The Eloy-Vaughn-Burger-Sheets Conundrum

[ron883]

When Eloy returns, what do? Eloy at DH, Vaughn RF and Burger or Sheets on bench (maybe demoted for one of them)? They could go with Vaughn RF, Eloy LF and Sheets or Burger at DH.

They also may trade Sheets or Burger. Their trade values have definitely gone up since playing in the majors. Both look great. 

[VAfan]

When Eloy returns, he's going to be the best of these four, so you have to play him.  He'll likely DH mostly.  I'm hoping/expecting he'll hit behind Abreu like he did last year. 

Vaughn is most likely to continue playing LF, and has the edge over the other two.

Burger may be the second best hitter in this group -- I could see him hitting as well or better than Vaughn, but is not likely to have the power potential of Jimenez.  His challenge is he's a 3B with no OF experience.  I think Moncada should volunteer to play 2B this year, at least some of the time, so Burger's bat can get in the lineup.  Kris Bryant has played 5 positions for the Cubs, so I don't see why Moncada can't play a position where he played 200 games.  

Sheets is a nice lefty power hitter, which we don't have enough of, but tonight the Fox announcers said he's yet to hit a curve ball this year.  He doesn't play a good enough OF to push out Goodwin. So he's the mostly likely to be squeezed.  

Overall, it's a good problem to have more good hitters than you have places to play them.  

[TaylorStSox]

Doesn't really seem like much of a conundrum. You have 2 elite prospects, 1 middling prospect and 1 great story. 

[TaylorStSox]

7 minutes ago, VAfan said:

 

Burger may be the second best hitter in this group -- I could see him hitting as well or better than Vaughn

This is crazy talk. If Burger finishes his career with 10% of the oWAR Vaughn finishes with, it will be a legit miracle. 

[Springfield Soxfan]

No way Burger or Sheets gets traded. These issues usually find a way to work themselves out as someone else will go down.   Never have seen depth like this is my life.  So awesome. 

[South Side Hit Men]

Let's go back, way back. To a time some of us may not even be able to remember.

That's right, three months ago, to the last time a "conundrum" thread was created, and Eloy was presented as a "trade candidate" to accommodate Yermin "Too Legit To Quit" Mercedes.

Quote

Sooo, it appears that Yermin is legitimate. "But Ron, it's too early to declare Yermin legitimate." Wrong. I've been on the Yermin bandwagon as long as anybody. I was one of the first to identify his talents. He is here to stay. He has a great approach, he shortens his swing with 2 strikes but still crushes the ball, and he has a fast bat. The dude is going to stay. 

When Eloy comes back, there will be a bit if a logjam. Assuming Eloy is back next year, what do the Sox do? .........

Sooo, to me the only current conundrum is whether the Sox will take the opportunity to try Burger at 2B over the next few weeks, with the large division lead, or whether he will remain organizational depth /  trade bait. Hopefully the Sox will keep Burger up over Jake Lamb, though not sure whether Tony shares in that opinion, despite the fact it doesn't appear the Sox have faith of Jake playing the infield (two starts at 3B and 1B), and his corner OF ability is pretend level, at best.

Edited July 18, 2021 by South Side Hit Men

[poppysox]

4 hours ago, VAfan said:

When Eloy returns, he's going to be the best of these four, so you have to play him.  He'll likely DH mostly.  I'm hoping/expecting he'll hit behind Abreu like he did last year. 

Vaughn is most likely to continue playing LF, and has the edge over the other two.

Burger may be the second best hitter in this group -- I could see him hitting as well or better than Vaughn, but is not likely to have the power potential of Jimenez.  His challenge is he's a 3B with no OF experience.  I think Moncada should volunteer to play 2B this year, at least some of the time, so Burger's bat can get in the lineup.  Kris Bryant has played 5 positions for the Cubs, so I don't see why Moncada can't play a position where he played 200 games.  

Sheets is a nice lefty power hitter, which we don't have enough of, but tonight the Fox announcers said he's yet to hit a curve ball this year.  He doesn't play a good enough OF to push out Goodwin. So he's the mostly likely to be squeezed.  

Overall, it's a good problem to have more good hitters than you have places to play them.  

It's a Dodgers problem.  Where can we play all the good players?  Poor us.

[Chicago White Sox]

4 hours ago, VAfan said:

When Eloy returns, he's going to be the best of these four, so you have to play him.  He'll likely DH mostly.  I'm hoping/expecting he'll hit behind Abreu like he did last year. 

Vaughn is most likely to continue playing LF, and has the edge over the other two.

Burger may be the second best hitter in this group -- I could see him hitting as well or better than Vaughn, but is not likely to have the power potential of Jimenez.  His challenge is he's a 3B with no OF experience.  I think Moncada should volunteer to play 2B this year, at least some of the time, so Burger's bat can get in the lineup.  Kris Bryant has played 5 positions for the Cubs, so I don't see why Moncada can't play a position where he played 200 games.  

Sheets is a nice lefty power hitter, which we don't have enough of, but tonight the Fox announcers said he's yet to hit a curve ball this year.  He doesn't play a good enough OF to push out Goodwin. So he's the mostly likely to be squeezed.  

Overall, it's a good problem to have more good hitters than you have places to play them.  

Moncada is made of glass and playing him at 2B increases the chance he someone gets while also weakening the defense.  Just go get Escobar and call it a day.

[CentralChamps21]

Burger will be a very nice insurance policy stashed away at AAA once Eloy is back.

Sheets has a fair chance at sticking and sending Lamb packing.

Edited July 18, 2021 by WhiteSoxFan1993

[Ducksnort]

7 hours ago, VAfan said:

When Eloy returns, he's going to be the best of these four, so you have to play him.  He'll likely DH mostly.  I'm hoping/expecting he'll hit behind Abreu like he did last year. 

Vaughn is most likely to continue playing LF, and has the edge over the other two.

Burger may be the second best hitter in this group -- I could see him hitting as well or better than Vaughn, but is not likely to have the power potential of Jimenez.  His challenge is he's a 3B with no OF experience.  I think Moncada should volunteer to play 2B this year, at least some of the time, so Burger's bat can get in the lineup.  Kris Bryant has played 5 positions for the Cubs, so I don't see why Moncada can't play a position where he played 200 games.  

Sheets is a nice lefty power hitter, which we don't have enough of, but tonight the Fox announcers said he's yet to hit a curve ball this year.  He doesn't play a good enough OF to push out Goodwin. So he's the mostly likely to be squeezed.  

Overall, it's a good problem to have more good hitters than you have places to play them.  

They better DH his ass

[zisk]

7 hours ago, ron883 said:

When Eloy returns, what do? Eloy at DH, Vaughn RF and Burger or Sheets on bench (maybe demoted for one of them)? They could go with Vaughn RF, Eloy LF and Sheets or Burger at DH.

They also may trade Sheets or Burger. Their trade values have definitely gone up since playing in the majors. Both look great. 

Sheets may be traded, but Burger looks so athletically smooth in his swing and the way he runs. He is the real deal. Sheets look a bit mechanical.

 

[southsider2k5]

It will work itself out.

[CentralChamps21]

7 minutes ago, zisk said:

Sheets may be traded, but Burger looks so athletically smooth in his swing and the way he runs. He is the real deal. Sheets look a bit mechanical.

 

Neither Sheets nor Burger are getting traded unless the return is huge. There is nothing wrong with having quality guys at AAA in case there are injuries next year like we had this year. Plus, Abreu is gone after next season so that opens a spot for one of them.

[southsider2k5]

Also, for the record...

Eloy

 

Vaughn

 

 

 

 

 

Burger

 

 

Sheets

[Bob Sacamano]

27 minutes ago, WhiteSoxFan1993 said:

Neither Sheets nor Burger are getting traded unless the return is huge. There is nothing wrong with having quality guys at AAA in case there are injuries next year like we had this year. Plus, Abreu is gone after next season so that opens a spot for one of them.

Think you’re overestimating Sheets’ value. 

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

7 hours ago, TaylorStSox said:

This is crazy talk. If Burger finishes his career with 10% of the oWAR Vaughn finishes with, it will be a legit miracle. 

It would make the movie better.

[caulfield12]

27 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

Also, for the record...

Eloy

 

Vaughn

 

 

 

 

 

Burger

 

 

Sheets

I don’t think we can make any predictions on Burger as a hitter…yet.  You can’t measure drive and determination, and just to be in the position he’s in now is pretty incredible, if you look at those threads on him the last 2-3 years.  Remember all the concerns from draft year about the arm bar?  Yermin kinda let things go to his head, but Burger seemingly is one of those super high character guys.

[he gone.]

At this point? I'd give Burger a shot at 2b a few times to see what he can do. But otherwise? I'm not sure. All these guys are looking good. Also Yermin has strung together 8 games in a row with an XBH down at AAA. If that bat wakes up? Add another to the list. We saw what he could do on a hot streak - if he gets that back you have to give him another shot too. 

 

Burger is really playing with my emotions. I don't think it's getting enough love of how he is playing basically 3-4 years removed from baseball. To jump back in after that time off and look as comfortable as he is? In theory hes perfect trade bait - a bat without a home and no real path either ... but at the same time, feel like even with his recent hot streak its selling low still. 

 

I'd tend to lean:

Sheets down to AAA. Plug Burger at 2b a game or two a week. 

As for OF I'd split Vaughn and Eloy in LF about evenly. 

 

 

 

[ChiSox59]

8 hours ago, Springfield Soxfan said:

No way Burger or Sheets gets traded. These issues usually find a way to work themselves out as someone else will go down.   Never have seen depth like this is my life.  So awesome. 

No way? Lol. There is most definitely a way. In fact, in probably likely one of them gets dealt. 

[Bob Sacamano]

Just now, ChiSox59 said:

No way? Lol. There is most definitely a way. In fact, in probably likely one of them gets dealt. 

Exactly my thoughts lol

[black jack]

This year the decision is easy:  Keep them all up through September and have Eloy DH at least 5 times a week while playing the hottest bats. 

Maybe Burger can learn right in the offseason?  He's got a third base arm and looks decently athletic.  

 

Next year is when the choices are tougher.  I don't think Jose is gone after 2022.  

Tim is clearly the soul of the team, but Jose is the heart.  I'd extend him a season with a team option for 2024.  

 

[ron883]

1 hour ago, WhiteSoxFan1993 said:

Neither Sheets nor Burger are getting traded unless the return is huge. There is nothing wrong with having quality guys at AAA in case there are injuries next year like we had this year. Plus, Abreu is gone after next season so that opens a spot for one of them.

Sheets is an older 1B prospect with pedestrian minor league numbers. He's done well up here in a small sample size, but there is no way he nets a "huge" return. Zero. Ziltch.

Edited July 18, 2021 by ron883

[EloyJenkins]

Sheets is good as gone. Traded to the Diamondbacks with a pitcher makes perfect sense for Escobar. Replace lefty power with no foreseeable position with a starting 2nd base for the playoffs that has better power numbers than anyone else on the team. Burger stays with the team and probably makes the playoff roster even if he keeps this up. Sheets is just a guy, dont get too attached.

[tray]

Sox have gone to great lengths to get a LH bat with power in the past;. i.e., Griffey Jr, Thome, Dunn, LaRoach. I am not suggesting that Sheets can be on par with any of them, especially HOF hitters, but he is a LH bat with power, and that plays in the major league. He also appears to have a decent eye at the plate and good plate coverage. Lamb has had a few clutch hits...but so has Sheets. Sheets looks dangerous when he comes top the plate.  All things considered, I would keep Sheets and DFA Lamb.

I would not trade Vaughn, Sheets or Burger until they get a chance to show what they can do this year.  Then you at least have a better idea as to their trade value versus their value to the team.  Right now it is possible that they are all somewhat overrated but after a year in the league, they all might turn into special players.

[GermanSoxFan]

2 minutes ago, EloyJenkins said:

Sheets is good as gone. Traded to the Diamondbacks with a pitcher makes perfect sense for Escobar. Replace lefty power with no foreseeable position with a starting 2nd base for the playoffs that has better power numbers than anyone else on the team. Burger stays with the team and probably makes the playoff roster even if he keeps this up. Sheets is just a guy, dont get too attached.

Judging by past returns for rental hitters, Sheets for Escobar woukd be an overpay. Even superstar hitters like JDM got traded for pretty much a bag of balls.