Kris Bryant traded to Giants

[Harry Chappas]

Just now, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

The Cubs literally just traded two guys to the Sox; this narrative needs to die.

Just as the Sox did this past off-season, they allocated their resource terribly and spent their primary assets on a relief pitcher.

Let's be clear the best relief pitcher in baseball. 

[Balta1701]

1 minute ago, southsider2k5 said:

I have said it before, I don't think this deals happens without the front office knowing that #2 is happening.

This post is better with no context.

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

1 minute ago, southsider2k5 said:

I have said it before, I don't think this deals happens without the front office knowing that #2 is happening.

You are arguing this when the same front office just spent 80% of their available off-season resources on a closer/relief pitcher. You have to see the irony in that, no? My lord.

[soxfan3530]

Just now, southsider2k5 said:

I have said it before, I don't think this deals happens without the front office knowing that #2 is happening.

Agreed. Will people still be upset if someone like Seager is replacing Madrigal next year?

[southsider2k5]

1 minute ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

So who is the DH? Do the Sox just not have a DH Now?

Vaughn and Eloy are in LF/DH.

The Sox have NO right fielder. Kris Bryant filled an actual massive hole on the roster. Craig Kimbrel was a luxury item. I am so confused how you can't see how terribly this front office just spent their resources.

This seems to be a theme.

The White Sox are a better team today than they were yesterday, and a much better team than they were two days ago.

The Sox have LOADs of DH options.  They have Eloy if he doesn't play LF, and they have guys like Sheets if he does.

in 2021, having a shutdown bullpen is one of the primary ways to win in the playoffs.  We have seen it time and time again.  If you can't see the improvement in this team from Heuer to Kimbrel, you don't want to see it.

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

2 minutes ago, GermanSoxFan said:

Sox could have signed Iglesias and Givens with that kind of dough and added a lot of depth to their pen. 

With Tony at the helm, who is on record that he would prefer a star closer over an ace starter, this reeks of Tony LaRussa shenanigans 

EXACTLY!

The Sox could have signed a reliever that was projected to be nearly as good as Kimbrel in 4 months for less, and made themselves much better this year by trading for Bryant. Anyway you slice it, this team chose to do something that no top-of-the-line organization has done; pay two closers prime market value.

[Balta1701]

11 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

There are 2 ways this trade turns into a W.

1) Win the world series.

2) Jerry has approved a major budget increase and this doesn't stop the Sox from signing a real RF like Conforto and legitimate SP in FA this offseason.  I guess I can live with Hernandez at 2B, though I'd prfer someone like Semien and shift Hernandez into a Leury role.

Otherwise....terrible use of limited payroll space, and of an awesome player and roster fit in Madrigal. 

A major payroll increase up to at least $170 million is all but guaranteed.

That said, I don't see the White Sox spending a huge amount on a starter this offseason, because they're still going to plan for Kopech in the rotation and probably should. I would say it's a good idea to bring in some depth again.

RF, I'm not sure what they'll do, because there's like 3 or 4 guys they have to figure out what they're going to do with. My guess is they could be looking to pull something off in a trade market for that.

[ChiSox59]

3 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

I have said it before, I don't think this deals happens without the front office knowing that #2 is happening.

I can't give them that benefit of the doubt.  They don't deserve it. But I hope you're right, man.  Really do.  

[caulfield12]

2 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

I have said it before, I don't think this deals happens without the front office knowing that #2 is happening.

We better hope and pray Covid Delta and/or the CBA negotiations leading to a lockout or strike don’t mess up those newly-discovered revenue streams.

[Harry Chappas]

Dane Dunning was a terrible trade because of cost control.  Now it's a great deal.  I liked Madrigal but he's always hurt.

 

[Marqhead]

3 minutes ago, soxfan3530 said:

Agreed. Will people still be upset if someone like Seager is replacing Madrigal next year?

No we won’t. But those of us who have watched the Sox FO for the last 30 years no that there won’t be a Seager type replacing Madrigal. Is Hernández or some other bargain bin guy. 

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

Just now, southsider2k5 said:

This seems to be a theme.

The White Sox are a better team today than they were yesterday, and a much better team than they were two days ago.

The Sox have LOADs of DH options.  They have Eloy if he doesn't play LF, and they have guys like Sheets if he does.

in 2021, having a shutdown bullpen is one of the primary ways to win in the playoffs.  We have seen it time and time again.  If you can't see the improvement in this team from Heuer to Kimbrel, you don't want to see it.

1. The Sox would be an even BETTER team today than they were before if they traded for Bryant over Kimbrel.

2. Gavin Sheets isn't a DH on a World Series contender. My goodness. Andrew Vaughn has no business playing right field.

3. No team is paying two relievers 32 million so please spare me your third point as it's complete nonsense and not at all supported by relatable examples. I bumped a thread from before the season with every poster saying the Sox had the best bullpen in baseball. Bullpens are volatile, investing significantly in them is dumb and teams with good ones develop the majority of them internally.

Teams who have the best players make the playoffs. The playoffs themselves are a crap shoot. A good bullpen helps but the narrative that it decides post-seasons is reactionary BS.

[caulfield12]

1 minute ago, Balta1701 said:

A major payroll increase up to at least $170 million is all but guaranteed.

That said, I don't see the White Sox spending a huge amount on a starter this offseason, because they're still going to plan for Kopech in the rotation and probably should. I would say it's a good idea to bring in some depth again.

RF, I'm not sure what they'll do, because there's like 3 or 4 guys they have to figure out what they're going to do with. My guess is they could be looking to pull something off in a trade market for that.

They still have Sheets and Burger…Engel seemingly has more value to the Sox, like Leury.  

Then Cespedes and/or Colas, but not sure if Yoelqui even figures into conversation for next year.  Probably not.

[southsider2k5]

2 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

I can't give them that benefit of the doubt.  They don't deserve it. But I hope you're right, man.  Really do.  

This move changes things for me.  They don't spend this kind of money on Kimbrel, if they aren't willing to spend more later.  Without this move, I have a lot more doubts.

[Harry Chappas]

2 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

EXACTLY!

The Sox could have signed a reliever that was projected to be nearly as good as Kimbrel in 4 months for less, and made themselves much better this year by trading for Bryant. Anyway you slice it, this team chose to do something that no top-of-the-line organization has done; pay two closers prime market value.

There is no better bullpen pitcher in baseball this year but sure believe Soria was the better option. 

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

3 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

I can't give them that benefit of the doubt.  They don't deserve it. But I hope you're right, man.  Really do.  

Yeah, I hope he's right too but him insinuating that anyone who doubts that is wrong is flat out laughable.

[southsider2k5]

Just now, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

1. The Sox would be an even BETTER team today than they were before if they traded for Bryant over Kimbrel.

2. Gavin Sheets isn't a DH on a World Series contender. My goodness. Andrew Vaughn has no business playing right field.

3. No team is paying two relievers 32 million so please spare me your third point as it's complete nonsense and not at all supported by relatable examples. I bumped a thread from before the season with every poster saying the Sox had the best bullpen in baseball. Bullpens are volatile, investing significantly in them is dumb and teams with good ones develop the majority of them internally.

Teams who have the best players make the playoffs. The playoffs themselves are a crap shoot. A good bullpen helps but the narrative that it decides post-seasons is reactionary BS.

Except Craig Kimbrel apparently.

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

Just now, southsider2k5 said:

This move changes things for me.  They don't spend this kind of money on Kimbrel, if they aren't willing to spend more later.  Without this move, I have a lot more doubts.

Oh my, they just spent 54 million on a closer... how is this any different?

The Sox MO is to acquire the top of the line players at the more affordable positions (catcher, relief pitcher) so they can claim they play at the top of the market. They have done this over and over again, but yet they continue to have you fooled.

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

1 minute ago, southsider2k5 said:

Except Craig Kimbrel apparently.

Except Kris Bryant is BETTER and more valuable than Craig Kimbrel, which is the point you willingly continue to overlook and ignore; which is odd, given that it's the primary point being made in this thread.

[southsider2k5]

Just now, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Oh my, they just spent 54 million on a closer... how is this any different?

The Sox MO is to acquire the top of the line players at the more affordable positions (catcher, relief pitcher) so they can claim they play at the top of the market. They have done this over and over again, but yet they continue to have you fooled.

I get  you want to be mad.  But I can't be mad today.

The White Sox are SIGNIFICANTLY better because of the moves they made today and yesterday.

Its too bad that is confusing for you, but I am going to enjoy it.

Rage away.,

[caulfield12]

1 minute ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

1. The Sox would be an even BETTER team today than they were before if they traded for Bryant over Kimbrel.

2. Gavin Sheets isn't a DH on a World Series contender. My goodness. Andrew Vaughn has no business playing right field.

3. No team is paying two relievers 32 million so please spare me your third point as it's complete nonsense and not at all supported by relatable examples. I bumped a thread from before the season with every poster saying the Sox had the best bullpen in baseball. Bullpens are volatile, investing significantly in them is dumb and teams with good ones develop the majority of them internally.

Teams who have the best players make the playoffs. The playoffs themselves are a crap shoot. A good bullpen helps but the narrative that it decides post-seasons is reactionary BS.

Yikes, have to agree with 90% of this.

Scary.

The biggest percentage of that 90% is a long history of watching the White Sox handle payroll (other than 2006 and adding Dunn).

They’re really betting on at least the ALCS or making the World Series to boost season ticket revenue through the roof next…sponsorships/advertising, etc. 

[SoxBlanco]

Just now, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Oh my, they just spent 54 million on a closer... how is this any different?

The Sox MO is to acquire the top of the line players at the more affordable positions (catcher, relief pitcher) so they can claim they play at the top of the market. They have done this over and over again, but yet they continue to have you fooled.

I think that’s because top of the line catchers and relief pitchers don’t require  5-10 year commitments. While JR can definitely be cheap at times, I think it’s more that he doesn’t like the risk of long contracts. 

[caulfield12]

4 minutes ago, Harry Chappas said:

There is no better bullpen pitcher in baseball this year but sure believe Soria was the better option. 

We’re only talking about cost/benefit here…not Soria vs. Kimbrel in a complete vacuum.

[GermanSoxFan]

2 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

Except Craig Kimbrel apparently.

Kimbrel will throw what? 25 innings this year? 
 

WAR isn‘t the be all end all stat, but there is a reason the greatest reliever of all time was about as valuable as a decent everyday player per season.

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

5 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

I get  you want to be mad.  But I can't be mad today.

The White Sox are SIGNIFICANTLY better because of the moves they made today and yesterday.

Its too bad that is confusing for you, but I am going to enjoy it.

Rage away.,

WHo is raging?

You can't refute a single point I'm making.

1. Kris Bryant is more valuable for this year and the Sox chances of winning a WS than Craig Kimbrel - yes or no?
2. The White Sox could sign a reliever for less than 16 million this off-season that's production would be close enough to Kimbrels for it to be negligible for them to win next year after considering they would also have Madrigal - yes or no?
3. Having Nick Madrigal is better than not having Nick Madrigal next year - yes or no?

The answer to all three of those questions is yes. So how can you argue that the Sox did what was best for this year or next year in this thread? And how can you be critical of anyone bringing that issue to the forefront?

edit: And why would I want to be upset by the White Sox moves? I am one of the more optimistic posters about the players and the team, but I'm not going to blindly support a poor process being executed by the front office who has earned absolutely zero benefit of the doubt on their allocation of resources.

Edited July 30, 2021 by Look at Ray Ray Run