mean he wears the protector so he can slide head first, and there's injury risk sure but you can't zap that value from his game imo 

[chitownsportsfan]

John Sickels was dead wrong on Nick's physical profile.

https://www.minorleagueball.com/2018/4/20/17262286/2018-mlb-draft-nick-madrigal-2b-oregon-state-university-scouting-report

Speed is the best tool overall, with grades between 60 and 70 depending on the source. You can split the difference at 65 if you like, but everyone agrees that he’s an excellent baserunner with an ideal combination of instincts, athleticism, and aggression.

Speed doesn’t matter much if you can’t get on base but Madrigal excels in that department, with a superior batting eye and contact ability. There’s plenty of bat speed and his power production has improved steadily. He should hit a substantial number of doubles and triples and has a shot at hitting double-digit homers down the line. He can bunt, too, if you’re interested in small ball.

Madrigal plays second base for the Beavers due to the presence of Cadyn Grenier at shortstop. Madrigal is a tremendous second baseman, MLB.com going so far as to say he could be a Gold Glover someday. His arm and range are good enough for him to be a plausible shortstop, too. To top it all off, his makeup is considered superb.

[Stinky Stanky]

4 hours ago, EloyJenkins said:

Iglesias was electric last night. Stone said it best after the first pitch...Robert has no chance. But i agree that at bat was the blueprint given to every righty in the league. He will get about 20% fastballs going forward and that is horrifying

He did lay off a few outside sliders in Spring Training and I thought he had it made.  Guess I didn't watch enough in Spring Training.  Madrigal's either snakebit or overrated.  He's gotta pick up the pace.  Right now he's on the low end of mediocre.

[Dick Allen]

5 minutes ago, Stinky Stanky said:

He did lay off a few outside sliders in Spring Training and I thought he had it made.  Guess I didn't watch enough in Spring Training.  Madrigal's either snakebit or overrated.  He's gotta pick up the pace.  Right now he's on the low end of mediocre.

The thing that concerned me was when they showed the replay in slow motion, that pitch started out way outside, and was breaking even farther. I have no idea what or why he was swinging at it. Maybe he just couldn't pick him up. Especially with tight sliders, it's hard many times to pick of the spin, but even if that was a fastball, he wasn't going to hit it.

[Balta1701]

24 minutes ago, Dick Allen said:

He wears an oven mitt, and dove into 3rd. Getting hurt is the main worry for me. He got hurt a couple years ago in spring training stealing 2nd with a feet first slide.

I generally didn't like that either, you could see how his hand absolutely hit and then had to bend to slide past Rendon's shoe as it traveled over the bag. I don't know what the answer is here, somehow people steal bases without being hurt, but I can't fathom him doing that 30 times without catching his finger on something and bending it the wrong way.

[ShoeLessRob]

This is going to be a long season filled with ups and downs. We might not be as good as anticipated or we might truly be a perennial playoff contender. At least baseball is back to some sort of normalcy, if this past year has taught us anything, take nothing for granted! 

[ron883]

2 hours ago, Rowand44 said:

My bad, my bad.  Let me clarify: The hall of famer baseball person, Tony, not the hall of famer soxtalk poster, Tony.

Didn't realize the HOF bar here was so low

[ron883]

1 hour ago, EloyJenkins said:

I got home late after a delayed flight, I was drinking, I was getting frustrated with the game events and you let everyone know you were going to bed, then came back to bring up the cheapness of the offseason as a gotcha moment (which you have soapboxed for months).  I used it as an opportunity to pick on you. I am sorry it came down to that and hopefully that is the last of it. I apologize for my style and aggression, but my intentions were from a pretty justified place.  

I'll be celebrating an occasion with lots of sangria at a Tapas place tonight. I will be coming into the gamethread all fired up. Can't wait

[ron883]

55 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

How does anyone listen to talk radio? Hopped in the car to grab lunch, 670 was on and all I heard was Lawrence Holmes talking about how dumb Robert was for stealing 3rd base because the process and thought was poor, even though the outcome was good. 

Lol

Guy was safe by a mile and then scored on a passed ball but somehow that was a bad and stupid decision. 

Holmes is the worst host on the score currently. Acted like a total petulant child earlier this week by being the only host to not join in on a fun 2-player home run draft, because "he's a grown ass man and can do what the hell wants". It was so cringey to listen to. It feels like he hates Parkins for some reason. Holmes just sucks. 

Edited April 2, 2021 by ron883

[Jack Parkman]

56 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

How does anyone listen to talk radio? Hopped in the car to grab lunch, 670 was on and all I heard was Lawrence Holmes talking about how dumb Robert was for stealing 3rd base because the process and thought was poor, even though the outcome was good. 

Lol

Guy was safe by a mile and then scored on a passed ball but somehow that was a bad and stupid decision. 

Steve Stone said the same thing on the broadcast. 

Edited April 2, 2021 by Jack Parkman