maxjusttyped Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 4 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said: Yeah, and I don't think they'd go anywhere near 7 years with a pitcher. Gio continues improving and gets to FA he's looking at a Strasburg deal. The Sox do irrational things all of the time, so maybe I shouldn't give them the benefit of the doubt here, but being willing to go above 5/118M for Wheeler but drawing the line at 6 or 7 years for a (comparing Lucas now to Wheeler then) better pitcher with a much less concerning history of injuries would make 0 sense at all to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FoxForce2 Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 5 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said: I think you're right, but it will be infuriating and damaging to let him walk for nothing. There's always the QO. Wait --- the Rodon thing... I'm so confused. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 (edited) 7 minutes ago, FoxForce2 said: There's always the QO. Wait --- the Rodon thing... I'm so confused. QO will probably be a thing of the past. They are probably going to agree on an international draft. Edited March 28, 2022 by Jack Parkman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaliSoxFanViaSWside Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 26 minutes ago, almagest said: I noticed this too, and called it out a few games ago. Looks like the book is out on him. Perhaps you also noticed that 6 of his 17 AB's prior to this game today were against LHP and against RHP he was batting .364 in 11 ABs if we are going to draw conclusions based on small sample sizes and ST games. He's going to play against mostly RHP and rarely against LHP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 14 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: It is important to realize that Gio is only in his 2nd arb year. Last year when this deal was kicked around he was in his first. It wouldn't be hard to put together something like 8/12/22/25 with option for 25, including a $5 million buyout and a 3 million dollar signing bonus to come up with a 4/70 or 5/90 structure and be around market value for the type of extension we are taking about. It would get the Sox some certainty, while still giving Gio a run at FA early, without breaking the bank. Just to walk through this: he turns 28 this year. So by ages: 28: $8 29: $12 30: $22 31: $25 32: $25 He turns 33 in the year he would be a free agent. I don't see how you're getting to the final part where he "gets a run at FA early". 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaliSoxFanViaSWside Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 28 minutes ago, ptatc said: Danks and Buehrle come to mind. Burns, Dotson and Bannister from the old days. But thise were the bad contracts that scared JR from long term deals to pitchers. I don't think JR needs to be scared of not handing out big contracts to anyone. Big to him is anything higher than $90M these days when the rest of baseball surpasses that many many times in the last 4 or 5 off seasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 Just now, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said: I don't think JR needs to be scared of not handing out big contracts to anyone. Big to him is anything higher than $90M these days when the rest of baseball surpasses that many many times in the last 4 or 5 off seasons. In the early 80s when the entire pitching fell apart with odd injuries Dotson (TOS) and Burns (arthritic hip) it made them aware of how fickle long term pitcher contracts would be. One reason they traded McDowell was his arthritic hip issue. He wanted a longer deal. The Sox traded him and he had only one good year after it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FoxForce2 Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 9 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said: QO will probably be a thing of the past. They are probably going to agree on an international draft. Or not - if one side or the other decides to shorten the CBA time frame and not go with the owner's initial proposal. The owners themselves could back out of that. Assuming no QO or reasonable compensation, it would make sense to consider a trade for Gio. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaliSoxFanViaSWside Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 56 minutes ago, ptatc said: Sox have a history of extending their own pitchers. Better than fair chance he signs one. 4 minutes ago, ptatc said: In the early 80s when the entire pitching fell apart with odd injuries Dotson (TOS) and Burns (arthritic hip) it made them aware of how fickle long term pitcher contracts would be. One reason they traded McDowell was his arthritic hip issue. He wanted a longer deal. The Sox traded him and he had only one good year after it. SO if I combine these 2 posts he's scared to sign pitchers to long term deals but there's a better than fair chance that he sign an extension because the Sox have a history of extending their own pitchers ? Is he also scared to sign position players to big money extensions beyond more than a few FA years or sign FA agents to big contracts ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2Jimmy0 Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 30 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said: QO will probably be a thing of the past. They are probably going to agree on an international draft. I’m assuming that teams will still get a pick for losing free agents, they just won’t forfeit one. Could be wrong though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FoxForce2 Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 24 minutes ago, Balta1701 said: Just to walk through this: he turns 28 this year. So by ages: 28: $8 29: $12 30: $22 31: $25 32: $25 He turns 33 in the year he would be a free agent. I don't see how you're getting to the final part where he "gets a run at FA early". I don't keep up with the ins and outs of contract negotiations as many on this board do. According to Sportrac, unless he signs an extension, Gio is an UFA as of the 2024 season. Age (29-30). What am I missing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FoxForce2 Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 8 minutes ago, Y2Jimmy0 said: I’m assuming that teams will still get a pick for losing free agents, they just won’t forfeit one. Could be wrong though. I'm thinking a supplemental pick end of 2nd-3rd round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 34 minutes ago, Balta1701 said: Just to walk through this: he turns 28 this year. So by ages: 28: $8 29: $12 30: $22 31: $25 32: $25 He turns 33 in the year he would be a free agent. I don't see how you're getting to the final part where he "gets a run at FA early". A 7 or 8 year pushes that back by how much? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 4 minutes ago, FoxForce2 said: I don't keep up with the ins and outs of contract negotiations as many on this board do. According to Sportrac, unless he signs an extension, Gio is an UFA as of the 2024 season. Age (29-30). What am I missing? He proposed a hypothetical extension for Giolito. While that extension would be a generally fair market value number for him, the way the ages would work out makes it troublesome for him. If he took a $90 million extension, he basically doesn't hit FA again until he's 32, starting his year 33 season. Very few guys score long-term deals at that point - teams are much more likely to pay big time contracts out for a guy who is 29 going on 30. So the calculus for a Giolito would be - I guarantee myself $65 million, it could go as high as $90 million, but my career earnings aren't likely to go much beyond that unless I'm still really good and healthy 5 years from now. Or alternatively, I pitch 2 more seasons like I am right now and I sign a $130 million+ deal - and if I'm any better than last year, I still have a ceiling where I could push the deal even higher. With the 2 arb years, that leaves my career earnings at $155 million+, compared to $90 million plus whatever I can get for my age 33 season. This sure seems like a place where there's a big reward for "Betting on yourself". 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxjusttyped Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 36 minutes ago, Balta1701 said: Just to walk through this: he turns 28 this year. So by ages: 28: $8 29: $12 30: $22 31: $25 32: $25 He turns 33 in the year he would be a free agent. I don't see how you're getting to the final part where he "gets a run at FA early". The fact Gio's camp didn't counter when the Sox put a shorter deal on the table makes me think it's not something he's interested in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FoxForce2 Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 Just now, Balta1701 said: He proposed a hypothetical extension for Giolito. While that extension would be a generally fair market value number for him, the way the ages would work out makes it troublesome for him. If he took a $90 million extension, he basically doesn't hit FA again until he's 32, starting his year 33 season. Very few guys score long-term deals at that point - teams are much more likely to pay big time contracts out for a guy who is 29 going on 30. So the calculus for a Giolito would be - I guarantee myself $65 million, it could go as high as $90 million, but my career earnings aren't likely to go much beyond that unless I'm still really good and healthy 5 years from now. Or alternatively, I pitch 2 more seasons like I am right now and I sign a $130 million+ deal - and if I'm any better than last year, I still have a ceiling where I could push the deal even higher. This sure seems like a place where there's a big reward for "Betting on yourself". I just scrolled up and read both your and his posts- ok I see. DOH. But from reading Gio and his Dad's remarks, they're not especially enamored of an extension at this point anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 People keep ripping the Sox for having Vaughn in RF. I'm not sure if they are the starters but can anyone take SD serious if they have Myers, profar and mazara in the OF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 (edited) 18 minutes ago, ptatc said: People keep ripping the Sox for having Vaughn in RF. I'm not sure if they are the starters but can anyone take SD serious if they have Myers, profar and mazara in the OF Ummm....Grisham, Myers and Abrams could easily be the starters. Profar as supersub. Trayce Thompson has been starting recently. Roster filler. Same with Mazara. Jorge Alfaro continues monster spring fighting with Caratini for #2 job. Out of options like Adolfo. Will likely carry 3 guys the first month. Edited March 28, 2022 by caulfield12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 (edited) 1 minute ago, caulfield12 said: Ummm....Grisham, Myers and Abrams could easily be the starters. Profar as supersub. Trayce Thompson has been starting recently. Roster filler. Same with Mazara. Jorge Alfaro continues monster spring fighting with Caratini for #2 job. Out of options like Adolfo. Will likely carry 3 guys the first month. I thought Abrams was going to stay in the infield. Edited March 28, 2022 by ptatc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 (edited) What happened to Crochet? Got shellacked. Edited March 28, 2022 by Jack Parkman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 3 minutes ago, ptatc said: I thought Abrams was going to stay in the infield. They will go with Kim and Cronenworth unless Kim continues to hit .175 while playing GG defense at SS... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 Just now, Jack Parkman said: What happened to Crochet? Got shellacked. Almost got out of it...recorded first two outs with bases loaded and then touched up by Alfaro for a bases clearing double. Jimenez and Alfaro clearly the hottest hitters for both organizations...along with TA7. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 19 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said: What happened to Crochet? Got shellacked. As long as he's still hitting 98, I can care less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beast Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 Are we freaking out about Crochet’s outing? Asking for a friend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flavum Posted March 28, 2022 Share Posted March 28, 2022 Probably another round of cuts coming with off day tomorrow. Good bye, Rios. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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