Rex Hudler Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 Two thoughts: 1. Big Frank sold his house, so he might be more inclined to move to the West Coast; 2. Why would we want to re-sign Robbie Alomar? He will be more useless and more expensive next year than last year. To anwesr #1: Frank wants to win, he sold the house to make sure he's financially secure. If the Sox's put out a good team Frank isn't going anywhere, but if he thinks he can get a fair deal (probably no more than 6 mil) with a better team i think Frank will leave. Unfortunately for Frank, his decision on his option is due before most if any offseason moves are made, so he will not know whether the Sox will bring back a "good team". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 Frank will at least test the free agent waters, but don't expect him to go elsewhere unless he really feels unwanted and gets a very similar offer elsewhere. How do you figure Frank will "test the free agent waters"? If he and the Sox decline the options, he is a free agent free and clear. His contract at that point is null and void. I think the Sox would be stupid to allow him to become a free agent and then offer him the same contract or the same amount of money. The reason I do think Frank will exercise his option is that the current contract is for more than just this year. So he is in effect turning down much more than $6 million if he walks. Will he be able to get a long term deal elsewhere? I would doubt he can get more than 2 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 I can't figure out the fascination with Alomar. I think Alomar was an excellent pickup for the Sox this year. I think he brought a professionalism to the club that it needed. Alomar does the little things, he makes others around him better. That said, I am not sure if I would bring him back for another year. A lot of that would depend on $$. I certainly wouldn't bring him back for more than $3 million. I know a lot of you guys are stats guys, but some players can bring more to a team than just their numbers. I feel Alomar is one of those guys. I also however, question whether that positive influence would continue if the sox find them selves 10 games under .500 at the All-Star break and sinking fast, hence my reluctance to bring him back for a full season, especially at anything close to the $6 mil he made last year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winninguglyin83 Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 I agree with Rex. If Frank turns down the $6 million for 2004, he is also walking away from money for, I believe, that is guaranteed for at least two more seasons. So, in effect, some team needs to offer him a three-year guaranteed deal. What knucklehead GM would do that? Nobody in the NL because he can't play first base EVERY DAY. If he did, Every runner who reached first base would try to get picked off and then challenge Frank to throw him out at second. Every smart manager would bunt toward first base with a fast runner on third and less than two outs (see video of Game Three of the 2000 ALDS for details.) So now you're limited to AL teams. Eliminate Toronto, Tampa, KC, Minny, Cleveland, Detroit, Texas, Seattle and Oakland. They're not going to spend the money. Not on Frank. Boston and New York don't need him. That leaves Anaheim and Balty. Balty needs a bat and has cash. But would they want to rebuild with Frank? I doubt it. Anaheim lost Fullmer and could also use the bat. Frank likes L.A. But nobody knows if the new owner would spend his FA money on Frank. More likely to go younger. Frank would need his new agent, Arn Tellem, who is based in the LA area, to talk the Angels into this one. Throw in the fact that it is well documented that FRank lost money in some business deals and a divorce, and by the process of elimination, I'd say the odds are overwhelmingly in favor of Number 35 being back with the Sox next season. That said, it is then critical that the Sox have a manager with the stones to push Frank down in the order to 6th or 7th, which is where he should be hitting. He's not a Number 3 guy any more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elrockinMT Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 I did not like the idea of Frank swinging for the fences all the time either, but looking at other DH's out there in the AL, which is probably the only position and league Frank can play, I think he did very well. Look at the money the Yankees paid for Giambi and his numbers are not any better than Frank's and maybe lower overall. I think Frank Thomas is still a good fit in Chicago and we need him on the team. He may even comeback with a new attitude about hitting, if he listens to Hriniak. If Kenny decided not to resign Everett I can understand it, but I am still sorry to see Carl go. Koch is signed so KW isn't going to say anything about his contract or status, at least publicly. If we can get Bartolo back along with Robbie and Sullivan and Gordon I will e pleased to no end. I also think Jose Valentin will be back at SS. He is a good player, challenges the others to do well and has improved his defense with Robbie alongside him. A wholesale shedding of our veterans doesn't bode well for a run at the championship. A new attitude would work better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 1. Big Frank sold his house, so he might be more inclined to move to the West Coast; Frank has not sold his house. Still on the market... 4 years now. He still has his place in the city. He'll never get rid of it. His kids still live here half the year. And finally.. he's not moving to the west coast. He's having a place built in Vegas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aboz56 Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 1. Big Frank sold his house, so he might be more inclined to move to the West Coast; Frank has not sold his house. Still on the market... 4 years now. He still has his place in the city. He'll never get rid of it. His kids still live here half the year. And finally.. he's not moving to the west coast. He's having a place built in Vegas. Thank you for clearing that up Steff, I hadn't heard that he'd sold his house, but I wasn't for sure either way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 Yes and Frank has never done anything stupid due to his sense of pride. I remember the first time he walked out of spring training a few years ago, he did that specifically against the advice of his agents, whom he then fired. You could certainly make a case that signing the diminished skills contract was stupid, and again marked by his own overblown sense of self, because no one else in baseball, hey even in sports, has ever signed such a contract. Frank WOULD be stupid to turn down the 6 million, but he's done enough stupid things in the past to indicate it could happen again. I don't think Frank's ever fired an agent. His first one was killed in a plane crash. Of course.. I don't keep up with that stuff, so I could be wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 Yes and Frank has never done anything stupid due to his sense of pride. I remember the first time he walked out of spring training a few years ago, he did that specifically against the advice of his agents, whom he then fired. You could certainly make a case that signing the diminished skills contract was stupid, and again marked by his own overblown sense of self, because no one else in baseball, hey even in sports, has ever signed such a contract. Frank WOULD be stupid to turn down the 6 million, but he's done enough stupid things in the past to indicate it could happen again. I don't think Frank's ever fired an agent. His first one was killed in a plane crash. Of course.. I don't keep up with that stuff, so I could be wrong. Actually IIRC his agent dropped him after he walked out of spring training... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 Yes and Frank has never done anything stupid due to his sense of pride. I remember the first time he walked out of spring training a few years ago, he did that specifically against the advice of his agents, whom he then fired. You could certainly make a case that signing the diminished skills contract was stupid, and again marked by his own overblown sense of self, because no one else in baseball, hey even in sports, has ever signed such a contract. Frank WOULD be stupid to turn down the 6 million, but he's done enough stupid things in the past to indicate it could happen again. I don't think Frank's ever fired an agent. His first one was killed in a plane crash. Of course.. I don't keep up with that stuff, so I could be wrong. His agents, one being Scott Sanderson, fired him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aboz56 Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 That said, it is then critical that the Sox have a manager with the stones to push Frank down in the order to 6th or 7th, which is where he should be hitting. He's not a Number 3 guy any more. I think a good spot for him would be 5th or 6th. Here's what my lineup would look like, based on the players I think will start the season with the Sox next year. 2B Alomar CF Rowand LF Lee RF Ordonez DH Thomas 3B Crede 1B Konerko SS Valentin C Olivo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitesox61382 Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 "I also think Jose Valentin will be back at SS. He is a good player" Valentin and good player should not be in the same sentence. If you think he is a good player then you are blinded by the solo HR that hides the fact the he won't hit above .250. His D is terrible, his plate disipline is terrible, and he has average speed at best. Valentin is a below average SS any way you slice it, and if the Sox are going to spend 3-4M/yr on a SS, than I would much rather have them go after Guillen who is a much more complete player. "Here's what my lineup would look like, based on the players I think will start the season with the Sox next year. 2B Alomar CF Rowand LF Lee RF Ordonez DH Thomas 3B Crede 1B Konerko SS Valentin C Olivo " That lineup isn't realistic because it will cost about 43M give or take a mill. I guarantee that 1 of Thomas, Lee, Ordonez, and Konerko will NOT be back next year, and possible 2 or 3 of them. Those 4 will probably make around 36M next year and the Sox simple can't afford that, ESPECIALLY if they want Colon back, which is much more important IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastime Posted October 22, 2003 Share Posted October 22, 2003 That lineup makes me want to just put my head in my hands. We need SPEED in our lineup. That station-to-station crap didn't work very well, did it? I can't stomach another season of slow plodding oafs on the bases. I just can't. If I were GM, I would re-sign Colon, sign another starting pitcher, sign Luis Castillo, and play Willie Harris in CF. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshPR Posted October 22, 2003 Share Posted October 22, 2003 At least Willie is comming down here again to play winterball. I guess the AAA hitter who needed at-bats and is not comming is Joe Borchard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted October 22, 2003 Share Posted October 22, 2003 At least Willie is comming down here again to play winterball. I guess the AAA hitter who needed at-bats and is not comming is Joe Borchard Hasn't Borchard been playing non-stop since he was signed? The dude probably needs a break. That will wear you down physically and mentally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastime Posted October 22, 2003 Share Posted October 22, 2003 This is completely unrelated, but Denny Hocking is a free agent. I would sign him in a heartbeat. He would be a great influence, a great clubhouse presence, and a great utility player. Plus, he woudn't cost much at all. Plus, he could share some Twins secrets with us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted October 22, 2003 Share Posted October 22, 2003 This is completely unrelated, but Denny Hocking is a free agent. I would sign him in a heartbeat. He would be a great influence, a great clubhouse presence, and a great utility player. Plus, he woudn't cost much at all. Plus, he could share some Twins secrets with us. Is there room for another utility guy if we keep Graffy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishmookie Posted October 23, 2003 Share Posted October 23, 2003 ROBBIE WANTS TO COME BACK SO DOES SULLY, THERE NOT SURE ABOUT GORDAN Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishmookie Posted October 23, 2003 Share Posted October 23, 2003 *GORDIN Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishmookie Posted October 23, 2003 Share Posted October 23, 2003 * GORDON! I HAVE TO LEARN HOW TO SPELL FLASH'S NAME BETTER, I THINK ILL CALL HIM TOM. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Showtime Posted October 23, 2003 Share Posted October 23, 2003 I'm not so sure why everyone has Konerko in their lineups. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWSOX45 Posted October 23, 2003 Share Posted October 23, 2003 I'm not so sure why everyone has Konerko in their lineups. Agreed. He costs too much, we can't afford to pay him that much when he doesn't perform. The money could be spent elswhere. CWSOX45 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Showtime Posted October 23, 2003 Share Posted October 23, 2003 Agreed. He costs too much, we can't afford to pay him that much when he doesn't perform. The money could be spent elswhere. CWSOX45 I'm damn sure the Sox are doing a lot of phone work to try and move Konerko. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWSOX45 Posted October 23, 2003 Share Posted October 23, 2003 Agreed. He costs too much, we can't afford to pay him that much when he doesn't perform. The money could be spent elswhere. CWSOX45 I'm damn sure the Sox are doing a lot of phone work to try and move Konerko. If they aren't than shame on them..... CWSOX45 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWSOX45 Posted October 23, 2003 Share Posted October 23, 2003 Where are some fits for Paully?? I dont really see to many, mabye Baltimore, LA, cant imagine SF, if they just got rid of basically the same player in Snow, and thats all I can think of. Los Angeles most likely, Dan Evans will take him. They can afford to take on his contract too, as for where Frank goes I'm not sure. I hope he doesn't come back here though, we can't have our number three guy hit .250 with runners in scoring position two years in a row. CWSOX45 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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