southsider2k5 Posted February 22, 2022 Author Share Posted February 22, 2022 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted February 22, 2022 Author Share Posted February 22, 2022 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted February 22, 2022 Author Share Posted February 22, 2022 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted February 22, 2022 Share Posted February 22, 2022 The risk of these small moves isn’t just that we are on pace to reach a median in 2024, it’s also that one side may pack up its things and go home if they think the deadline cannot be met. Someone has to make a much more major move to make this happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted February 22, 2022 Share Posted February 22, 2022 1 hour ago, southsider2k5 said: But they could have both. Why leave 12 games of revenue on the table? No reason to if they can get both. I'm thinking they can't get both. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harold's Leg Lift Posted February 22, 2022 Share Posted February 22, 2022 The CBT is going to hold things up for a few more weeks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 1 hour ago, Harold's Leg Lift said: The CBT is going to hold things up for a few more weeks. I think you’re right, and I wonder what will be the end result of blowing past the deadline. If the PA refuses expanded playoffs if they don’t get paid for 162, then once the deadline is blown through, what motivation do they have to actually get things moving on that issue? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 2 hours ago, southsider2k5 said: It's a really dumb idea to give up revenue from 12 games and still pay players the same amount. Players aren't going to give expanded playoffs (this year) without getting paid for 162 games (even if they don't get it). everyone keeps saying if season goes shorter than 162....owners won't do x - but who is to say owners don't just say we will pay you those 12 games so we get the expanded playoffs...which is presumably worth far more than the 12 games (to the owners at least). Seems like a win win and likely bargaining chip used. In long-run I don't envision that holding and presume at that point, you see the season go back to 162 with the extended (and the bigger pool is used for revenue sharing). My example was more around my prediction on how the two sides will ultimately reach a deal that gets them both what they want in '22 and positions it for what they want in '23 and beyond. But if I were players - I would anchor on slightly shorter season with similar to better revenues (anyway) cause why in this day and age should any player sign up for more games if they aren't getting more money (% of pool can be the same - but total $ should increase). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 8 minutes ago, Balta1701 said: I think you’re right, and I wonder what will be the end result of blowing past the deadline. If the PA refuses expanded playoffs if they don’t get paid for 162, then once the deadline is blown through, what motivation do they have to actually get things moving on that issue? That is why I assume the compromise will be -> owners get expanded playoffs, players get paid as if there were 162 games (so no pro-rata nothing in '22). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 I'm all in on a 155 game season and expanded playoffs. Make it permanent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitownsportsfan Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 47 minutes ago, Texsox said: I'm all in on a 155 game season and expanded playoffs. Make it permanent. I respect your fandom but you're a frog in the pot right now. They done boiled it slowly on you and you're ready to just bake in it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2Jimmy0 Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 This is all so stupid. The players aren’t even asking for very much. Their ideas are nothing compared to what the owners will make on jersey patches and expanded playoffs. It’s just 8 short-sighted owners being shitheads essentially. 3 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, Y2Jimmy0 said: This is all so stupid. The players aren’t even asking for very much. Their ideas are nothing compared to what the owners will make on jersey patches and expanded playoffs. It’s just 8 short-sighted owners being shitheads essentially. The players are being completely reasonable. I see nothing wrong with their asks. The owners should not be given a hard, low-ish CBT without a floor with it. I think a cap and floor would actually be ok. The CBT is a de facto soft cap. Idk what the players don't realize about that. They have already agreed to the luxury tax in the first place. It would be better for the players if every team HAD to spend $100M. The stars will still get theirs. Edited February 23, 2022 by Jack Parkman 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 9 hours ago, chitownsportsfan said: I respect your fandom but you're a frog in the pot right now. They done boiled it slowly on you and you're ready to just bake in it. Like they did with the DH? Because I prefer playoff baseball to April or late September? Baseball went from America's game to dying before our eyes while basketball and football crushes it. Move into the 21st century. I've been advocating for thirty years to go to eight teams. The rest of the world is finally catching up. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hogan873 Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 46 minutes ago, Texsox said: Like they did with the DH? Because I prefer playoff baseball to April or late September? Baseball went from America's game to dying before our eyes while basketball and football crushes it. Move into the 21st century. I've been advocating for thirty years to go to eight teams. The rest of the world is finally catching up. I'm with you on the expanded playoffs. Adding playoff teams will make more teams competitive. There will still be teams that tank, whether purposely or not, but there will be more meaningful games in mid to late summer. And I don't agree with the notion that it's not fair for a .500 team to go up against a team that had 95 wins and knock them out of the playoffs because they played out of their minds for a couple games. Every team has to go into the playoffs putting their best game out there. If there's an upset, there's an upset. Happens in football all the time. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poppysox Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 Both sides claimed that parity was the primary goal in these negotiations and yet no mention of minimum team payroll. Raising the cap just leads to more disparity. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NWINFan Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 I am at the point where I don't care what they do. Get agree to something already. If they want to ruin the sport with expanded playoffs, there's nothing fans can do about it. They will probably find other ways to ruin the sport while they are at it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harold's Leg Lift Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 13 hours ago, Y2Jimmy0 said: This is all so stupid. The players aren’t even asking for very much. Their ideas are nothing compared to what the owners will make on jersey patches and expanded playoffs. It’s just 8 short-sighted owners being shitheads essentially. I was told it's a lot more than 8 and they aren't gonna budge. The players will have to take their victories in minimum salary and arbitration. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigHurt3515 Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 3 hours ago, hogan873 said: I'm with you on the expanded playoffs. Adding playoff teams will make more teams competitive. There will still be teams that tank, whether purposely or not, but there will be more meaningful games in mid to late summer. And I don't agree with the notion that it's not fair for a .500 team to go up against a team that had 95 wins and knock them out of the playoffs because they played out of their minds for a couple games. Every team has to go into the playoffs putting their best game out there. If there's an upset, there's an upset. Happens in football all the time. Happens in a lot of sports. NBA plays 81 games and they now have 10 teams in each conference that make it, upsets happen there too. NCAA tournament, 68 teams and it is one and done after college kids spend months practicing, traveling, and playing games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirmin' for Yermin Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 1 hour ago, NWINFan said: I am at the point where I don't care what they do. Get agree to something already. If they want to ruin the sport with expanded playoffs, there's nothing fans can do about it. They will probably find other ways to ruin the sport while they are at it. Why do people hate expanded playoffs again? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flavum Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 3 minutes ago, Squirmin' for Yermin said: Why do people hate expanded playoffs again? Because it makes 162 largely meaningless. There are no great wins or crushing losses that may catch up to you at the end of the season because if you’re in at 81 wins or out 80 wins, are you really that good anyway? More than likely, your season will be over in 5 days. The final weekend with the Red Sox, Mariners, Blue Jays, and Yankees…meaningless to the baseball fan without a rooting interest. They’re all in. No drama. They have it right now. 5 of 15 in each league is good. 6 of 16 someday would be acceptable. It’s supposed to be a big deal to make the playoffs in baseball. Now it won’t be. 2 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCalChiSox Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 30 minutes ago, Harold's Leg Lift said: I was told it's a lot more than 8 and they aren't gonna budge. The players will have to take their victories in minimum salary and arbitration. Owners may not cave on super 2/service time changes, but they will absolutely need to increase the pre-arb pool to something very close to the 100m that the union wants and put control of how it's divided up in the unions hands. The minimums will have to go up to 700k plus and keep rising from there. Union will have to swallow some increases in CBT penalties in exchange for higher thresholds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted February 23, 2022 Author Share Posted February 23, 2022 Some solid details here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tnetennba Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 36 minutes ago, Squirmin' for Yermin said: Why do people hate expanded playoffs again? I’m not out right opposed, but I fear a gimmicky set up that deviates too far from the format we’ve had. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox59 Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 50 minutes ago, BigHurt3515 said: Happens in a lot of sports. NBA plays 81 games and they now have 10 teams in each conference that make it, upsets happen there too. NCAA tournament, 68 teams and it is one and done after college kids spend months practicing, traveling, and playing games. NCAA is a totally different animal. 16 and 15 seeds win well over 95% of the time. A 2 seed in this proposed MLB playoff structure that wins 100 games but misses the 1 seed bye by 1 game is going to lose to an around .500 7 seed far far far more than 5% of the time. Its terrible I hate it. But its not like its going to change my fandom. Bottom line, around .500 ballclubs don't deserve to make the playoffs. It would have worked out OK for the AL last year, but the NL would have been gross. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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