Where could Kimbrel be traded, and for what?

[Balta1701]

11 minutes ago, kleedawg said:

Non-tender? He was the Rays # 1 starter and one of the best pitchers in baseball when he got hurt. He was one of the best prospects in baseball. he has virtually been good his whole short career. No one is scared of TJS surgery anymore because of its success rate. I'm quite sure EVERY team in baseball would be interested in acquiring Glasnow some with significant assets. Hell. I'd trade Romy for Him right now with the hopes I could extend him before he becomes a FA.

They're not scared of TJS, but they're scared of Free Agency. He has 2 years of control before Free Agency - 2022 and 2023. He will miss all of 2022, but he will still be paid for it. 

Here's the Rays' writer for the Tampa Bay times noting how it's a narrow decision back in August, right after the surgery was done.

 

 

[kleedawg]

Just now, Balta1701 said:

They're not scared of TJS, but they're scared of Free Agency. He has 2 years of control before Free Agency - 2022 and 2023. He will miss all of 2022, but he will still be paid for it. 

Here's the Rays' writer for the Tampa Bay times noting how it's a narrow decision back in August, right after the surgery was done.

 

 No one is arguing why the Rays would make Glasnow available. The argument is that Glasnow was not an insignificant offer for Kimbrel.

 

[Balta1701]

3 minutes ago, kleedawg said:

 

An injured Glasnow who is due ~$12 million and who might pitch 1 season before free agency? Tells you all you need to know about how poorly they viewed Kimbrel. 

[Harold's Leg Lift]

4 hours ago, oldsox said:

Every time I hear Kimbrel's name, I shudder.  I would love to have been a fly on Hahn's wall when he was discussing the trade last summer.  Here we had an expensive Cub relief pitcher who they obviously did not want or need, and Hahn walked into the void.  You would think that Heuer alone would have been more than enough, because Heuer was, in fact, struggling at the time.  But no.  Hahn wanted to give more, so Madrigal's name got thrown in there.  I still wonder if Hahn wanted to give up yet more to the Cubs, but they felt sorry for him and said no, that's enough.

Or it shows how little (pun intended) other organizations valued Nick Madrigal and this was the best trade they could make.  

[kleedawg]

Just now, Balta1701 said:

An injured Glasnow who is due ~$12 million and who might pitch 1 season before free agency? Tells you all you need to know about how poorly they viewed Kimbrel. 

no, it shows you how a money strapped low market team thinks out of the box team operates to try to win a world series now. 

[caulfield12]

3 hours ago, kleedawg said:

Really? You know the dodgers, red sox, and Rays all tried to acquire Kimbrel. The Rays Reportedly offered Tyler Glasnow for him. So no, we couldn't just have got him for Heuer, or a bag of balls, The trade didn't work out, but come on Kimbrel was the best reliever in baseball at the time. Why must we continually beat the dead horse on this trade?

That might be a more balanced trade if you consider that Glasnow was likely to miss all of 2022 while adding to payroll…

[MeanJoeCrede]

https://dodgersway.com/2021/12/17/dodgers-white-sox-trade-craig-kimbrel-rumors/

[Chimpton]

6 minutes ago, MeanJoeCrede said:

https://dodgersway.com/2021/12/17/dodgers-white-sox-trade-craig-kimbrel-rumors/

Most of us on here would be happy if they took him and his wages even if we got nothing back in return!

[poppysox]

15 minutes ago, Chimpton said:

Most of us on here would be happy if they took him and his wages even if we got nothing back in return!

Hahn did not pick up the extension in order to give him away for nothing.

 

[ron883]

6 minutes ago, poppysox said:

Hahn did not pick up the extension in order to give him away for nothing.

 

The buyout would have cost 2m. Trading him in full for nothing saves 2m. It's possible he picked it up to dump him and save 2m.

Edited December 18, 2021 by ron883

[MeanJoeCrede]

1 hour ago, Chimpton said:

Most of us on here would be happy if they took him and his wages even if we got nothing back in return!

This is the first proposal I've seen where the Sox would get prospects and free up the $16 million. Found it interesting, especially coming from a Dodgers site. I like the idea alot more than trading for a similar salaried player.

[tray]

2 hours ago, Chimpton said:

Most of us on here would be happy if they took him and his wages even if we got nothing back in return!

Sept 9. 2021 story about Sox playing at Oakland:

"(Vaughn)  greeted the Cal baseball team Wednesday night, still young enough to have played with some of its current members during his own college days. But mostly, he was thrilled to show the people he loves, in person, that his dream came true.

"They're proud of me," he said. "So many people had an impact on my career that were able to come out. Just to be able to thank them has been really special.

"They're my people, they're my favorite people, and it doesn't matter what level I'm at, it's just great to see them under any circumstance."

------------

Yea, Vaughn might not mind coming home to CA. Perhaps a package of Kimbrel plus Vaughn might net a few decent players from the Dodgers.

 

 

Edited December 18, 2021 by tray

[southsider2k5]

35 minutes ago, tray said:

Sept 9. 2021 story about Sox playing at Oakland:

"(Vaughn)  greeted the Cal baseball team Wednesday night, still young enough to have played with some of its current members during his own college days. But mostly, he was thrilled to show the people he loves, in person, that his dream came true.

"They're proud of me," he said. "So many people had an impact on my career that were able to come out. Just to be able to thank them has been really special.

"They're my people, they're my favorite people, and it doesn't matter what level I'm at, it's just great to see them under any circumstance."

------------

Yea, Vaughn might not mind coming home to CA. Perhaps a package of Kimbrel plus Vaughn might net a few decent players from the Dodgers.

 

 

Let it go man. They aren't using Vaughn to dump a contract that isn't even toxic.

[tray]

20 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

Let it go man. They aren't using Vaughn to dump a contract that isn't even toxic.

I didn't say anything that foolish. You did.

Obviously there would be comparable talent exchanged for any player included in a Kimbrel trade.

You should let your little vendetta against me go.

[Harold's Leg Lift]

Huh. The Dodgers. 

[bmags]

30 minutes ago, Harold's Leg Lift said:

Huh. The Dodgers. 

I wouldn’t be shocked at all. Dodgers have operated caring little about AAV and a lot about length. Kenley is likely to prioritize years. So Kimbrel should be a target of theirs.

The packaged they mentioned was better than what I proposed but we’ll see.

[poppysox]

3 hours ago, ron883 said:

The buyout would have cost 2m. Trading him in full for nothing saves 2m. It's possible he picked it up to dump him and save 2m.

That's not money in today's game as you know.

[southsider2k5]

51 minutes ago, tray said:

I didn't say anything that foolish. You did.

Obviously there would be comparable talent exchanged for any player included in a Kimbrel trade.

You should let your little vendetta against me go.

You should let your Vaughn obsession go.

[Tony]

On 11/13/2021 at 12:43 PM, tray said:

Vaughn probably sticks around for another season as a platoon player. If LaRussa continues to keep him on the bench against tougher RH starters, he should be able to inflate his numbers and add to his value.

 

On 11/3/2021 at 1:45 AM, tray said:

Vaughn? Dude is the most hyped White Sox prospect in decades. He should hire Steve Stone as his agent.

 

On 10/18/2021 at 7:03 PM, tray said:

Madrigal is a career .317 BA in 303 AB

Vaughn hit .235  with 15 HR in  417 AB.

 Sheets had 11 HR in only 160 AB. 

Vaughn regressed in the last few months of the season even as Tony tried to protect him by not starting him against RH pitching.

Sox don't really have a spot for him in the 2022 line-up as we saw in the play-offs.   He is kind of surplusage.

 

 

 

 

 

On 10/18/2021 at 6:32 PM, tray said:

How about Vaughn and Burger  to the Cubs for Madrigal and Ed Howard ?

 

 

On 10/14/2021 at 9:45 PM, tray said:

 

Vaughn hit .235 and LaRussa kept him out of the lineup against good RH pitching.

Neither Sheets nor Vaughn are fast enough to be an everyday outfielder. They could form a DH platoon, if the team could afford a roster spot for two DH's. 

Sox need a RF, preferably one who hits RH pitching in order to balance the line-up.  They also need a backup catcher, a second basemen, and a couple of starting pitchers.   That is too big of a list for Rick Hahn.

 

 

On 10/14/2021 at 12:34 PM, tray said:

Vaughn did not prove that he can hit RH pitchers. He is too slow to be an everyday outfielder. That is why he wasn't used much in the playoffs. He got a hit against Raley who is a garbage pitcher for the Astros.

Sheets is probably a better hitter and a candidate to become the Sox DH. 

 

 

 

 

On 10/13/2021 at 1:34 AM, tray said:

 

Short stodgy players like Vaughn usually do not develop speed and quickness with age. Instead they develop strength and bulk.

 

 

On 10/1/2021 at 6:18 AM, tray said:

Vaughn reminds me of Dayan Viciedo in a couple of ways - he hits a lot of hard line drives, has decent power potential, and is somewhat of a tank already at 23 years old. As things stand, Vaughn is too slow to be an everyday outfielder. If he can work on his lower torso and legs in the off-season, he might get faster, but I'm not sure that is possible.  Sox will give him another year or two to develop but Vaughn  will have more competition  moving forward with Colas and Cespedes along with Sheets competing for roster spots and playing time.

 

 

 

On 9/28/2021 at 3:49 PM, tray said:

 Unless Vaughn can turn it around in the last few games, I think you are right about platooning him at DH with Sheets.  Not a bad plan.   

Vaughn or Sheets could make the difference in a play-off game with a key shot off a pitcher who thinks they just got through the heart of the order and can let up some.

 

 

 

On 8/27/2021 at 8:15 PM, tray said:

What is Vaughn like 23 years old.  He's not going to get any faster. I thought he profiled like Carlos Quentin in terms of his upside but maybe not.

 

On 8/10/2021 at 7:40 PM, tray said:

Stone keeps suking Vaughn's dik.

 

1 hour ago, tray said:

I didn't say anything that foolish. You did.

Obviously there would be comparable talent exchanged for any player included in a Kimbrel trade.

You should let your little vendetta against me go.

b****, please. 

[Harold's Leg Lift]

32 minutes ago, bmags said:

I wouldn’t be shocked at all. Dodgers have operated caring little about AAV and a lot about length. Kenley is likely to prioritize years. So Kimbrel should be a target of theirs.

The packaged they mentioned was better than what I proposed but we’ll see.

I was being sarcastic. 

[southsider2k5]

52 minutes ago, Tony said:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

b****, please. 

He's dead already!

[ron883]

2 hours ago, poppysox said:

That's not money in today's game as you know.

https://soxmachine.com/2019/11/01/white-sox-continue-shedding-international-money-while-rebuilding-for-some-reason/

This is incorrect. 2 years ago the Sox traded valuable international slot money to save a paltry 1.25mil buyout amount owed to Nate Jones. I know Jerry is your boy, but 2mil matters to him. He hates paying guys to not play for him. 

[poppysox]

35 minutes ago, ron883 said:

https://soxmachine.com/2019/11/01/white-sox-continue-shedding-international-money-while-rebuilding-for-some-reason/

This is incorrect. 2 years ago the Sox traded valuable international slot money to save a paltry 1.25mil buyout amount owed to Nate Jones. I know Jerry is your boy, but 2mil matters to him. He hates paying guys to not play for him. 

Jerry is not my boy but I sure don't think he is evil incarnate.  Why didn't you bring up JR allowing RH to cut Eaton which was probably a 5 million mistake?  Each situation is separate and I think RH has a plan for Kimbrel that is not dumping him for salary relief.  

[ron883]

40 minutes ago, poppysox said:

Jerry is not my boy but I sure don't think he is evil incarnate.  Why didn't you bring up JR allowing RH to cut Eaton which was probably a 5 million mistake?  Each situation is separate and I think RH has a plan for Kimbrel that is not dumping him for salary relief.  

Eaton was a sunk cost. He wasn't contributing to the team and there were better options. It didn't matter if he stayed in the roster to rot or was cut, they owed him 5mil regardless. 

[poppysox]

41 minutes ago, ron883 said:

Eaton was a sunk cost. He wasn't contributing to the team and there were better options. It didn't matter if he stayed in the roster to rot or was cut, they owed him 5mil regardless. 

So he was overpaid and didn't produce...therefore cut.  The situations are the same but just don't fit your narrative.