Steve Stone / Yoan Moncada's "Lack of Effort and Interest"

[South Side Hit Men]

I listen to games, watch only a few (don't have cable). I don't see a lot of ripping on Yoan in game threads, nor criticism on the radio broadcasts.

Does Steve Stone throw a lot of shade at Yoan Moncada during games, and do fans think Yoan doesn't play hard on a regular basis?

Not saying Yoan's efforts are on par with Jose Abreu's, don't see many across baseball who have that level of intensity. However, when I read media or posts here, listen to radio broadcasts, or watch highlights, beyond criticism at times about not calling off a fly / not listening to call outs on a fly ball, I don't see much criticism of Moncada who I really like, and feel plays hard batting and defensively. 

When I think of "lack of effort" or "interest", I think of a player like Javier Baez, great at times, totally uninterested at others. I don't see any current Sox player in the same light, including Yoan. Watching more games last year when they were televised on WGN, and seeing highlights and on broadcasts, I felt Yoan was busting his ass while gutting out terrible COVID symptoms last season.

 Not trying to have a discussion about Yoan vs. Jose, but rather does Steve Stone have valid criticism of Yoan in terms of having a "lack of effort and interest" during ballgames on a regular basis?

 

[pcq]

19 minutes ago, South Side Hit Men said:

I listen to games, watch only a few (don't have cable). I don't see a lot of ripping on Yoan in game threads, nor criticism on the radio broadcasts.

Does Steve Stone throw a lot of shade at Yoan Moncada during games, and do fans think Yoan doesn't play hard on a regular basis?

Not saying Yoan's efforts are on par with Jose Abreu's, don't see many across baseball who have that level of intensity. However, when I read media or posts here, listen to radio broadcasts, or watch highlights, beyond criticism at times about not calling off a fly / not listening to call outs on a fly ball, I don't see much criticism of Moncada who I really like, and feel plays hard batting and defensively. 

When I think of "lack of effort" or "interest", I think of a player like Javier Baez, great at times, totally uninterested at others. I don't see any current Sox player in the same light, including Yoan. Watching more games last year when they were televised on WGN, and seeing highlights and on broadcasts, I felt Yoan was busting his ass while gutting out terrible COVID symptoms last season.

 Not trying to have a discussion about Yoan vs. Jose, but rather does Steve Stone have valid criticism of Yoan in terms of having a "lack of effort and interest" during ballgames on a regular basis?

 

Everyone brings their own personality to the game. If Yoan was dogging it  Jose would get in his face. 

[Green Line]

The Sox org really loves drama.  Good for fan entertainment I guess!

[Lillian]

Moncada strikes me as the type of guy who might not be able to stay highly motivated, after getting a big long term contract. I hope that's not the case, but he has already locked up a fortune, at a much younger age than the typical free agent. Let's hope that he still has the strong competitive drive to get the most out of his exceptional natural talent. Abreu is indeed the perfect mentor to have around all of the young Latin players on this team.

Edited May 15, 2021 by Lillian

[caulfield12]

8 minutes ago, Lillian said:

Moncada strikes me as the type of guy who might not be able to stay highly motivated, after getting a big long term contract. I hope that's not the case, but he has already locked up a fortune, at a much younger age than the typical free agent. Let's hope that he still has the strong competitive drive to get the most out of his exceptional natural talent. Abreu is indeed the perfect mentor to have around all of the young Latin players on this team.

Somehow I have a feeling nobody will say the same thing about Kelenic or Lucas Giolito if they sign extensions.

Each Latin American player is different.  Sal Perez was given a second extension because he was outperforming the first, something like $7 million for five years...which he signed simply to guarantee a better future for his family.  He got yet another one recently and is having one of his best all-around seasons so far in his career.

Not every Cuban is Puig or Yoenis Cespedes, for example.

If you remove the Covid-19 year...let’s assume he ends up somewhere between 750-825 OPS, maybe 850, he’s one of the 25-30 most valuable players in the sport due to his defense.

Was Abreu coasting after the first couple of seasons of his first deal?  His 2014-15 numbers seemed almost like outliers or anomalies until 2020.  

[Lillian]

4 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

Somehow I have a feeling nobody will say the same thing about Kelenic or Lucas Giolito if they sign extensions.

Each Latin American player is different.  Sal Perez was given a second extension because he was outperforming the first, something like $7 million for five years...which he signed simply to guarantee a better future for his family.  He got yet another one recently and is having one of his best all-around seasons so far in his career.

Not every Cuban is Puig or Yoenis Cespedes, for example.

If you remove the Covid-19 year...let’s assume he ends up somewhere between 750-825 OPS, maybe 850, he’s one of the 25-30 most valuable players in the sport due to his defense.

Was Abreu coasting after the first couple of seasons of his first deal?  His 2014-15 numbers seemed almost like outliers or anomalies until 2020.  

Just to clarify: My suggestion that Moncada may not be the kind of guy, who could remain highly motivated after getting a huge contract, has nothing to do with his being a Latino. That is why I said that Abreu was such a great mentor, and I might add role model. In fact, it is only human nature to be a little complacent, once one is guaranteed a fortune. It has nothing to do with his nationality, 

[Tnetennba]

Moncada seems injury prone when he goes all out, i.e. legging out a ground out.  Rarely do I see a time where is loafing or lazy on a defensive play, with the exception of the inexplicable issues he is having with popups.  Between Covid recovery and being a bit injury prone I think he is finding a balance between all out effort and staying healthy and on the field.  He helps no one if he has to sit out banged up.  I am not entirely sure what Stone is inferring in those tweets though.

[Dick Allen]

Moncada has never seemed to me to really enjoy playing baseball. It often seems he would rather be doing anything else. But he has worked his ass off, and his talent is off the charts. I am glad he is on the team.

[fathom]

I’m fine with him dogging it to avoid injury 

[Greydawgfan1]

I think the idea he isn’t interested in baseball is literally the worst take in Sox history 

[fathom]

1 minute ago, Tnetennba said:

Moncada seems injury prone when he goes all out, i.e. legging out a ground out.  Rarely do I see a time where is loafing or lazy on a defensive play, with the exception of the inexplicable issues he is having with popups.  Between Covid recovery and being a bit injury prone I think he is finding a balance between all out effort and staying healthy and on the field.  He helps no one if he has to sit out banged up.  I am not entirely sure what Stone is inferring in those tweets though.

Been about 3 times in the last week Stoney made a comment about Yoan’s hustle

[Chick Mercedes]

He’s still got the Covid long haul. Yeah thats it.

[Tnetennba]

1 minute ago, fathom said:

Been about 3 times in the last week Stoney made a comment about Yoan’s hustle

Huh.  I don't follow Stone on twitter so I missed that.  He's the baseball analyst so I'll have to take his word for what he's seeing.  I don't have any complaints about Moncada's hustle - just quizzical about those pop-ups.

[Greydawgfan1]

Gold glove defense and is hitting nice offensively but sure he only wants to make music looooool

Edited May 15, 2021 by Greydawgfan1

[fathom]

2 minutes ago, Tnetennba said:

Huh.  I don't follow Stone on twitter so I missed that.  He's the baseball analyst so I'll have to take his word for what he's seeing.  I don't have any complaints about Moncada's hustle - just quizzical about those pop-ups.

Comments during the game 

[Tnetennba]

Just now, fathom said:

Comments during the game 

Hahahah shows how often I'm not paying attention to everything said.?

[Lillian]

The long grind of an entire baseball season is a challenge for any player. Having an extremely competitive nature, and a ceaseless drive to be the best are not easily attainable traits. He may just not be one of those exceptionally driven players, when it comes to baseball. There are many other things in life, and not every player is obsessed with being a baseball player. Unfortunately, that's probably what it takes to be great at the game.  

There might be an inverse relationship between natural talent and relentless drive. The more talent one has, the less they have had to rely upon that competitive drive. Yoan certainly has plenty of natural talent. He is an exceptional athlete. You can look no further than a couple of his teammates, to find the opposite. Vaughn and Madrigal are two guys who have probably always had to work harder than others, to get to where they wanted to be. Again, it's just human nature.

Edited May 15, 2021 by Lillian

[caulfield12]

Not everyone can emote like Hendriks, Hamilton, Yermin and TA out there...Ozzie and Juan Uribe, etc.

 

This was a rap on Carlos Rodon too, about not being as emotional or into games, Jon Garland too.

But we have really seen Carlos come out his shell this season.  He was misunderstood by a lot of his detractors.

 

And there have been a lot of times Abreu dogged it down to first or made lackadaisical plays on defense.

[GermanSoxFan]

Yoan makes everything look effortless (except popups) , especially on defense. But I never equated that with a lack of hustle. People gave Cano shit for dogging it all the time and he managed to have a HOF-caliber career if it hadn’t been for the whole PED thing.

[almagest]

Normally I like Stone but this is needless drama. Yoan is having a fine season.

[caulfield12]

1 minute ago, Lillian said:

The long grind of an entire baseball season is a challenge for any player. Having an extremely competitive nature, and a ceaseless drive to be the best are not easily attainable traits. He may just not be one of those exceptionally driven players, when it comes to baseball. There are many other things in life, and not every player is obsessed with being a baseball player. Unfortunately, that's probably what it takes to be great at the game.  

Then he would have ended up like Rusney Castillo, Yasmani Tomas, Puig, Cespedes, Hector Mendoza, etc.

Byron Buxton didn’t have the drive when he was underperforming for much of the last five years?  What about Josh Hamilton, another “top prospect in all of baseball” at one point that took years and years to figure it out?   Or Matt Bush?  There are so many factors at play here beyond talent.

[Lillian]

4 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

Not everyone can emote like Hendriks, Hamilton, Yermin and TA out there...Ozzie and Juan Uribe, etc.

 

This was a rap on Carlos Rodon too, about not being as emotional or into games, Jon Garland too.

But we have really seen Carlos come out his shell this season.  He was misunderstood by a lot of his detractors.

 

And there have been a lot of times Abreu dogged it down to first or made lackadaisical plays on defense.

Demonstrable emotion and burning intensity are not necessarily the same thing. One can be very driven, but not outwardly emotional.  

[caulfield12]

Stone is just jealous his Nationwide is On Your Side will never in a million years top a reggaeton video...and he can’t get away with wearing that many gold chains.  Or effortlessly flick balls out of the stadium to LCF.

[GermanSoxFan]

I‘d rather watch Moncada mail it in on a routine grounder from time to time than having to watch bad “gritty“ players.

[Lillian]

I have no idea what is inside Yoan Moncada's head and heart. I just hope that he is able to take advantage of his exceptional natural talent and athleticism, to become the great player that he likely has the potential to become. So far, the results are underwhelming.