Ten relievers who could be traded, ranked

[caulfield12]

https://www.mlb.com/news/mlb-trade-deadline-relievers-ranked?partnerId=zh-20210613-422626-MLB-1-A&qid=1026&utm_id=zh-20210613-422626-MLB-1-A&bt_ee=hIRDhyyRLZaDuM9MgxDAaTapE%2B8%2FYSUEXizMstkgU69Gb%2FvIggcqdTXUvgJQgR%2Ba&bt_ts=1623596688786
 

Would add either Daniel Norris or Matthew Boyd to the list...along with Michael Fulmer.

Don’t see Staumont, Barlow, Brentz or Zimmer leaving KC without serious overpays.  Of course, they’d be happy to give up Holland or Wade Davis.

[Chicago White Sox]

Iglesias & Hudson (if healthy) are both names I like.

[Tony]

I'm still not overly convinced they need another arm. 

If I had my pick, it would be a bat. 

Granted, the health of the entire pitching staff has been pretty insane and I don't totally expect that to continue....however if it does by October, you're looking at Lynn-Los-Gio-Dallas as the rotation with Hendricks-Crochet-Kopech-Cease-Bummer out there. 

[caulfield12]

With Wright, Lambert, Stiever, Tomshaw and Lopez the only depth (after Kopech), it would behoove them to get an experienced swing guy.

Someone mentioned bring Detwiler back.  Someone like that, Junior Guerra, etc.   Low cost addition that affords you some flexibility while you send Foster down.

 

Definitely stay in touch and keep asking on guys like Iglesias, Hudson and Rodriguez.

[caulfield12]

9 minutes ago, Tony said:

I'm still not overly convinced they need another arm. 

If I had my pick, it would be a bat. 

Granted, the health of the entire pitching staff has been pretty insane and I don't totally expect that to continue....however if it does by October, you're looking at Lynn-Los-Gio-Dallas as the rotation with Hendricks-Crochet-Kopech-Cease-Bummer out there. 

If Vaughn and Mercedes can pick it up again, they should be fine.

That said, veteran insurance in the form of Nelson Cruz, Haniger, Starling Marte, Peralta, Gallo, etc., would be huge.  Not to mention it would limit additional exposure to Leury starts.

Or they can go in the direction of E.Escobar/Frazier/McMahon at second. 

We still can’t count on Eaton, nor Robert/Jimenez returning seamlessly.

Edited June 13, 2021 by caulfield12

[CentralChamps21]

At full strength the Sox have Hendriks, Marshall, Heuer, Kopech, Bummer, Crochet, Fry. You get to move one starter to relief for the playoffs as your 8th reliever, so unless you think you're getting a huge upgrade over one of the names listed, it's not worth making a trade.

I'd rather go after a 2B, preferably a lefty or switch.

[caulfield12]

Just now, WhiteSoxFan1993 said:

At full strength the Sox have Hendriks, Marshall, Heuer, Kopech, Bummer, Crochet, Fry. You get to move one starter to relief for the playoffs as your 8th reliever, so unless you think you're getting a huge upgrade over one of the names listed, it's not worth making a trade.

I'd rather go after a 2B, preferably a lefty or switch.

McMahon wouldn’t cost a lot and wouldn’t block Madrigal long-term, either.

[YourWhatHurts]

Hudson would be nice.  Expensive but nice.

[caulfield12]

3 minutes ago, YourWhatHurts said:

Hudson would be nice.  Expensive but nice.

The one thing giving WASH hope is the Braves falling into disarray, but you also have a Phillies team determined to advance and looking better after the Yankees’ series this weekend.

[CentralChamps21]

19 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

McMahon wouldn’t cost a lot and wouldn’t block Madrigal long-term, either.

McMahon has 2 more years before free agency, don't think he'd be that cheap.

[caulfield12]

34 minutes ago, WhiteSoxFan1993 said:

McMahon has 2 more years before free agency, don't think he'd be that cheap.

Look at his career fWAR numbers...the big question is how much better on defense.

[fathom]

2 hours ago, YourWhatHurts said:

Hudson would be nice.  Expensive but nice.

He has elbow issues at the moment 

[TheFutureIsNear]

I think people are panicking on Marshall too soon. Despite some early struggles I still like our bullpen a good bit honestly. Pretty much any team ever could use 1 more arm, but it’s not a major priority in my eyes. If 1 of the starters goes down is a bigger concern to me…a long man that can start a few games might be best, if possible. 

Give me another OF’er and a better utility guy to reinforce the offense. D Backs are a good trade partner target for me- David Peralta and Asdrubal Cabrera would be ideal and probably wouldn’t cost that much. 

[hi8is]

They’ll get at least a reliever and bat.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

6 hours ago, Tony said:

I'm still not overly convinced they need another arm. 

If I had my pick, it would be a bat. 

Granted, the health of the entire pitching staff has been pretty insane and I don't totally expect that to continue....however if it does by October, you're looking at Lynn-Los-Gio-Dallas as the rotation with Hendricks-Crochet-Kopech-Cease-Bummer out there. 

I'll try to convince you. As you said the staff health has been great. However with the full season after the short season once you get into August and September I'm expecting some pretty tired arms. Then multiple rounds of the playoffs. Of course the difference from 2020 to 2021 may apply to every team and pitchers you may trade for . Then throw in the guys on innings limits and Kopech, Crochet, Rodon and young relievers who have never pitched a full season like Heuer.

If the Sox want to limit Rodon or other starters innings as much as they can down the stretch a much larger burden will fall to the pen. To me this means I'd like to get 2 arms before any positional talent, preferably veteran arms who have been through the grind before.  By the time all those arms reach the World Series can we honestly say Kopech, Crochet and Rodon will still be in the mix ? Those 3  barely pitched at all last year. Rodon pitched about 42 innings combined in 2019 and 2020. Kopech sat out last year and was rehabbing in 2019 so  0 innings in the 2 previous years. Crochet in 2020 pitched 9 innings between the Sox and the Tennessee Volunteers and 65 innings for the Vols in 2019.

Edited June 14, 2021 by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

[caulfield12]

6 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

I'll try to convince you. As you said the staff health has been great. However with the full season after the short season once you get into August and September I'm expecting some pretty tired arms. Then multiple rounds of the playoffs. Of course the difference from 2020 to 2021 may apply to every team and pitchers you may trade for . Then throw in the guys on innings limits and Kopech, Crochet, Rodon and young relievers who have never pitched a full season like Heuer.

If the Sox want to limit Rodon or other starters innings as much as they can down the stretch a much larger burden will fall to the pen. To me this means I'd like to get 2 arms before any positional talent, preferably veteran arms who have been through the grind before.  By the time all those arms reach the World Series can we honestly say Kopech, Crochet and Rodon will still be in the mix ? Those 3  barely pitched at all last year. Rodon pitched about 42 innings combined in 2019 and 2020. Kopech sat out last year and was rehabbing in 2019 so  0 innings in the 2 previous years. Crochet in 2020 pitched 9 innings between the Sox and the Tennessee Volunteers and 65 innings for the Vols in 2019.

We need Verlander...haha.  In all seriousness, we don’t need to overpay for Scherzer, but we certainly need to fortify the quality depth for our top six, as the falloff to Charlotte arms is 2003 level precipitous.   Or late 2000 season worrisome.

 

 

 

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

6 hours ago, caulfield12 said:

The one thing giving WASH hope is the Braves falling into disarray, but you also have a Phillies team determined to advance and looking better after the Yankees’ series this weekend.

Also the Angels clawing their way back to  over .500 .

[GreenSox]

Sox lead the majors in bullpen WAR.
We need more starting pitching   for next season and the next and the next.

[Bob Sacamano]

17 hours ago, Tony said:

I'm still not overly convinced they need another arm. 

If I had my pick, it would be a bat. 

Granted, the health of the entire pitching staff has been pretty insane and I don't totally expect that to continue....however if it does by October, you're looking at Lynn-Los-Gio-Dallas as the rotation with Hendricks-Crochet-Kopech-Cease-Bummer out there. 

Need relievers for sure. Can't be blowing games late.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

1 hour ago, GreenSox said:

Sox lead the majors in bullpen WAR.
We need more starting pitching   for next season and the next and the next.

I agree the Sox will need more starting pitching but that doesn't address what we need this year.

We can probably agree that Lynn has been our best starter and should continue to be going forward. Our next best arms have been Rodon , Hendrix, Kopech and Crochet. 3 of the next 4 best are serious question marks to even have enough stamina left to reach the playoffs let alone go through the playoff and get to the World Series. Rodon, Kopech and Crochet are going to reach pitching limits . Rodon should probably be limited to 5 innings pitched per start from now on. Kopech has been shut down for injury but many suspect it's also an effort to limit his innings.  What Crochet can withstand on his arm is a crapshoot. Trade for some pitcher with a good health history who also pitch well in relief maybe 1 multiple inning guy and 1 late inning guy. The pitching staff that holds up the best in the normal season after the short season will be the favorite to at least reach the World Series.

I'm not worried too much about the position players although another LH power bat would be nice since our record against RHP is still mediocre. Just find one guy who rakes against RHP. Escobar isn't really that guy since his strong side is hitting right handed but he's still got good pop against RHP. Starling Marte is pretty good against both RHP and LHP and is a very good fielder in the OF but I fear 2nd base is the weakest link in the lineup and the easiest and cheapest place to find a Left handed bat. Jerry may pony up for some salary but I'm not expecting much.

Edited June 14, 2021 by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

[CentralChamps21]

10 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

I agree the Sox will need more starting pitching but that doesn't address what we need this year.

We can probably agree that Lynn has been our best starter and should continue to be going forward. Our next best arms have been Rodon , Hendrix, Kopech and Crochet. 3 of the next 4 best are serious question marks to even have enough stamina left to reach the playoffs let alone go through the playoff and get to the World Series. Rodon, Kopech and Crochet are going to reach pitching limits . Rodon should probably be limited to 5 innings pitched per start from now on. Kopech has been shut down for injury but many suspect it's also an effort to limit his innings.  What Crochet can withstand on his arm is a crapshoot. Trade for some pitcher with a good health history who also pitch well in relief maybe 1 multiple inning guy and 1 late inning guy. The pitching staff that holds up the best in the normal season after the short season will be the favorite to at least reach the World Series.

I'm not worried too much about the position players although another LH power bat would be nice since our record against RHP is still mediocre. Just find one guy who rakes against RHP. Escobar isn't really that guy since his strong side is hitting right handed but he's still got good pop against RHP. Starling Marte is pretty good against both RHP and LHP and is a very good fielder in the OF but I fear 2nd base is the weakest link in the lineup and the easiest and cheapest place to find a Left handed bat. Jerry may pony up for some salary but I'm not expecting much.

I'd rather see Rodon have fewer starts and be allowed to go deeper rather than be limited to 5 innings per start. He should be pushed back every time there's an off day, and Kopech should spot start for him during long stretches where there are no off days.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

44 minutes ago, WhiteSoxFan1993 said:

I'd rather see Rodon have fewer starts and be allowed to go deeper rather than be limited to 5 innings per start. He should be pushed back every time there's an off day, and Kopech should spot start for him during long stretches where there are no off days.

I think he has to make his starts every 5 days to keep his rhythm. As the innings pile up Carlos may not be able to find that extra gear of throwing from 98 to 100 when he needs it or he may  go through a dead arm period and just plain and simple break down again. The deeper you go the more tired you get and fatigue is a big factor in injury.

Sure it would suck  every time he's taken out after 75 pitches of so no matter the inning or if he has a no hitter or not but if the goal is the World Series and the Sox can get a good lead in the division race , every starting pitcher will see his workload curtailed. That's the whole reason why I prefer the Sox load up on relief arms.

Starting pitchers are babied now. There's really no reason for any of them to go deeper into games unless they have built a tolerance to it like Lynn who is a horse. Rodon isn't even close to that level of arm durability.

[Tnetennba]

2 hours ago, manbearpuig said:

Need relievers for sure. Can't be blowing games late.

A proven RH setup man is priority #1 or 1A IMO.  RF help would also be very welcome.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

19 hours ago, WhiteSoxFan1993 said:

At full strength the Sox have Hendriks, Marshall, Heuer, Kopech, Bummer, Crochet, Fry. You get to move one starter to relief for the playoffs as your 8th reliever, so unless you think you're getting a huge upgrade over one of the names listed, it's not worth making a trade.

I'd rather go after a 2B, preferably a lefty or switch.

To make it all the way through the playoffs and win a World Series the Sox will have to use at least 4 starting pitchers and maybe even 5 .

Let's just use the most recent World Series as an example. The Nationals started 5 different starting pitchers. Scherzer , Strasburg, Anibal Sanchez, Patrick Corbin and Joe Ross. 4 of those 5 pitched more innings than  Rodon is probably capable of this season.

When you combine regular season with playoffs Scherzer pitched 202 innings, Strasburg ( the WS MVP ) 253 innings, Anibal Sanchez 184 IP and Patrick Corbin 225 IP.

If you look at the Astros they had 4 different stating pitchers in the World Series  3 of which threw more combined regular season and playoff innings than Rodon is probably capable of. Gerrit Cole 253 IP, Justin Verlander 258 IP, and Zack Greineke 234 IP. The 4th starter was Jose Urquidy .

If we assume Rodon might not make it to the post season unless his innings pitched are cut way back  150 innings might be the very top of the ladder that we can expect for him this year and even that seems unlikely.That leaves Lynn, Giolito ,Keuchel and Cease among our starting pitchers. The most IP Cease has ever thrown is 141 between Charlotte and the Sox in 2019. Dallas Keuchel hasn't pitched over 200 innings since 2018. He will probably pitch more innings this year than 2019 and 2020 combined. If you include Kopech as a postseason starter he didn't pitch any innings in  2019 and 2020.

[Harry Chappas]

Can never have enough pitching. 

Go get Kimbrel in a three way deal.