The TLR Manager Thread

[Quin]

59 minutes ago, Jose Abreu said:

 

Dear lord.

[Dick Allen]

Bottom line is most White Sox fans who are old enough to have lived through Tony's first stint with the White Sox , are far more surprised he has this reputation of making teams better. None of mismanagement is a surprise. This was a guy who Tom Paciorek, the mild mannered Wimpy, once said couldn't manage a lemonade stand. 

He's clearly slowed down. You can tell that in his speech. Call it ageism or whatever, but he shouldn't have been hired, his drinking and driving gave them an out, they didn't take it, and at the end of the year, I can almost guarantee he will call it a day. 

[Bob Sacamano]

Can the title be changed to "Hall of Fame Person, brother?"

[Balta1701]

11 minutes ago, manbearpuig said:

Can the title be changed to "Hall of Fame Person, brother?"

My bad, I merged this with a different thread and it kept the new thread name. 

[Balta1701]

20 minutes ago, Dick Allen said:

Bottom line is most White Sox fans who are old enough to have lived through Tony's first stint with the White Sox , are far more surprised he has this reputation of making teams better. None of mismanagement is a surprise. This was a guy who Tom Paciorek, the mild mannered Wimpy, once said couldn't manage a lemonade stand. 

He's clearly slowed down. You can tell that in his speech. Call it ageism or whatever, but he shouldn't have been hired, his drinking and driving gave them an out, they didn't take it, and at the end of the year, I can almost guarantee he will call it a day. 

I will still go the exact opposite. The only thing that stops Tony LaRussa from managing this team in 2022 is there not being baseball in 2022.

[fathom]

How do you say “sincere” in Ebonics?

[Tony]

8 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

I will still go the exact opposite. The only thing that stops Tony LaRussa from managing this team in 2022 is there not being baseball in 2022.

Strong disagree. If they are below .500 in August, or key players start getting more vocal, it's well within reality for Tony to say after the season "I was so thankful to get back into the dugout one more time with a great group of guys, but after turning 77 in October, I think it's time to enjoy retirement once and for all.'  

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

50 minutes ago, poppysox said:

I think it was Anderson (not sure) who was commenting a few days ago about TL being 3 or 4 steps ahead of everyone else.  I'm sure you get the point...real ballplayers respect his knowledge of the game.

His starting pitcher last night basically said the guy put me back out there when I had nothing left in the tank, and then let me ride on E until I ran out of gas and nearly combusted.

Tony, even after the game sitting at the podium did not know that Giolito was out of gas.

James fegan said, I spoke with Giolito after the game and he said he was gassed.

Tony responded, after saying he felt good about giolito over and over again, by saying "he said that?"

Even after the game was over, Tony had no idea what his players were thinking of feeling. Does that sound like a guy who is 3 or 4 steps ahead of anyone that isn't in a wheelchair?

Edited April 28, 2021 by Look at Ray Ray Run
i can't spell

[poppysox]

1 minute ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

His starting pitcher last night basically said the guy put me back out there when I had nothing left in the tank, and then let me ride on E until I ran out of gas and nearly combusted.

Tony, even after the game sitting at the podium did not know that Giolito was out of gas.

James f**an said, I spoke with Giolito after the game and he said he was gassed.

Tony responded, after saying he felt good about giolito over and over again, by saying "he said that?"

Even after the game was over, Tony had no idea what his players were thinking of feeling. Does that sound like a guy who is 3 or 4 steps ahead of anyone that isn't in a wheelchair?

Noone is saying last night's game was TL's finest moment...not even Tony.  Actually, TL actually admits when he feels he blew it more than most.

[Tony]

2 minutes ago, poppysox said:

Noone is saying last night's game was TL's finest moment...not even Tony.  Actually, TL actually admits when he feels he blew it more than most.

But you said it's unfair for fans to "second guess" the manager, when we've established it's not second guessing when you know it's the wrong call before the event took place. 

Is that right? 

[Balta1701]

7 minutes ago, Tony said:

Strong disagree. If they are below .500 in August, or key players start getting more vocal, it's well within reality for Tony to say after the season "I was so thankful to get back into the dugout one more time with a great group of guys, but after turning 77 in October, I think it's time to enjoy retirement once and for all.'  

It's going to take an awful lot going wrong for this team to be below .500 in August. 

[GGajewski18]

1 minute ago, Tony said:

But you said it's unfair for fans to "second guess" the manager, when we've established it's not second guessing when you know it's the wrong call before the event took place. 

Is that right? 

This is three games in 20 games that TLR has admitted this.  That is AWFUL.  Stop defending him.  This was a horrible hire and it is affecting the Sox play.

 

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

4 minutes ago, poppysox said:

Noone is saying last night's game was TL's finest moment...not even Tony.  Actually, TL actually admits when he feels he blew it more than most.

Let me ask you this as a follow up:

How many managers do you think exist in the modern game that do not ask their pitcher how they're feeling before sending them back out to start an inning at 95 pitches?

[South Side Hit Men]

44 minutes ago, Dick Allen said:

Bottom line is most White Sox fans who are old enough to have lived through Tony's first stint with the White Sox , are far more surprised he has this reputation of making teams better. None of mismanagement is a surprise. This was a guy who Tom Paciorek, the mild mannered Wimpy, once said couldn't manage a lemonade stand. 

He's clearly slowed down. You can tell that in his speech. Call it ageism or whatever, but he shouldn't have been hired, his drinking and driving gave them an out, they didn't take it, and at the end of the year, I can almost guarantee he will call it a day. 

This. He is the only manager I ever booed, was not a good manager during his previous tenure with the team. He deserved to be fired, and he did not deserve to be hired for this season. A.J. Hinch and Bochy were logical and solid candidates who weren't even interviewed.

I'd have let Ricky play out the extension given 60 games prior (35-25) vs. hiring La Russa with all the baggage and fact he was ten years removed from the role. Jerry rarely speaks, yet the last time I've seen him was last offseason when he stated Tony La Russa is far too old to relate to current players and really has nothing to prove, and yet he drove the decision.

[fathom]

17 minutes ago, GGajewski18 said:

This is three games in 20 games that TLR has admitted this.  That is AWFUL.  Stop defending him.  This was a horrible hire and it is affecting the Sox play.

 

Yep he’s flat out costing the Sox games with truly irrational decisions.

[Texsox]

Does the pitcher have any responsibility to inform the manager he's gassed? 

I'm trying to wrap my head around that conversation not happening. 

[ChiSox59]

5 hours ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Why does the pen need to be saved? 

You don't mind not talking to your player and asking him how he feels before sending him out for another inning at 95 pitches? The bullpen will be used much more if giolito gets hurt. 

The time to see if he can "battle" through fatigue is absolutely not an April game vs the worst team in baseball. 

I think talking about taking Giolito out prior to the 7th is silly.  He is our ace and he had 95 pitches and we're facing the worst offensive in the AL.  Had TLR taken him out and brought in Foster or whoever, you'd be ripping him that they took Gio out too early.

Now, I definitely think it would have made some sense to pull him after the lead-off walk and long Baddoo at bat.  Certainly after the Ramos double.  

He was definitely left in too long, but taking him out before the 7th even started is wayyyy too quick of a hook.

[fathom]

3 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

I think talking about taking Giolito out prior to the 7th is silly.  He is our ace and he had 95 pitches and we're facing the worst offensive in the AL.  Had TLR taken him out and brought in Foster or whoever, you'd be ripping him that they took Gio out too early.

Now, I definitely think it would have made some sense to pull him after the lead-off walk and long Baddoo at bat.  Certainly after the Ramos double.  

He was definitely left in too long, but taking him out before the 7th even started is wayyyy too quick of a hook.

Go back and look at the game thread. Every single poster was hoping he wouldn’t start the 7th.  He was throwing some really bad pitches in the 6th and his velocity was down.

[beautox]

28 minutes ago, poppysox said:

Noone is saying last night's game was TL's finest moment...not even Tony.  Actually, TL actually admits when he feels he blew it more than most.

Again thats fine and all but the same thing happened in Seattle with Foster and its painfully obvious that he didn't learn from it.

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

6 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

I think talking about taking Giolito out prior to the 7th is silly.  He is our ace and he had 95 pitches and we're facing the worst offensive in the AL.  Had TLR taken him out and brought in Foster or whoever, you'd be ripping him that they took Gio out too early.

Now, I definitely think it would have made some sense to pull him after the lead-off walk and long Baddoo at bat.  Certainly after the Ramos double.  

He was definitely left in too long, but taking him out before the 7th even started is wayyyy too quick of a hook.

This is just wrong given that I asked why he was coming out for the 7th at all.

The guy was gassed the previous inning. That was pretty obvious.

I rarely ever complain about pulling a starter "too early" and my rule for starters (especially early in the season) is if one hitter can put your pitch count north of a comfortable level then they absolutely should not start the inning.

And you're completely ignoring the fact that the pitcher HIMSELF said he was gassed after the 6th. That's something a manager should know.

Edited April 28, 2021 by Look at Ray Ray Run

[Texsox]

I've never been in a MLB dugout during the game and never heard a in game conversation between an ace and hall of fame manager so maybe I'm missing something.  But it seems like someone, pitching coach or manager walks over to the pitcher after 90 +pitches and asks what ya got left? 

And your trying to keep a roster spot guy might lie and say give me the ball but Gio should be able to say I'm gassed. 

Sending him out wasn't a bad decision, I'm more concerned that there was a startling horrible lack of communication between Gio and the coaching staff. 

[IWokeUpLikeThis]

1 hour ago, Dick Allen said:

This was a guy who Tom Paciorek, the mild mannered Wimpy, once said couldn't manage a lemonade stand. 

[ChiSox59]

7 minutes ago, fathom said:

Go back and look at the game thread. Every single poster was hoping he wouldn’t start the 7th.  He was throwing some really bad pitches in the 6th and his velocity was down.

I rarely participate in game threads as they're just full of BS and negativity, so I missed this.  

[South Side Hit Men]

11 minutes ago, Texsox said:

Does the pitcher have any responsibility to inform the manager he's gassed? 

I'm trying to wrap my head around that conversation not happening. 

Lawrence Holmes asked Steve Stone this during his interview today. Steve's response was every pitcher is different, but most pitchers will say they are fine. Lawrence also brought up a good point that if anyone on Earth knows Lucas it's Katz. Lawrence stated either scenario was troubling:

• Katz saw that he was tiring and didn't mention or get through to Tony, or
• He couldn't see Lucas was gassed, especially after the first two hitters in the inning.

There is also confusion based on Tony's statements whether Tony was cognizant of what was going on, based on the fact he stated he thought Lucas could get "that one last out" when there was only one out when this consideration was theoretically being made.

I suggest Sox fans interested in Steve Stone's analysis and Lawrence Holmes' follow-up click the interview (it should be available in the link below within the next few hours):

Hour 1 - April 28: https://www.audacy.com/670thescore/podcasts/laurence-holmes-on-670-the-score-61

[IWokeUpLikeThis]

4 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

I rarely participate in game threads as they're just full of BS and negativity, so I missed this.  

Yes, but it's probably better they get buried in a dark corner of the internet than those people attend the games and spread toxic energy throughout the ballpark that could distract the team. 

Edited April 28, 2021 by IWokeUpLikeThis