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The MLB lockout is lifted!


southsider2k5

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28 minutes ago, Kyyle23 said:

This just seems bad for both sides ? 

I don't see what Manfred brings to the table. If I were a player, I wouldn't be all that receptive to anything he said. The only positive he could have is that he is not a negotiator. In these situations, personal grievances worsen things and perhaps talking to a different person would help. But he is a tool of the owners, and I can't see what he could do to change things. Baseball needs a real commissioner with real power. That hasn't happened in a while.

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1 hour ago, southsider2k5 said:

Yet, your posts routinely bash players and make excuses for owners and present them in the best possible light.   Most others can see it, which should tell you something.

I am usually told I'm pollyanna...always looking at the bright side of every issue.  Bash the players is a new one.  I guess I'm not as easygoing as you thought.

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24 minutes ago, Tnetennba said:

Lets take a trip down memory lane shall we...

Quite an odd revealing statement, said unprovoked.  Seems pretty anti player to me.

Reason why he thinks the players should have caved in mid December.

Said in discussion of the players earning more.  Quite the contemptuous tone.  Seems pretty anti player to me.

In discussing why he sides with ownership.  A statement not based in fact and debunked by posters later down the page.

His own words.

Total speculation based on no real info, but with a serious anti-player bend.  The union has proposed raising the minimum and it is still a major sticking point for owners.

A false statement.  The Sox definitely watched those service time days before calling up a few prized prospects.

A statement based purely on opinion that has been disproven as the lockout has dragged into almost March.

A statement of deflection while refusing to answer an ask for the proof behind his statements.  A pattern that continues throughout the thread.

My rebuttal, debunking yet another false statement.

Just in the first 25 or so pages of this thread.  But we have reading comprehension issues.

Which point do you disagree with?

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28 minutes ago, Tnetennba said:

Lets take a trip down memory lane shall we...

Quite an odd revealing statement, said unprovoked.  Seems pretty anti player to me.

Reason why he thinks the players should have caved in mid December.

Said in discussion of the players earning more.  Quite the contemptuous tone.  Seems pretty anti player to me.

In discussing why he sides with ownership.  A statement not based in fact and debunked by posters later down the page.

His own words.

Total speculation based on no real info, but with a serious anti-player bend.  The union has proposed raising the minimum and it is still a major sticking point for owners.

A false statement.  The Sox definitely watched those service time days before calling up a few prized prospects.

A statement based purely on opinion that has been disproven as the lockout has dragged into almost March.

A statement of deflection while refusing to answer an ask for the proof behind his statements.  A pattern that continues throughout the thread.

My rebuttal, debunking yet another false statement.

Just in the first 25 or so pages of this thread.  But we have reading comprehension issues.

Bless you for doing this.  I thought about it, but didn't want to take the time.

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8 minutes ago, poppysox said:

Which point do you disagree with?

I spent an hour of my afternoon, mostly for my own amusement, to present the reading audience with receipts.  You've proven you're full of shit countless times in this thread and I backed it up with your own statements.  I didn't even get to the part where you claimed you were basically the expert on negotiations based simply on your own work experience, or even to the past month's specious, misleading, or non-factual statements.  You can deflect and get grumpy because you don't like getting called out all you'd like, but you're just fueling it all the more.  The evidence is in this thread.  You have sided with ownership in your own words and repeatedly bashed the players for being greedy and spoiled.  We've all been reading it all winter.  No amount of deflection, refusal to acknowledge the truth, gaslighting, changing the subject, or accusations of name calling can erase that.  Lashing out even further doesn't help your cause at all either, it just makes you look small and sad.  

Peace 

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3 minutes ago, Tony said:

I disagree with the point of you trying to tell us you aren't taking sides, when you've literally told us you side with the owners. 

Neither side is "doing anything wrong" IMO.  This is just the way negotiations go.  I agree that I don't think the players have anything major to gripe about but I don't care if they get some of what they want or not.  The owners will obviously give a fairly substantial increase to the minimum wage and will ultimately give a bit at the CBT but not much.  When the players wanted earlier free agency I said that was just posturing and it was.  When the player laundry list was long and silly I definitely didn't side with the players but I always called it posturing.  I hate extended playoffs so that is an area I don't agree with the owners.  This stuff is not black and white so it needs to be taken into context.  

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12 minutes ago, Tnetennba said:

I spent an hour of my afternoon, mostly for my own amusement, to present the reading audience with receipts.  You've proven you're full of shit countless times in this thread and I backed it up with your own statements.  I didn't even get to the part where you claimed you were basically the expert on negotiations based simply on your own work experience, or even to the past month's specious, misleading, or non-factual statements.  You can deflect and get grumpy because you don't like getting called out all you'd like, but you're just fueling it all the more.  The evidence is in this thread.  You have sided with ownership in your own words and repeatedly bashed the players for being greedy and spoiled.  We've all been reading it all winter.  No amount of deflection, refusal to acknowledge the truth, gaslighting, changing the subject, or accusations of name calling can erase that.  Lashing out even further doesn't help your cause at all either, it just makes you look small and sad.  

Peace 

I didn't claim I'm an expert ever.  I did claim accurately that I have been the lead negotiator in a number of negotiations with 2 teamster unions.  Please understand that what you think of me could not matter less.  I tried to explain to you and others that negotiations just work this way.  Apparently, you think you have more experience in these matters.  I guess it is possible but somehow I doubt it in your case.  

 

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8 minutes ago, poppysox said:

I didn't claim I'm an expert ever.  I did claim accurately that I have been the lead negotiator in a number of negotiations with 2 teamster unions.  Please understand that what you think of me could not matter less.  I tried to explain to you and others that negotiations just work this way.  Apparently, you think you have more experience in these matters.  I guess it is possible but somehow I doubt it in your case.  

 

What did you do with Jimmy Hoffa?

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2 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

You're basically arguing against the whole board and have resorted to essentially doing the exact thing you're telling everyone else they're doing.  Might just need a few days to take a step away, but do you man! 

I agree.  I think you often make some good comments whether I agree with the point you are making or not. I certainly agree that I am definitely in the minority of the ten posters that bother anymore.  More importantly, you state whatever your opinion is in a way that is not the bully crap that turns off so many posters.  I'll watch with interest how the boys of Summer handle this.

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