Jake Burger 4 DH!

[Chick Mercedes]

4 minutes ago, manbearpuig said:

We're talking about defense here. And anyway, we don't even know if Burger would hit in the majors at this point.

Its always been a hypothetical based on Burger panning out. 

[southsider2k5]

7 minutes ago, Chick Mercedes said:

Moncada is not an upgrade to Garcia or Mendick? Burger in the lineup is not an upgrade over Mendick? Adding power is not an upgrade?

I am not positive that Moncada is a defensive up grade to Mendick or Garcia.  I would tend to rank them Mendick, Leury, Moncada defensively.

If Burger really can handle 2nd defensively HE is the guy you move there.

[Chick Mercedes]

1 minute ago, southsider2k5 said:

I am not positive that Moncada is a defensive up grade to Mendick or Garcia.  I would tend to rank them Mendick, Leury, Moncada defensively.

If Burger really can handle 2nd defensively HE is the guy you move there.

Burger has no range at 2b, so if there is a non starter, that to me is it. So agree to disagree y’all, fair enough. Gotta be out for a minute 

[chitownsportsfan]

He can't handle 2B.

[Bob Sacamano]

Just now, chitownsportsfan said:

He can't handle 2B.

I tend to agree. He'll easily be below average and just in for the bat. Having said that, I have no problem having him DH and split 1B with Abreu with occasional starts at 3B with Moncada DHing to give him a break.

[southsider2k5]

1 minute ago, Chick Mercedes said:

Burger has no range at 2b, so if there is a non starter, that to me is it. So agree to disagree y’all, fair enough. Gotta be out for a minute 

Honestly all that is happening here is you are making the case for why Jake Burger finds a new home at the trade deadline for someone who does fit this team as it is currently constructed.

[caulfield12]

12 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

Honestly all that is happening here is you are making the case for why Jake Burger finds a new home at the trade deadline for someone who does fit this team as it is currently constructed.

That’s four guys who belong at 1B/DH (obviously, Moncada going nowhere besides 3B) in Abreu, Vaughn, Eloy and Burger for next year.

That’s not even counting Collins/Grandal and Sheets.

Something’s gotta give.  I guess it’s possible they hold onto one of Burger/Sheets as insurance for Abreu next year and into the future.

Really have no idea what they’re planning for Jimenez…hard to imagine if Vaughn continues to progress they would force Vaughn into DH in order to play Eloy in the field.  2022 and beyond is the bigger question.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[ChiSox59]

6 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

That’s four guys who belong at 1B/DH (obviously, Moncada going nowhere besides 3B) in Abreu, Vaughn, Eloy and Burger for next year.

That’s not even counting Collins/Grandal and Sheets.

Something’s gotta give.  I guess it’s possible they hold onto one of Burger/Sheets as insurance for Abreu next year and into the future.

Really have no idea what they’re planning for Jimenez…hard to imagine if Vaughn continues to progress they would force Vaughn into DH in order to play Eloy in the field.  2022 and beyond is the bigger question.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Vaughn has been more than serviceable in LF and I see now reason to jam him into DH/1B at this point.  He can cover LF adequately.  Let Eloy DH most of the time.  

[southsider2k5]

4 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

Vaughn has been more than serviceable in LF and I see now reason to jam him into DH/1B at this point.  He can cover LF adequately.  Let Eloy DH most of the time.  

I feel like Vaughn has played himself into a long term OF job.  He's even shown enough arm where I could see him getting some run in RF.

[caulfield12]

2 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

I feel like Vaughn has played himself into a long term OF job.  He's even shown enough arm where I could see him getting some run in RF.

Then you’re left with the quandary of putting a Jimenez/Robert/Vaughn outfield and the various injury and defensive risks into play.

If you were getting enough offense from second, it would be fine to put one of Jimenez/Abreu/Vaughn at DH (or Vaughn at first with Jose DH) and then put Engel, Hamilton or Goodwin in the other spot.

Or the return of the healthier/rejuvenated Eaton.

Musical chairs for the remainder of this season…unless we add a legit starting outfielder like a Marte.

[ChiSox59]

1 minute ago, caulfield12 said:

Then you’re left with the quandary of putting a Jimenez/Robert/Vaughn outfield and the various injury and defensive risks into play.

If you were getting enough offense from second, it would be fine to put one of Jimenez/Abreu/Vaughn at DH (or Vaughn at first with Jose DH) and then put Engel, Hamilton or Goodwin in the other spot.

Or the return of the healthier/rejuvenated Eaton.

Musical chairs for the remainder of this season…unless we add a legit starting outfielder like a Marte.

Eloy DH / Vaughn LF / legitimate LH hitting RF via FA/trade is the clear route here.  

I suspect we will see some Eloy/Robert/Vaughn lineups in August and September, but everyone know that is not a long term solution. 

Edited July 1, 2021 by ChiSox59

[southsider2k5]

1 minute ago, caulfield12 said:

Then you’re left with the quandary of putting a Jimenez/Robert/Vaughn outfield and the various injury and defensive risks into play.

If you were getting enough offense from second, it would be fine to put one of Jimenez/Abreu/Vaughn at DH (or Vaughn at first with Jose DH) and then put Engel, Hamilton or Goodwin in the other spot.

Or the return of the healthier/rejuvenated Eaton.

Musical chairs for the remainder of this season…unless we add a legit starting outfielder like a Marte.

A lot of this will be decided by Yermin Mercedes and what the MiLB OFs have to do with it.

If Yermin recovers, he probably plays himself into another year of DH.  I

If not it makes it easy for the Sox to use mostly Jimenez and Vaughn at DH and LF, with someone else playing RF.

If these kids can step up for an OF spot, they have an opportunity if Mercedes fails, but more work to do if he doesn't.

I wouldn't look at Jake Lamb and Brian Goodwin as future options as at least one of them, and maybe both, will be losing their jobs and roster spots in the next month or so to Luis and Eloy.  Their 40 man spots will loom large as the team tries to reconfigure the roster for both of them. 

[Harry Chappas]

Burger having a massive year in AAA and entering talks of top prospect status is such a massive win for this organization it is insane to think.

Same with Sheets.

This offseason becomes much more interesting with chips and money.

I have now taken the stance of letting Burger mash in AAA and figure it out in the offseason. 

 

[South Side Hit Men]

Projected fWAR 2021 / 2022 / 2023

• Moncada 3.2 / 3.3 / 3.2
• Jimenez 2.9 / 2.9 / 2.8
• Anderson 2.7 / 2.7 / 3.0
• Madrigal 1.7 / 1.9 / 2.2
• Abreu 1.8 / 1.2 / 0.4

Flavors of the month

• Burger 0.1 / 0.3 / 0.5
• Lamb 0.1 / -0.1 / -0.1 
• Goodwin  -0.2 / -0.2 / -0.4
• Sheets -1.0 / -0.9 / -0.8

Somewhat perplexed:

• Vaughn -0.2 / 0.2 / 0.2 (Assuming dinged for projected 1B vs. a bump for LF).

[AJ'S Cousin]

I don't want Marte. Mercedes is not a Ford, He is definitely not what he was in April. It was only a matter of time until he flamed out. Now we see why he's been a career minor leaguer. Yeah, I thank him for what he did to start the season. It WAS must see TV for awhile. Time to move on. Burger, Vaughn, Sheets, Engel, Robert, Jimenez and not even including, but you have to, Eaton, Hamilton and Goodwin. What if Frazier or Escobar come to town?? We need a legit 2nd baseman until Nick returns NEXT YEAR. Frazier preferred, Escobar second. Garcia and Mendick are fine utility guys, but they will also burn out  if they are used every day. Hamilton and Goodwin will not be needed, especially if Sheets is for real, We'll see. TLR and Hahn have there hands full. Who do you give up for Frazier?? For Escobar?? Do you actually keep Sheets on roster if Robert, Jimenez, Eaton and Engel all come back healthy?? looking forward to the chess match about to be played with the roster. Our starting 5 pitchers can weather the storm of injuries for now, but we need a 2nd baseman sooner than later, NOT Marte. Mercedes should be gone as soon as Jimenez returns and gets into the outfield DH rotation. Frankly, I'd leave Vaughn in left. He's an athlete it seems and can play the outfield, 1st or DH. Same for sheets. Burger as a 2nd baseman?? a BIG MAYBE if you can't get either Escobar or Frazier. 

Curious to hear from you guys WHAT YOU'D GIVE UP FOR FRAZIER?? FOR ESCOBAR?? 

They are not equal, Frazier is way better and will cost you more of course. I say Marshall should be part of any deal. LOL, maybe even Foster. Burr looks good, Frye is back, you need Ruiz to eat innings and of course Kopech is also due back any minute.  

 

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

2 hours ago, caulfield12 said:

That’s four guys who belong at 1B/DH (obviously, Moncada going nowhere besides 3B) in Abreu, Vaughn, Eloy and Burger for next year.

That’s not even counting Collins/Grandal and Sheets.

Something’s gotta give.  I guess it’s possible they hold onto one of Burger/Sheets as insurance for Abreu next year and into the future.

Really have no idea what they’re planning for Jimenez…hard to imagine if Vaughn continues to progress they would force Vaughn into DH in order to play Eloy in the field.  2022 and beyond is the bigger question.

No one want's to hear it but the Sox will eventually trade someone from the core, guys on the roster now or prospects nearest to MLB like Sheets, and Burger . When you look at all the 1st base DH types  you have Abreu, Vaughn, Eloy, Mercedes, Sheets and possibly Burger it's inevitable.

Edited July 1, 2021 by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

2 hours ago, South Side Hit Men said:

Projected fWAR 2021 / 2022 / 2023

• Moncada 3.2 / 3.3 / 3.2
• Jimenez 2.9 / 2.9 / 2.8
• Anderson 2.7 / 2.7 / 3.0
• Madrigal 1.7 / 1.9 / 2.2
• Abreu 1.8 / 1.2 / 0.4

Flavors of the month

• Burger 0.1 / 0.3 / 0.5
• Lamb 0.1 / -0.1 / -0.1 
• Goodwin  -0.2 / -0.2 / -0.4
• Sheets -1.0 / -0.9 / -0.8

Somewhat perplexed:

• Vaughn -0.2 / 0.2 / 0.2 (Assuming dinged for projected 1B vs. a bump for LF).

You are somewhat perplexed because projection systems do not rate the young highly until they have some proof that they are good. You constantly over rate him as a defender in LF in a small sample size.  He will not get any faster and the longer he plays there the more he will become exposed when he isn't throwing out a snail  like Cruz who made a stupid decision  to test him and was gunned down by a mile.

Until you have a substantial enough amount of chances in LF and he can prove he can hit 75% (RHP) of the pitchers in baseball at a better than .700 OPS the projections will not improve.

I tried telling you this earlier and now you are perplexed and think he was dinged for 1st base because he should 've got a bump for his defense in LF ?

Edited July 1, 2021 by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

[South Side Hit Men]

The bottom line is the Sox will continue to play Vaughn as a regular, and the team expect him to continue to play well.

You have all these platoon scenarios running through your mind, but in the real world the Sox are utilizing their roster correctly, for now and in the future, by continuing their plan, playing Vaughn regularly. If it were up to you, he wouldn’t have the chance to improve relegated to a platoon basis. 

When Eloy returns, he will DH and or Vaughn and Eloy will get a majority of starts between LF and DH. They will ride Goodwin while he is hot, but will not be around long once the four injured OFers return.

PS - Do you need more evidence Brian Goodwin is not a capable ML outfielder, that speed doesn't make up for his poor routes, his poor fielding, his poor throws, his lack of judgement? There is a reason Goodwin is fighting just to stay at a minimum salary, this may very well be his last stop.

Edited July 1, 2021 by South Side Hit Men

[DirtySox]

 

[ShoeLessRob]

7 minutes ago, DirtySox said:

 

???

[southsider2k5]

14 minutes ago, DirtySox said:

 

Gonna guess this is more about Moncada. 

[ChiSox59]

18 minutes ago, ShoeLessRob said:

???

Woof, hope this doesn't mean Yoan is heading to IL. 

[ChiSox59]

Per DVS, Tony said Yoan is likely out this weekend.  Guessing we go with a 4 man bench this weekend and Burger gets the call. 

[southsider2k5]

7 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

Per DVS, Tony said Yoan is likely out this weekend.  Guessing we go with a 4 man bench this weekend and Burger gets the call. 

Maybe see the Burdi for Burger switch?

[joejoesox]

37 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

Gonna guess this is more about Moncada. 

yup