The Mighty Mite Posted December 6, 2021 Share Posted December 6, 2021 10 hours ago, pcq said: Sox had a weird history of trading their star players. Minnie Louie Harold Nellie. Nellie was traded in the twilight of his career but I was still very sad when it happened. Minnie, Aparicio and Baines were traded when they were still in their prime and the trades were hard to swallow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted December 6, 2021 Share Posted December 6, 2021 13 hours ago, southsider2k5 said: That late 60s, early 70s era was so offensively challenged that for some reason a lot of guys that should have been obvious took forever to get in, or never did. 30 homers a season then is like 50 today. A .270 average is .300 today. I get that for his original candidacy, but the golden years 2011 and 2014 that he could have been elected while alive is infuriating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted December 6, 2021 Share Posted December 6, 2021 1 minute ago, bmags said: I get that for his original candidacy, but the golden years 2011 and 2014 that he could have been elected while alive is infuriating. For sure, but I think it has almost been worse with statistics bias towards hitters from that era. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NWINFan Posted December 6, 2021 Share Posted December 6, 2021 13 hours ago, Dick Allen said: Anyone who could make wearing a helmet in the field look cool deserves to be in the HOF for that alone. I have mixed feelings about Allen. I still haven't seen a player hit a ball like he could. Slumps didn't bother him. He would say, it's not how you start, but how you finish. And there are few players who had his overall ability. But his work ethic wasn't great and his skills left him too early. He could have put up bigger numbers that would have allowed him entry. Still, I wished he would have stayed with the Sox for the remainder of his career. It would have been great if he would have contributed to the South Side Hit Men. I would have voted for him. You really haven't seen a home run until you saw Dick Allen hit one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldsox Posted December 6, 2021 Share Posted December 6, 2021 3 hours ago, The Mighty Mite said: Nellie was traded in the twilight of his career but I was still very sad when it happened. Minnie, Aparicio and Baines were traded when they were still in their prime and the trades were hard to swallow. At least Sox got Early Wynn for Minoso and they got a young Sammy Sosa for Baines, but the first Aparicio trade was just plain stupid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted December 6, 2021 Share Posted December 6, 2021 17 minutes ago, NWINFan said: I have mixed feelings about Allen. I still haven't seen a player hit a ball like he could. Slumps didn't bother him. He would say, it's not how you start, but how you finish. And there are few players who had his overall ability. But his work ethic wasn't great and his skills left him too early. He could have put up bigger numbers that would have allowed him entry. Still, I wished he would have stayed with the Sox for the remainder of his career. It would have been great if he would have contributed to the South Side Hit Men. I would have voted for him. You really haven't seen a home run until you saw Dick Allen hit one. I never knew about the end of his White Sox tenure, especially it being due to his feud with Santo (per his autobiography). Maybe without a layoff his numbers become indisputable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted December 6, 2021 Share Posted December 6, 2021 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NWINFan Posted December 6, 2021 Share Posted December 6, 2021 42 minutes ago, Quin said: I never knew about the end of his White Sox tenure, especially it being due to his feud with Santo (per his autobiography). Maybe without a layoff his numbers become indisputable. Dick Allen had many personal and professional problems in his career. These problems dragged down his numbers and that's a shame. He was an amazing player and a real competitor. But he sometimes shot himself in the foot. He "retired" in 1974 and left the Sox three weeks before the season ended. He could have finished out the year and still could have retired if he wanted to. And there were two instances where the Sox had over 50,000 for a doubleheader, and he didn't want to play game two. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
South Side Hit Men Posted December 6, 2021 Author Share Posted December 6, 2021 Solid article by Jayson Stark linked in the tweet. Quote Because from 1964-73, Dick Allen had an OPS+ of 165. So he’s on the list. Here’s everyone who made that list from the expansion era (1961-2021): Hall of Famers: Henry Aaron, Frank Robinson, Willie McCovey, Jeff Bagwell, Frank Thomas Still active: Miguel Cabrera, Albert Pujols, Mike Trout PED asterisks: Barry Bonds, Mark McGwire, Manny Ramírez Everyone else: Dick Allen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mighty Mite Posted December 6, 2021 Share Posted December 6, 2021 (edited) 3 hours ago, oldsox said: At least Sox got Early Wynn for Minoso and they got a young Sammy Sosa for Baines, but the first Aparicio trade was just plain stupid. Actually the Aparicio trade helped the Sox come with their 3 best consecutive years in Sox history when they won 94 games in 1963, 98 games in 1964 and 95 games in 1965. If we had the wild card back then the Sox would have made the playoffs all 3 years plus a few more times in the 1950s. Edited December 6, 2021 by The Mighty Mite Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Grinder Posted December 6, 2021 Share Posted December 6, 2021 Good for Minnie, Dick Allen has always been my fav Sox player, he wrote autobiography long time ago which was a great read. Is Dick eligible again in the future? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted December 6, 2021 Share Posted December 6, 2021 4 minutes ago, The Grinder said: Good for Minnie, Dick Allen has always been my fav Sox player, he wrote autobiography long time ago which was a great read. Is Dick eligible again in the future? Again in 5 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mighty Mite Posted December 6, 2021 Share Posted December 6, 2021 (edited) 4 hours ago, NWINFan said: I have mixed feelings about Allen. I still haven't seen a player hit a ball like he could. Slumps didn't bother him. He would say, it's not how you start, but how you finish. And there are few players who had his overall ability. But his work ethic wasn't great and his skills left him too early. He could have put up bigger numbers that would have allowed him entry. Still, I wished he would have stayed with the Sox for the remainder of his career. It would have been great if he would have contributed to the South Side Hit Men. I would have voted for him. You really haven't seen a home run until you saw Dick Allen hit one. I tend to agree with you, though he had one of the greatest seasons in Sox history in 1972, I had issues with Allen quitting on the team in 1974 and as also didn't like it when as a favor we carried his brother Hank on the roster who was a complete waste so he would qualify for his MLB pension. When I think of him as a Hall of Famer I'm on the bubble but then I think if Santo is in the HOF then Allen should be in but then again if I could vote, I would take Billy Pierce over Allen. Edited December 6, 2021 by The Mighty Mite Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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