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The TLR Manager Thread

chitownsportsfan

By chitownsportsfan
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CentralChamps21 Grand Master

CentralChamps21

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15 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

Why does baseball take so much pride in being old fashioned?  If this were basketball, the unwritten rules people would be upset that we weren't using peach baskets anymore, and don't get me started on the jump shot instead of the rightfully just set shot.

The beautiful part about the game is that each generation makes it their own, and plays it the way that they want to play it.  If you aren't supposed to swing 3-0, write the exact parameters in a rulebook, otherwise shut up and play the game.  If you don't want someone swinging 3-0 down 11 against a position player, don't get down 11 and put a position player in to pitch.

I don't have a problem with Tony wanting to be old school and ordering Yermin to take on 3-0. It's not a decision I would make, but I don't think it's a huge deal if that's what he wants to do. I have a problem with running out of the dugout to yell it rather than having the 3B coach give a take sign. I also have a problem with making a big deal out of it publicly.

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Larussa was so worried about yermin getting thrown at and hurt he said he had no problem with the Twins doing exactly that. Good call!

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NWINFan Veteran

NWINFan

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All this talk about respecting the game. In the past two decades, we've had steroid use, and a team stealing signs. Of course, there was also the obnoxious Sammy Sosa "homer hop." That's not showing up the opposition? Not to mention that I remember two times Sammy did his homer hop and the ball hit the wall. One time he was held to a single, and other he was thrown out at second in his lame attempt to get a double. Now that is some real major league baseball.

I probably could come up with some other examples if I wanted to really waste my time. In this case, is it a matter that LaRussa just doesn't like Yermin?

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RagahRagah Grand Master

RagahRagah

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7 minutes ago, harkness99 said:

Soooo...

3-1 count - okay to hit a home run.

3-0 count - absolute disrespect to the game.

 

How can anyone not see how stupid that is...

One of the points I forgot to make. 

There's all sorts of holes in Tony's logic. This is the power a philosophy can have in indoctrinating someone, that common sense just goes out the window. 

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Kyyle23 Grand Master

Kyyle23

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5 minutes ago, chitownsportsfan said:

I was going to ask and since you mentioned it: what is the most posted in thread of all time here in one season? Any idea?

We had a crede/Eric Chavez Thread that was the top thread for a long time but I think it was dethroned.  We literally called this place Chaveztalk for like a month ? 

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Buehrle>Wood Grand Master

Buehrle>Wood

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17 minutes ago, chitownsportsfan said:

I was going to ask and since you mentioned it: what is the most posted in thread of all time here in one season? Any idea?

The Cespedestalk.com thread had 5900 replies. Long ways to go. This isn't even the longest La Russa thread.

Edited by Buehrle>Wood
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Kyyle23 Grand Master

Kyyle23

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I want to know what people like Tray and VAFan think of CC's comments.  Their entire premise is "Tony has managed 5000 games he has forgotten more than you have ever learned about the game", when a borderline hall of fame player is saying the opposite 

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southsider2k5 Grand Master

southsider2k5

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On 5/19/2021 at 3:01 AM, caulfield12 said:

Even VAFaN is smart enough to refrain from writing an impassioned TLR defense...at least for now. 

 

12 hours ago, VAfan said:

Here's my take on the Yermin 3-0 HR. 

1. Tony LaRussa, who has managed more than 5,000 games, knew EXACTLY what would happen if Yermin teed off on a 3-0 pitch up 15-4 in the 9th inning. 

2. TLR KNEW, I'm sure because he'd seen it happen before many many times, that the Twins would be pissed, AND WOULD THROW THE BASEBALL AT YERMIN or another Sox player in retaliation because of Yermin's swing. 

3. TLR also KNEW that the risk of injury to his player from being thrown at, while not high, was INFINITELY more important than hitting a HR or a base hit in the 15-4 blowout and showing up the Twins. 

4. So, to PROTECT HIS PLAYER, and HIS TEAM, TLR gave the TAKE sign to Yermin on the 3-0 pitch.

5. This was ABSOLUTELY the correct call.  

6. TLR was thinking AHEAD at the repercussions of swinging 3-0. 

7. Yermin, meanwhile, was completely consumed into himself when he ignored the TAKE sign and swung away. He didn't know the likely repercussions, because he'd NEVER been in this situation in a major league game.  Tony LaRussa, on the other hand, had managed more than 5,000 such games. 

8. So when Yermin ignored the take sign and hit the HR, LaRussa said he would be disciplined, because he put his health and the team at risk. Whatever discipline it was did not keep Yermin out of the next two games, so it was not severe. But it was enough to get across the point that you need to respect the take sign. There was a logical reason behind it meant to protect his health and the team health. 

9. LaRussa's other comment about Yermin "playing his game" was also appropriate. Players have to play for the team. Tony isn't reigning them in for no reason. He said if he's swung away at 3-1, he would have been fine with it.  But LaRussa knew were the line was in the Twins eyes, and he was 100% correct about that when the Twins threw at Yermin the next game. 

10. Who started the dissension here?  Not TLR.  He put on a take sign that NO ONE would have known about if Yermin hadn't blown it off.

11. The controversy, and the risk, was started by Yermin Mercedes, who ignored the sign because he couldn't help himself, and who certainly wasn't thinking through the consequences. 

12. I'm not defending in any way the Twins getting pissed and throwing at Yermin.  But it was nearly 100% certain to happen once Yermin jacked the ball out of the park. And TLR knew it. 

13. So, I think TLR was the ONLY one thinking ahead, and the only one to put Yermin's health and the team ahead of a meaningless HR in the 9th inning of a 15-4 game. 

14. When I read that Yermin had hit the HR, I personally didn't have a problem with it. Now that I've read some articles about it and realized WHY TLR put on the take sign, I believe that TLR is right. 

15. This has NOTHING TO DO with Old School v. New School.  It has to do with TLR knowing, because he's managed 5,000+ baseball games, EXACTLY what was going to happen if Yermin jacked that 3-0 pitch.  He also KNEW that the game hadn't changed to the point where the Twins would just overlook this and not retaliate. Anyone thinking that WOULDN"T happen is just naive. 

16. Lastly, a lot is being made of TLR not having a problem with the Twins reaction.  I don't think he encouraged or condoned it.  I just think he knew that was going to happen, and when it did, it drove home the point of why he gave Yermin the take sign in the first place. 

17. There have been a LOT of guys injured over the years from being hit by a pitched ball.  There have been ZERO games outcomes changed by swinging at a 3-0 pitch with a 15-4 lead in the 9th inning. 

18. So, anyone criticizing TLR is effectively ignoring the risks of the former for something that might be fun, but has ZERO benefit to winning a baseball game, which is the point of playing them. 

I'm not apologizing for TLR here. I'm saying he was WAY more savvy about the situation than any of his critics have been. And certainly WAY more savvy than Yermin Mercedes, who appears to have only been thinking about himself. 

Apparently we just had to ... wait for it.

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Quin Grand Master

Quin

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8 minutes ago, Kyyle23 said:

I want to know what people like Tray and VAFan think of CC's comments.  Their entire premise is "Tony has managed 5000 games he has forgotten more than you have ever learned about the game", when a borderline hall of fame player is saying the opposite 

What does CC know about pitching?

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wegner Grand Master

wegner

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10 minutes ago, harkness99 said:

CC is pissed lol...

I don't appreciate his language....just kidding, that rant was Fucking Awesome!!

It comes down to this in my opinion...when you put in a position player to pitch it is because you are trying to save your bullpen.  That is fine and it can be fun, but you have no business complaining when someone hits a ball to the moon off of that position player.  

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Look at Ray Ray Run Grand Master

Look at Ray Ray Run

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15 minutes ago, Kyyle23 said:

I want to know what people like Tray and VAFan think of CC's comments.  Their entire premise is "Tony has managed 5000 games he has forgotten more than you have ever learned about the game", when a borderline hall of fame player is saying the opposite 

5000 > 561 obviously guy. Don't be so obtuse! LaRussa has 10 times the experience!

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