Texsox Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 Thinking about the knock your sox or socks off trade that wasn't, I got to thinking what would have made a difference? Maggs for a closer or big time starter? All-star for all-star type of move. Dealing Frank for a very good arm? Dumping JM sooner? All-Star break? After we got swept by the Royals opening weekend? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 Kicking this team in the ass in April. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aboz56 Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 Dumping JM in spring training. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnB Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 Marlins = Got rid of manager in may, in world series. Sox = Stuck with their manager, weren't in the playoffs. 'nuff said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackjack29 Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 It all started and ended with JM. If we would have gotten rid of him sooner and replaced him with someone like Joe Nossek on an interm basis, that would have given the team a good ass kicking, not to mention the fact their wouldn't be a different lineup from day to day, which doesn't help a teams consistency. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 Thinking about the knock your sox or socks off trade that wasn't, I got to thinking what would have made a difference? Maggs for a closer or big time starter? All-star for all-star type of move. Dealing Frank for a very good arm? Dumping JM sooner? All-Star break? After we got swept by the Royals opening weekend? Great Topic. I gotta say keeping Frank Thomas when Ken Williams wanted to and basically had him dealt to the Red Sox at the trade deadline last year. I think Frank was a HUGE reason this team didn't go anywhere. The stats would say otherwise, but its just something I believe. I aslo think hiring a new manager would of helped. And of course had they gotten Javier Vazquez there is no doubt they win the division. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWSOX45 Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 Beating the Tigers and Indians AT LEAST 4 more times each than they did. CWSOX45 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 Beating the Tigers and Indians AT LEAST 4 more times each than they did. CWSOX45 Wow, that was such a good point, you had two post it TWICE! In all seriousness, the difference between the White Sox and Twins were the close games. The Sox stunk in close games, the Twins did not stink in close games. Simple as that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Lopez Ghost (old) Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 1. Firing Manuel, at least by the All Star break; 2. Getting a viable 5th starter, like Kenny Rogers, Wilson Alvarez, Jose Lima...people were available. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CubKilla Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 I gotta go with the majority here and agree that the biggest problem was not firing JM in April, May, or..... at the very latest..... the All-Star Break. Let's not forget, this team not having a bonafide 5th starter THE ENTIRE SEASON didn't help matters either. I am a firm believer in that it was the moves that this Organization DIDN'T make that killed the team in '03. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted October 21, 2003 Author Share Posted October 21, 2003 We had a couple really good 5th starters; Buerhle and Colon. I think we needed a #2 and #3 starter. Seriously, I hadn't really considered the 5th starter issue, I was more down on the lack of a reliable closer and only one hitter over .300. But I'm starting to be a believer. Only one starter over achieved, Colon and Buerhle had sub-par by their standards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NUKE_CLEVELAND Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 Thinking about the knock your sox or socks off trade that wasn't, I got to thinking what would have made a difference? Maggs for a closer or big time starter? All-star for all-star type of move. Dealing Frank for a very good arm? Dumping JM sooner? All-Star break? After we got swept by the Royals opening weekend? I think the management did make a huge difference when they brought in Alomar and Everett. That turned the whole season around and got us winning again. I think the only thing that could have helped this team was better execution against the Detroits and Clevelands of the world. If we were able to beat those teams early we would have cruised to the division. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BurlyMan56 Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 1) Small Ball (stealing,bunting,hitting to the opposite field,not swinging for the fences every time up) SEE:MARLINS 2) Reliable 5th starter who could keep us in the games...(solid 6 or 7 innings...3 or 4 earned runs) 3) Firing Manuel earlier Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CubKilla Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 I was more down on the lack of a reliable closer and only one hitter over .300. But I'm starting to be a believer. Only one .300 hitter is a real good point that I hadn't considered. But this Organization had two people that, IMHO, could have reliably closed..... Marte and Gordon. To go back to problem numero uno, it took JM a little over half-a-season to realize that Botch sucked and could not be relied upon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aboz56 Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 Only one .300 hitter is a real good point that I hadn't considered. But this Organization had two people that, IMHO, could have reliably closed..... Marte and Gordon. To go back to problem numero uno, it took JM a little over half-a-season to realize that Botch sucked and could not be relied upon. Gordon was shaky during parts of the early part of the season. After the way he pitched in 2002, Marte should have been given the nod to close games a lot earlier than he did. And when he did close, he was sharing the duties with Gordon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperSteve Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 Only one .300 hitter is a real good point that I hadn't considered. But this Organization had two people that, IMHO, could have reliably closed..... Marte and Gordon. To go back to problem numero uno, it took JM a little over half-a-season to realize that Botch sucked and could not be relied upon. Gordon was shaky during parts of the early part of the season. After the way he pitched in 2002, Marte should have been given the nod to close games a lot earlier than he did. And when he did close, he was sharing the duties with Gordon. I hated Gordon early on. He started very poor. I remember Cubs fans saying that's why they traded him last year. I wouldn't give him closers money. We should either have Marte or Koch close. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted October 22, 2003 Author Share Posted October 22, 2003 I'm trying to resolve in my mind the home runs vs. singles and asked in another thread where to find total team bases. The big shots where fun when they came in bunches but maddening when we'd get 1st and third and go quietly into the night. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperSteve Posted October 22, 2003 Share Posted October 22, 2003 I'm trying to resolve in my mind the home runs vs. singles and asked in another thread where to find total team bases. The big shots where fun when they came in bunches but maddening when we'd get 1st and third and go quietly into the night. I would love to see some guys brought in with the mind set of small ball. It may not make all the highlights, but it is more reliable then the long ball. I don't mind two or three heavy hitters, just not seven guys who think that is what they are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmmmmbeeer Posted October 22, 2003 Share Posted October 22, 2003 Obviously we needed to beat Det and Cle more often and also had to win more close games. I think that both of these are inherent to a lack of leadership which should have been supplied by Jerry Manuel. We'll never know the truth but there were a BUNCH of games lost in the 1st half of the season that shouldn't have been lost. The team lacked identity and focus. I'm confident that a manager with a true game plan and CONTROL over a clubhouse has the ability to dictate focus and give a team an identity. Let's hope our new manager is able to get his winning formula drilled into the thick skulls of many White Sox. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted October 22, 2003 Author Share Posted October 22, 2003 our new manager is able to get his winning formula drilled into the thick skulls of many White Sox. drilled into their skulls . . . wasn't there a guy in Milwaukee working on that process but failed? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastime Posted October 22, 2003 Share Posted October 22, 2003 Getting a viable 5th starter, like Kenny Rogers, Wilson Alvarez, Jose Lima...people were available. Last night, Kenny Williams said that the 5th starter's spot is Scott Schoenweiss's to lose. Atta boy, Kenny, keep reaching for the stars. And never get off the ground. You can do better!! Schoenweiss? Come on. He's just the left-handed Danny Wrong. He SUCKS. Hearing that made me want to vomit. :puke Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted October 22, 2003 Share Posted October 22, 2003 If you think back, the one thing that made the difference in the long run of the season was that Minnesota signed Kenny Rogers for $2Mil and we wouldn't pay him more than $1Mil. Kenny Rogers in that #5 slot for us, and him not being available to the Twins when all their starters were injured or ineffective, would have made all the difference. We lost the division because of the unwillingness to pay $1 Mil more in payroll. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sox2004 Posted October 22, 2003 Share Posted October 22, 2003 If you think back, the one thing that made the difference in the long run of the season was that Minnesota signed Kenny Rogers for $2Mil and we wouldn't pay him more than $1Mil. Kenny Rogers in that #5 slot for us, and him not being available to the Twins when all their starters were injured or ineffective, would have made all the difference. We lost the division because of the unwillingness to pay $1 Mil more in payroll. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.