JR

[WBWSF]

It seems like JR has  disappeared from the scene. He doesn't  give interviews  anymore. He was the one  who hired TLR. I can't help but wonder what JR thinks of this present team. Assuming he has been watching these games, he has to be upset.  I can't help but wonder  what if anything is going to be done. I find it hard to believe that nothing is going to be done to correct this situation. The team not only has a losing record, the team is dull.  

[Vote4Pedro]

Nothing will happen. They will have their blinders on the rest of the year. JR is too prideful to admit when he’s made a mistake and the whole reason he hired him to begin with was to try and right a wrong from 30 years ago. 

[The Beast]

He’s 86. I doubt he gives a shit.

[ron883]

Has Jerry ever really cared about winning? He cares about making money and employing his loved ones much more. He'd rather lose than fire his good buddy TLR.

[tray]

I have always thought JR would not replace Tony during the season, but I am beginning to think he might. I have been watching Sox games for decades and I have never seen so many heart wrenching close losses in one season, let alone in just a half of a season.  JR is watching the same shitshow we are so I doubt he is going to let things devolve any further.  I think we will see some substantial changes between now and the start of the second half.

Maybe these guys just aren't as good as some of us thought they were.  Unrealistic expectations often lead to disappointment.

[Greg Hibbard]

53 minutes ago, ron883 said:

Has Jerry ever really cared about winning? He cares about making money and employing his loved ones much more. He'd rather lose than fire his good buddy TLR.

at this point, I think this is mostly correct.
 

Jerry is complacent, old, and just wants to be surrounded by his people. Institutionally we are so toxic.
 

It is an utter shame we are wasting this much talent. 

[joejoesox]

2 hours ago, WBWSF said:

It seems like JR has  disappeared from the scene. He doesn't  give interviews  anymore. He was the one  who hired TLR. I can't help but wonder what JR thinks of this present team. Assuming he has been watching these games, he has to be upset.  I can't help but wonder  what if anything is going to be done. I find it hard to believe that nothing is going to be done to correct this situation. The team not only has a losing record, the team is dull.  

lmao are you serious, JR is happy because he's making money

[WBWSF]

7 hours ago, tray said:

I have always thought JR would not replace Tony during the season, but I am beginning to think he might. I have been watching Sox games for decades and I have never seen so many heart wrenching close losses in one season, let alone in just a half of a season.  JR is watching the same shitshow we are so I doubt he is going to let things devolve any further.  I think we will see some substantial changes between now and the start of the second half.

Maybe these guys just aren't as good as some of us thought they were.  Unrealistic expectations often lead to disappointment.

It would be easier to  replace the manager than change the team. All I know, something has to be done.

[Dick Allen]

7 hours ago, tray said:

I have always thought JR would not replace Tony during the season, but I am beginning to think he might. I have been watching Sox games for decades and I have never seen so many heart wrenching close losses in one season, let alone in just a half of a season.  JR is watching the same shitshow we are so I doubt he is going to let things devolve any further.  I think we will see some substantial changes between now and the start of the second half.

Maybe these guys just aren't as good as some of us thought they were.  Unrealistic expectations often lead to disappointment.

Firing Tony would be admitting he was wrong. That takes time. No way he does it during the season. I am hoping Tony realizes he sucks and walks away at the All Star break. But other than that, I think he's here until the end of the season. Then I think it's almost guaranteed he isn't coming back. They will come up with some excuse other than being incompetent, although that will be the real reason. I am sure KW and RH and even JR know Tony isn't a guy that is going to lead a baseball team to a championship anymore.

[Chick Mercedes]

8 hours ago, ron883 said:

Has Jerry ever really cared about winning? He cares about making money and employing his loved ones much more. He'd rather lose than fire his good buddy TLR.

He cares about winning that validates his hubris. Always, that has been who he is. If he had to do things the way the rest of the league does things, winning would probably be begrudgingl

[T R U]

8 hours ago, tray said:

I have always thought JR would not replace Tony during the season, but I am beginning to think he might. I have been watching Sox games for decades and I have never seen so many heart wrenching close losses in one season, let alone in just a half of a season.  JR is watching the same shitshow we are so I doubt he is going to let things devolve any further.  I think we will see some substantial changes between now and the start of the second half.

Maybe these guys just aren't as good as some of us thought they were.  Unrealistic expectations often lead to disappointment.

There's just no way this is going to happen. The White Sox haven't fired a manager in season in almost 30 years.

[GreatScott82]

Has Jerry ever fired a manager in season during his tenure as majority owner? Outside of the Ozzie Guillen situation near the end of 2011, I cant ever remember a manager being let go until the end of the season. So the "Fire Tony" chants are a waste of breath this early in the season. It just wont happen. The sad thing is, most of the fanbase know this team is lifeless. I give credit to the Angel and Phillies organizations for actually doing something about their short comings. The only thing that has happened so far is the DFA of Keuchel. At minimum Menechino should be let go for the downfall of the offensive approach.  The season is half over, your are 6 games back, 39-42, 11-15 against your division foes and a dogcrap 17-24 at HOME! The Sox dominated at home last season. 

Where are you at Rick Hahn? Kenny? Jerry? Accountability simply doesn't exist on the southside. In a year that was designated as 'the year' post-rebuild, I am beyond disappointed in the front office for a lack of creativity during a winter that had so many talented free agents and they bring in: Gravemen (good), Kelly (bad), Harrison(embarrassing) and trade for Pollock (meh). Its almost as if Jerry prepared Hahn and KW early in the winter to remain stagnant because of the looming MLB lockout. Now they are stuck in the mud with this underperforming roster. I am disappointed with this dogcrap training staff for not preparing these players to stay healthy, I am disappointed with how soft these players appear to be. I am disappointed in Tony's dogcrap in game managing and old ass stubbornness. I am disappointed anytime TA, LR or JA give away at bats as they often do this season. I am disappointed at my favorite franchise for not appearing to care about what us fans feel and think.. its sad. WE DESERVE BETTER!!! DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT!!!! The sitting and waiting approach HAS NOT WORKED! 

Edited July 8, 2022 by GreatScott82

[Kyyle23]

5 minutes ago, GreatScott82 said:

Has Jerry ever fired a manager in season during his tenure as majority owner? Outside of the Ozzie Guillen situation near the end of 2011, I cant ever remember a manager being let go until the end of the season. So the "Fire Tony" chants are a waste of breath this early in the season. It just wont happen. The sad thing is, most of the fanbase know this team is lifeless. I give credit to the Angel and Phillies organizations for actually doing something about their short comings. The only thing that has happened so far is the DFA of Keuchel. At minimum Menechino should be let go for the downfall of the offensive approach.  The season is half over, your are 6 games back, 39-42, 11-15 against your division foes and a dogcrap 17-24 at HOME! The Sox dominated at home last season. 

Where are you at Rick Hahn? Kenny? Jerry? Accountability simply doesn't exist on the southside. In a year that was designated as 'the year' post-rebuild, I am beyond disappointed in the front office for a lack of creativity during a winter that had so many talented free agents and they bring in: Gravemen (good), Kelly (bad), Harrison(embarrassing) and trade for Pollock (meh). Its almost as if Jerry prepared Hahn and KW early in the winter to remain stagnant because of the looming MLB lockout. Now they are stuck in the mud with this underperforming roster. I am disappointed with this dogcrap training staff for not preparing these players to stay healthy, I am disappointed with how soft these players appear to be. I am disappointed in Tony's dogcrap in game managing and old ass stubbornness. I am disappointed anytime TA, LR or JA give away at bats as they often do this season. I am disappointed at my favorite franchise for not appearing to care about what us fans feel and think.. its sad. WE DESERVE BETTER!!! DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT!!!! The sitting and waiting approach HAS NOT WORKED! 

Lamont 

[T R U]

Everybody is frustrated and angry with how this season has gone so far, but the sad reality is this is a team that is under performing in a bad division and is absolutely not out of it yet. We have played exactly half of our season, and we are 6 games back of first place and 4.5 games back of a wild card. No one is getting fired anytime soon and the towel isn't going to be thrown in either. There are way too many expectations to give up so they will continue to press on with what they have.

We don't have to agree with it, but it is what is it. We have 12 games coming up with the two teams directly in front of us as well as an embarrassingly, on paper, easy August schedule.

Don't get your hopes up for some massive change coming, its not.

[CentralChamps21]

7 minutes ago, GreatScott82 said:

Has Jerry ever fired a manager in season during his tenure as majority owner? Outside of the Ozzie Guillen situation near the end of 2011, I cant ever remember a manager being let go until the end of the season. So the "Fire Tony" chants are a waste of breath this early in the season. It just wont happen. The sad thing is, most of the fanbase know this team is lifeless. I give credit to the Angel and Phillies organizations for actually doing something about their short comings. The only thing that has happened so far is the DFA of Keuchel. At minimum Menechino should be let go for the downfall of the offensive approach.  The season is half over, your are 6 games back, 39-42, 11-15 against your division foes and a dogcrap 17-24 at HOME! The Sox dominated at home last season. 

Where are you at Rick Hahn? Kenny? Jerry? Accountability simply doesn't exist on the southside. In a year that was designated as 'the year' post-rebuild, I am beyond disappointed in the front office for a lack of creativity during a winter that had so many talented free agents and they bring in: Gravemen (good), Kelly (bad), Harrison(embarrassing) and trade for Pollock (meh). Its almost as if Jerry prepared Hahn and KW early in the winter to remain stagnant because of the looming MLB lockout. Now they are stuck in the mud with this underperforming roster. I am disappointed with this dogcrap training staff for not preparing these players to stay healthy, I am disappointed with how soft these players appear to be. I am disappointed in Tony's dogcrap in game managing and old ass stubbornness. I am disappointed anytime TA, LR or JA give away at bats as they often do this season. I am disappointed at my favorite franchise for not appearing to care about what us fans feel and think.. its sad. WE DESERVE BETTER!!! DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT!!!! The sitting and waiting approach HAS NOT WORKED! 

Wasn't TLR fired mid-season and isn't that a big part of why we're where we're at now?

[Highland]

12 minutes ago, CentralChamps21 said:

Wasn't TLR fired mid-season and isn't that a big part of why we're where we're at now?

LaRussa was fired at mid-season, but that was more Hawk than JR. In fact, one condition that Hawk to be hired as GM was that he had to keep LaRussa. Regardless, the LaRussa firing was handled as bad as it could have been handled. If Hawk was going to be GM, he should have been able to pick his own manager in the beginning.

Right now, there is no one to challenge JR. The ship is sinking, but the yes-men are circling the wagons and pretending nothing is wrong. The FO puts its reputation on the line with the rebuild, and it isn't working. The future doesn't look so bright. So, yes, the whole LaRussa thing in 1986 is one reason we are in this current position. 

[chetkincaid]

2 hours ago, Dick Allen said:

Firing Tony would be admitting he was wrong. That takes time. No way he does it during the season. I am hoping Tony realizes he sucks and walks away at the All Star break. But other than that, I think he's here until the end of the season. Then I think it's almost guaranteed he isn't coming back. They will come up with some excuse other than being incompetent, although that will be the real reason. I am sure KW and RH and even JR know Tony isn't a guy that is going to lead a baseball team to a championship anymore.

He will move into the front office and and will still have influence over the team - more than Hahn. It's an awful situation.

[ChiSox59]

I can't for the life of me believe that JR is happy with the state of the club or satisfied with where Tony has these guys playing.  Tony is costing his organization money at the gate, and missing the playoffs in a season which the Sox certainly expected to be there will mean a significant drop in projected revenues.  TLR is also, in theory, impacting the value of the organization because I truly believe that most in the Sox FO and ownership believed this core would be an annual playoff team contending for WSs from 2020-2025 and beyond.   Right now, that is looking far less likely than it looked the day TLR was hired.  You can't tell me that the Sox making 5 straight playoffs with a couple WS appearances and perhaps a title wouldn't measurable increase the valuation of the organization.  That absolutely has to matter to JR. 

We can all hate the guy and call him names and rightfully so, but he didn't get to where he is in life being a dumbass.  He's old, and like his buddy TLR, certainly isn't as sharp as he once was...but I don't believe for a second that he doesn't care.   At some point, enough has to be enough.  I doubt they fire TLR in-season, but if the Sox miss the playoffs, I cannot image they'd allow him to come back as a lame duck manager that has completely killed all momentum the org had. 

[chetkincaid]

Bernstein once said that Jerry's day to day life is unaffected by the White Sox. He goes out with his buddies and doesn't stress himself with White Sox business. I believe that.

[ChiSox59]

2 minutes ago, chetkincaid said:

Bernstein once said that Jerry's day to day life is unaffected by the White Sox. He goes out with his buddies and doesn't stress himself with White Sox business. I believe that.

I don't believe that.  IF that was the case, why doesn't he allow the baseball people in charge make the baseball decisions?  Like I dunno....hiring and firing the manager. 

[southsider2k5]

12 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

I can't for the life of me believe that JR is happy with the state of the club or satisfied with where Tony has these guys playing.  Tony is costing his organization money at the gate, and missing the playoffs in a season which the Sox certainly expected to be there will mean a significant drop in projected revenues.  TLR is also, in theory, impacting the value of the organization because I truly believe that most in the Sox FO and ownership believed this core would be an annual playoff team contending for WSs from 2020-2025 and beyond.   Right now, that is looking far less likely than it looked the day TLR was hired.  You can't tell me that the Sox making 5 straight playoffs with a couple WS appearances and perhaps a title wouldn't measurable increase the valuation of the organization.  That absolutely has to matter to JR. 

We can all hate the guy and call him names and rightfully so, but he didn't get to where he is in life being a dumbass.  He's old, and like his buddy TLR, certainly isn't as sharp as he once was...but I don't believe for a second that he doesn't care.   At some point, enough has to be enough.  I doubt they fire TLR in-season, but if the Sox miss the playoffs, I cannot image they'd allow him to come back as a lame duck manager that has completely killed all momentum the org had. 

This is what I can't get past.  Look, at any other time in Sox history, the Sox being on back to back playoff appearances would mean HUGE increases at the gate.  If you knock out the 1st half of the 21 season with COVID attendance restrictions, we have to flat to down on attendance this year.

Even more than the W/L are they seeing the complete apathy of the fan base at the gate?  They should be drawing 30k a night, instead we are at the levels of a decade ago.  We aren't even on pace for 2 million fans this season.

[WBWSF]

5 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

This is what I can't get past.  Look, at any other time in Sox history, the Sox being on back to back playoff appearances would mean HUGE increases at the gate.  If you knock out the 1st half of the 21 season with COVID attendance restrictions, we have to flat to down on attendance this year.

Even more than the W/L are they seeing the complete apathy of the fan base at the gate?  They should be drawing 30k a night, instead we are at the levels of a decade ago.  We aren't even on pace for 2 million fans this season.

Most teams are down attendance wise. Inflation, gas prices are brutal. I've never seen anything like this in my life. I'm under the impression that alot of people are living on their credit cards. White Sox are going to draw between 1.8 million-2 million which isn't bad considering everything.

[Kyyle23]

2 minutes ago, WBWSF said:

Most teams are down attendance wise. Inflation, gas prices are brutal. I've never seen anything like this in my life. I'm under the impression that alot of people are living on their credit cards. White Sox are going to draw between 1.8 million-2 million which isn't bad considering everything.

This is extremely optimistic.  I don't think they reach these numbers without a significant second half run 

[mmmmmbeeer]

This is an owner who would probably still have Gar Forman and John Paxson leading the Bulls FO if he hadn't handed team control over to his son, Michael.  As bad as TLR has been, the GarPax Bulls tenure makes Tony's performance seem impressive in comparison.

[southsider2k5]

6 minutes ago, WBWSF said:

Most teams are down attendance wise. Inflation, gas prices are brutal. I've never seen anything like this in my life. I'm under the impression that alot of people are living on their credit cards. White Sox are going to draw between 1.8 million-2 million which isn't bad considering everything.

This is not why the Sox are suffering right now at the gate.