Sarava Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 59 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said: Yeah.me too. There weren’t any options at 2B so truthfully I’ve expected Conforto the whole time. Not all hope is lost yet. Semien had 30 HR's against righties last year, so he would of had the same effect as adding an impact lh bat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsideirish71 Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 (edited) 13 minutes ago, soxfan3530 said: So if Conforto signs somewhere else, why even bother trading Kimbrel? Might as well keep him and see if he rebounds. Kimbrel has an issue where he seems to have problems if it’s not his ball in the 9th. We have a closer who is better than him. Edited March 21, 2022 by southsideirish71 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 17 minutes ago, southsideirish71 said: Kimbrel has an issue where he seems to have problems if it’s not his ball in the 9th. We have a closer who is better than him. His problem is that he’s a slightly above average reliever. He has an excellent strikeout rate, but also a high home run rate. That means he is going to go through exceptional stretches but they will be broken by a rare but impactful 3 run homer, and it is risky to take trends from 20 or 30 innings of his because of how random events work. Its kinda like Adam Dunn in a way. You pick 20 at bats of his he might go 1/20 with 12 Ks. The next 20 he might go 7/20 with 4 home runs and two doubles. If you say “oh for the first 20 at bats he was hitting cleanup, he just can’t hit there” - you are overconcluding based on a limited sample. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxjusttyped Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 2 minutes ago, Balta1701 said: His problem is that he’s a slightly above average reliever. He has an excellent strikeout rate, but also a high home run rate. That means he is going to go through exceptional stretches but they will be broken by a rare but impactful 3 run homer, and it is risky to take trends from 20 or 30 innings of his because of how random events work. Its kinda like Adam Dunn in a way. You pick 20 at bats of his he might go 1/20 with 12 Ks. The next 20 he might go 7/20 with 4 home runs and two doubles. If you say “oh for the first 20 at bats he was hitting cleanup, he just can’t hit there” - you are overconcluding based on a limited sample. I'm not a Kimbrel guy at all, but he's coming off a season where he was tied for 5th amongst all relievers in fWAR. Slightly ahead of Raisel Iglesias, who just signed a 4/58M contract over the off-season. He has one of the best track records for any relief pitcher of all-time. I think calling him a slightly above average reliever is harsh, and this is coming from someone who was on here trashing acquisition of him from the moment it happened. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 3 minutes ago, Balta1701 said: His problem is that he’s a slightly above average reliever. He has an excellent strikeout rate, but also a high home run rate. That means he is going to go through exceptional stretches but they will be broken by a rare but impactful 3 run homer, and it is risky to take trends from 20 or 30 innings of his because of how random events work. Its kinda like Adam Dunn in a way. You pick 20 at bats of his he might go 1/20 with 12 Ks. The next 20 he might go 7/20 with 4 home runs and two doubles. If you say “oh for the first 20 at bats he was hitting cleanup, he just can’t hit there” - you are overconcluding based on a limited sample. “Slightly above average reliever” who posted the 6th best FIP amongst 144 qualified relievers and only 0.09 points below Liam Hendriks for 5th place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 3 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said: “Slightly above average reliever” who posted the 6th best FIP amongst 144 qualified relievers and only 0.09 points below Liam Hendriks for 5th place. I hope Balta was talking about Kimbrel and not Hendriks. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poppysox Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 1 minute ago, maxjusttyped said: I'm not a Kimbrel guy at all, but he's coming off a season where he was tied for 5th amongst all relievers in fWAR. Slightly ahead of Raisel Iglesias, who just signed a 4/58M contract over the off-season. He has one of the best track records for any relief pitcher of all-time. I think calling him a slightly above average reliever is harsh, and this is coming from someone who was on here trashing acquisition of him from the moment it happened. I didn't like the trade but I understood what RH was trying to do. I hate having 16 M tied up in what seems kind of an iffy performer. I hope we can find a trade partner but failing that I hope he is just great and builds value for the trade deadline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hi8is Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 Did we sign Conforto yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 3 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said: “Slightly above average reliever” who posted the 6th best FIP amongst 144 qualified relievers and only 0.09 points below Liam Hendriks for 5th place. Like I said, you’re playing with sample sizes. The 3 previous years his FIP was 3.13, 8, and 3.97. Averaged over his contract or since his fly ball rate changed, it is worse. It’s 2.93 since he moved to Boston and 3.53 over the past 4 seasons - the latter would actually be a slight below average number, the former slightly above average. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 50 minutes ago, Sarava said: Semien had 30 HR's against righties last year, so he would of had the same effect as adding an impact lh bat. It's the Sox cardinal rule of never bringing back young players we traded away foolishly...certainly not for the going FA market rate. Last year, the (trade deadline) excuse was Eduardo Escobar's quad. We ended up bringing in someone who fared much worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxjusttyped Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 1 minute ago, caulfield12 said: It's the Sox cardinal rule of never bringing back young players we traded away foolishly...certainly not for the going FA market rate. Last year, the (trade deadline) excuse was Eduardo Escobar's quad. We ended up bringing in someone who fared much worse. Can't undo it now, but not prioritizing Eduardo Escobar (who's been a 3+ WAR player 2 of the last 3 years) over going bargain shopping for Josh Harrison will never make sense to me. Escobar didn't even sign for that expensive of a deal. 2/20M with a club option should have been a no-brainer if they weren't serious about signing a high end FA like Story to fill that position for good. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 8 minutes ago, Balta1701 said: Like I said, you’re playing with sample sizes. The 3 previous years his FIP was 3.13, 8, and 3.97. Averaged over his contract or since his fly ball rate changed, it is worse. It’s 2.93 since he moved to Boston and 3.53 over the past 4 seasons - the latter would actually be a slight below average number, the former slightly above average. 2019 + 2020 represent less than 60% of a regular season for him. And why start at 2018 and not 2017 when he posted a 1.42 FIP with Boston? And regardless, is the 3.13 FIP he posted in 2018 really “slightly above average”? For the millionth time you’re overreacting to one horrible partial season (~20 innings) in which he didn’t get a spring training. Yes, he is inconsistent, but he’s ranged between good and great in every single full season. He is much better than a “slightly above average reliever” even if he wasn’t one for the Sox over his two month stint with us. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 2 minutes ago, maxjusttyped said: Can't undo it now, but not prioritizing Eduardo Escobar (who's been a 3+ WAR player 2 of the last 3 years) over going bargain shopping for Josh Harrison will never make sense to me. Escobar didn't even sign for that expensive of a deal. 2/20M with a club option should have been a no-brainer if they weren't serious about signing a high end FA like Story to fill that position for good. Eduardo Escobar + Romy/Mendick >>> Harrison and Leury Plus you can always add bench players as salary dumps at the deadline. Our entire roster construction process is backwards. You logically address RF/2b/starter first, then bullpen, bench maybe backup catcher if one suits your fancy. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 Just now, Chicago White Sox said: 2019 + 2020 represent less than 60% of a regular season for him. And why start at 2018 and not 2017 when he posted a 1.42 FIP with Boston? And regardless, is the 3.13 FIP he posted in 2018 really “slightly above average”? For the millionth time you’re overreacting to one horrible partial season (~20 innings) in which he didn’t get a spring training. Yes, he is inconsistent, but he’s ranged between good and great in every single full season. He is much better than a “slightly above average reliever” even if he wasn’t one for the Sox over his two month stint with us. Yet Hahn has struggled to quickly find someone even to take on his contract, meaning the perception is that he's only worth $10-$13, maybe $14 million on the open market. The Braves clearly decided one year of Jansen was preferable at the same $16 million rate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 Just now, caulfield12 said: Yet Hahn has struggled to quickly find someone even to take on his contract, meaning the perception is that he's only worth $10-$13, maybe $14 million on the open market. The Braves clearly decided one year of Jansen was preferable at the same $16 million rate. You don’t have any idea what Hahn is asking for him right now. Let’s wait and see what kind of trade actually materializes before we keep making these declarations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hogan873 Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 Seems like there must be a small market for Conforto. Could be what he’s looking for in a deal (years, money, or both) or his purported vax status. Or a combination there of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smellysox Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 Honestly, just checking in to see if we have traded Kimbrel yet. Not really expecting much. I guess I missed alot of drama here today on the board though! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flash Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 3 minutes ago, hogan873 said: Seems like there must be a small market for Conforto. Could be what he’s looking for in a deal (years, money, or both) or his purported vax status. Or a combination there of. I would like us to sign him but can make allowances for those who question how much he is worth relative to a Vaughn/Sheets/Engel platoon. The argument being he provides better defense (although Engel would likely cover the latter innings when leading). Offensively, its less obvious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScootsMcGoots Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 44 minutes ago, hi8is said: Did we sign Conforto yet? Yes actually. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Look at Ray Ray Run Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 (edited) 6 hours ago, wegner said: I missed a go F yourself tantrum? Damn basement cleanout!!! Miss a little....miss alot. It is a beautiful day out though, ray. It wasn't quite a bobby knight tantrum but maybe a little bobby valentine! Finally a decent weekend day; felt like we were getting screwed with only the nice days during the week. Been awhile since we got over to the dogpark; pup refused to leave for like 1 hour. Excited for some baseball to start counting and for this terrible offseason just to wrap itself up so all the nonsense can stop and reality can be except... and for hopefully nice spring/summer weather. Hope you're doing well, pal! Edited March 21, 2022 by Look at Ray Ray Run Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiliIrishHammock24 Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 2 hours ago, soxfan3530 said: So if Conforto signs somewhere else, why even bother trading Kimbrel? Might as well keep him and see if he rebounds. My thoughts too. The only reason we are all assuming Kimbrel needs to go is because we are all assuming the Sox won't sign Conforto with Kimbrel on the books as well. But if we miss out on Conforto....then absolutely no reason to trade Kimbrel *just because*. I kind of wonder if that's what's holding up a Kimbrel deal. That maybe the Sox feel the same way, it's one or the other....but it doesn't have to be neither. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wegner Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 38 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said: It wasn't quite a bobby knight tantrum but maybe a little bobby valentine! Finally a decent weekend day; felt like we were getting screwed with only the nice days during the week. Been awhile since we got over to the dogpark; pup refused to leave for like 1 hour. Excited for some baseball to start counting and for this terrible offseason just to wrap itself up so all the nonsense can stop and reality can be except... and for hopefully nice spring/summer weather. Hope you're doing well, pal! Thanks....just hanging in there til I can get my almost daily baseball fix. My weekend days are full with dealing with a new garage with attic space. I can't wait to sit back and watch some Sox baseball with a cold one. Is that Crede you took to the dog park or a new pup? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Chappas Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 2 hours ago, maxjusttyped said: I'm not a Kimbrel guy at all, but he's coming off a season where he was tied for 5th amongst all relievers in fWAR. Slightly ahead of Raisel Iglesias, who just signed a 4/58M contract over the off-season. He has one of the best track records for any relief pitcher of all-time. I think calling him a slightly above average reliever is harsh, and this is coming from someone who was on here trashing acquisition of him from the moment it happened. The issue with me is the catchers cant catch his best pitch. Similar to Hendricks. That was not addressed either this offseason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Hibbard Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 Is the vax issue an issue with the Sox culturally? I’m not trying to turn this into a conversation about politics and science, I’m just curious if the Sox flat don’t want conforto specifically for that reason but will never actually say it publicly and ostensibly pretend to chase him like they did with Machado Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 3 minutes ago, Greg Hibbard said: Is the vax issue an issue with the Sox culturally? I’m not trying to turn this into a conversation about politics and science, I’m just curious if the Sox flat don’t want conforto specifically for that reason but will never actually say it publicly and ostensibly pretend to chase him like they did with Machado I've wondered that as well. And I'm not saying it's a valid excuse for the Sox not to sign Conforto. I could give a shit, build the best team possible (aside from the Brett Myers of the world.) But I do wonder if them coming out a few months ago about Spring Training does impact things? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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