The Yermin-Vaughn-Abreu Conundrum

[caulfield12]

26 minutes ago, tray said:

485 feet.  That's not a fluke.  That is not small sample size. That is not something an average major league hitter can do, even when he has a historically good week.  And to do it in a Home Opener?  That's clutch hitting for the team, for the fans and for the owner - one of those baseball memories that will stay with Sox fans for a long time.

 

Joe Borchard 500+ foot homer?

[caulfield12]

2 hours ago, Sambuca said:

The last thing I would call this is a problem.

When has the White Sox organization ever had too many good players? 

If every player in this thread is good enough at the same time to force some tough decisions, we are in a very good position and probably a WS favorite.

We cannot possibly go from worrying about having zero depth to worrying about having too many good players in a few days span.  We sound insane.

Probably 2006 when we had six starting pitchers entering the season with the additions of Javy and McCarthy...and had sunk a huge percentage of payroll into all those 5 veteran guys who started all but three games (Brandon and Charlie Haeger of the now infamous murder/suicide case last fall.)

Edited April 10, 2021 by caulfield12

[Chicago White Sox]

The Sox are going to have to make a decision at some point about what to do with Vaughn.  If they’re willing to commit to him in LF, then start doing so now and play him everyday.  If not, send him down to AAA once Engel is back.  Using him in a quasi platoon role isn’t going to help that much with his development and we’re burning a year of service time while doing so.

Edited April 10, 2021 by Chicago White Sox

[Flash]

On 4/9/2021 at 12:46 AM, caulfield12 said:

No way in HELL a National League team can trade their best player in his age 27-30 seasons for a MASSIVE question mark in Jimenez.   I'm not even 100% sure I would trade him for Jimenez and Madrigal (as Dbacks' GM)...it might take a White Sox minor league starter like Kelley.

It's actually quite similar to the return the Brewers would expect for Corbin Burnes...although I'd give the slight advantage to Burnes because of the importance of TOR starters in the playoffs.   The affordable nature of the Marte deal makes it extremely attractive for any middle/small-market contending team in baseball with a strong/deep farm system.

One of the first honest assessments of Eloys trade value I've see posted here. We had a window before he got hurt to maximize his market value in trade. Maybe he'll return in great physical shape and continue to knock the cover off the ball but unless/until evidence of sustainable performance, demand for his one-dimensional value will disappoint this board.

[Flash]

7 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

The Sox are going to have to make a decision at some point about what to do with Vaughn.  If they’re willing to commit to him in LF, then start doing so now and play him everyday.  If not, send him down to AAA once Engel is back.  Using him in a quasi platoon role isn’t going to help that much with his development and we’re burning a year of service time while doing so.

Do you know the date to send him down by in order to preserve service time? 

[caulfield12]

5 minutes ago, Flash said:

Do you know the date to send him down by in order to preserve service time? 

Balta know it...pretty sure.

[Capital G]

I have no idea how service time works in this case.... but either way Vaughn either needs to go down and play daily or play in LF everyday. I understand the Sox probably thought Yermin wouldn't hit like he has and Vaughn would be the primary DH..... but until (hopefully never) Yermin stops hitting Vaughn needs to play in LF daily or go to the minors or it'll be a huge disservice to him

[Chicago White Sox]

50 minutes ago, Flash said:

Do you know the date to send him down by in order to preserve service time? 

They can do it at any time.  The only difference now is they’ll have to make up for any time accrued so far this year.  So if before he needed to be down 2.5 weeks now it’s closer to 4 and rising every game.

[Flash]

7 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

They can do it at any time.  The only difference now is they’ll have to make up for any time accrued so far this year.  So if before he needed to be down 2.5 weeks now it’s closer to 4 and rising every game.

Got it. Thanks

[tray]

5 hours ago, caulfield12 said:

Joe Borchard 500+ foot homer?

That was in a home opener?

[caulfield12]

Just now, tray said:

That was in a home opener?

No, but just a reminder not to get excited about tape measure shots.  
 

Not all created equal.  Robert’s was probably the most impressive given the circumstances in Game 3.

[tray]

Disagree.

[caulfield12]

8 minutes ago, tray said:

Disagree.

Dan Pasqua and Daniel Palka say hello...Mazara, etc,

[AJ'S Cousin]

First of all we have no conundrum. Eloy is out for the year. We have to see if Tony rides Yermin until he cools off. Right now Yermin is your DH until further notice. As long as he’s hitting around 300 he’s my DH. I agree with “ Chicago White Sox”, put Vaughn in left and get him to the plate as many times as possible. He has to prove he can hit ALL PITCHING. I’m willing to let him learn, will Tony? That’s another aspect. The three headed monster we have at catcher is great. A lot of teams would envy that flexibility. I was very impressed by Collins defense. If with Eloy out, we don’t have enough spots for everyone time to play to develop. I understand the dog days will be coming soon. Games and doubleheader’s will pile up and our bench will be needed and it will help. If Collins get a lot of time and develops, he’ll get the McCann treatment and we’ll lose him also. I would love just for the hell of it to see Yermin behind the plate. That could answer are od questions on what to with Collins down the road. Is Yermin the next Cruz? Maybe. We have to make room for our other Cuban Arsenal we have LOL. the success we’ve had with Cuba is unreal. I also agree and he deserves it that Abreu deserves the Konerko treatment. He bleeds White Sox blood. We are in an interesting situation with too many good players and not enough spot. Remember, we 3 on the DL, 2 that will be back plus a couple of pitchers that will be back. The next few months will be interesting   

[kitekrazy]

On 4/10/2021 at 4:44 AM, Chicago White Sox said:

The Sox are going to have to make a decision at some point about what to do with Vaughn.  If they’re willing to commit to him in LF, then start doing so now and play him everyday.  If not, send him down to AAA once Engel is back.  Using him in a quasi platoon role isn’t going to help that much with his development and we’re burning a year of service time while doing so.

They should to turn him into an outfielder. This organization has no shortage of players who's weakness is catching a baseball.  

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

I didn't participate in the game thread yesterday. But when Eaton pinch hit for Vaughn I was imagining all the whining going on. For some reason Vaughn is getting cut a tremendous amount of slack. I did check on the game thread to make sure I was right and sure enough there was a lot of bitching about it.

I don't get it. What made anyone think that from a win/loss perspective that wasn't the right move ? You take out the struggling rookie with very little pro baseball experience who is RH out against a RHP and replace him with an established experienced veteran LH hitter. 

[ron883]

So, with Yermin looking like the real deal, the Sox are in a bind. Vaughn is showing flashes of his greatness finally. Abreu ain't going anywhere. 

Once Eloy comes back, do the Sox go with the giga chad offense consisting of Eloy in LF and Vaughn in RF? Robert would have his hands full, but holy canolli would that offense be fun to watch. 

[ron883]

On 4/8/2021 at 11:05 PM, caulfield12 said:

We would have said the same thing in mid August of Gordon Beckham's rookie campaign. The next White Sox captain to take over from Paulie, Jeter-esque qualities. 

Yermin has to hit, because he's unlikely to play in the field or catch (rifle arm but lacking in other areas and Grandal/Collins ahead of him.)

So far, first big test passed... sustaining that momentum.  But llet's wait and see how he does against CLE.

Still trying to compare him to Gordon Beckham?

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

8 hours ago, ron883 said:

So, with Yermin looking like the real deal, the Sox are in a bind. Vaughn is showing flashes of his greatness finally. Abreu ain't going anywhere. 

Once Eloy comes back, do the Sox go with the giga chad offense consisting of Eloy in LF and Vaughn in RF? Robert would have his hands full, but holy canolli would that offense be fun to watch. 

Can Vaughn catch? ?

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

In all seriousness, if you want to max out the offense’s production you catch Yermin with Vaughn in LF and Eloy at DH. Honestly, I’m not sure Yermin would be much worse defensively at catcher than what we’ve seen from Grandal so far this season.

1. TA          
2. Robert    
3. Abreu     
4. Eloy   
5. Yermin
6. Moncada   
7. Vaughn   
8. Eaton   
9. Madrigal

I dare you to find a better lineup in MLB than that. That’s peak 90’s Indians shit right there.

Edited April 24, 2021 by JUSTgottaBELIEVE

[BamaDoc]

I haven't seen it mentioned, but in the next CBA, the DH likely comes to the NL.  Yermin is cheap and probably gets by as a third/emergency catcher as well as DH.  He would have value if he continues to hit.

 Eloy would have health as a question mark unless he returns this year and looks good.  He doesn't want to DH.  Eloy would have the more expensive contract and if teams think he is a DH only .....you won't get value in return.    Prior to his injury, I thought Eloy might be the best hitter on this years team.

 Vaughn is coming around with the bat.  Positional versatility, better defense, younger, cheaper.

Agree that Abreu won't be going anywhere.

Interesting to maybe  have to many good bats.  

[Tnetennba]

On 4/10/2021 at 6:52 AM, Flash said:

Do you know the date to send him down by in order to preserve service time? 

172 days on the big league club earns a year of service time.  He can go to AAA or the taxi squad and that pauses, but he would need to stay down for the equivalent time he's been up to gain another year of control.

[poppysox]

1 hour ago, BamaDoc said:

I haven't seen it mentioned, but in the next CBA, the DH likely comes to the NL.  Yermin is cheap and probably gets by as a third/emergency catcher as well as DH.  He would have value if he continues to hit.

 Eloy would have health as a question mark unless he returns this year and looks good.  He doesn't want to DH.  Eloy would have the more expensive contract and if teams think he is a DH only .....you won't get value in return.    Prior to his injury, I thought Eloy might be the best hitter on this years team.

 Vaughn is coming around with the bat.  Positional versatility, better defense, younger, cheaper.

Agree that Abreu won't be going anywhere.

Interesting to maybe  have to many good bats.  

Need to sigh Mercedes to an Eaton-like extension.  There will be a buying frenzy if NL approves the DH.  I would like to find a way to keep him...but for sure don't want to end up empty-handed.

[Jack Parkman]

The answer is fairly obvious. If Yermin keeps hitting, cash in on him as a trade chip. Make a "baseball trade" 

I'm sure that some other AL team needs a DH and quite frankly if Eloy returns to his previous form he's better and younger. 

[JuliusO1274]

2 hours ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

In all seriousness, if you want to max out the offense’s production you catch Yermin with Vaughn in LF and Eloy at DH. Honestly, I’m not sure Yermin would be much worse defensively at catcher than what we’ve seen from Grandal so far this season.

1. TA          
2. Robert    
3. Abreu     
4. Eloy   
5. Yermin
6. Moncada   
7. Vaughn   
8. Eaton   
9. Madrigal

I dare you to find a better lineup in MLB than that. That’s peak 90’s Indians shit right there.

I'd prefer just going with Vaughn in RF.