whitesox61382 Posted October 28, 2003 Share Posted October 28, 2003 I think it will be alomar valentin and borchard in center I hope not. If thats the Sox middle next year, than the Sox won't make the playoffs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted October 28, 2003 Share Posted October 28, 2003 "I think you'll find a lot of people in here that think Carlos was our best position player last year. As I said, I'll stick with Lee." Certainly debatable, especially if you use stats to make your decision. I love Lee, but I still think people are overexagerating his 2003 season. I personally thought that last year was a better year then this year because of the drastic improvement in plate disipline, which is usually a good sign of development in a young hitter, however, the fact that he regressed this year is discouraging to me. Improving the middle infield is MUCH MORE IMPORTANT IMO then keeping one-dimension power hitting LF/RF/1B/DH's. .291 with 31 HR and 113 RBI. Damn you're right. This guy sucks. What was I thinking? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitesox61382 Posted October 28, 2003 Share Posted October 28, 2003 "I think you'll find a lot of people in here that think Carlos was our best position player last year. As I said, I'll stick with Lee." Certainly debatable, especially if you use stats to make your decision. I love Lee, but I still think people are overexagerating his 2003 season. I personally thought that last year was a better year then this year because of the drastic improvement in plate disipline, which is usually a good sign of development in a young hitter, however, the fact that he regressed this year is discouraging to me. Improving the middle infield is MUCH MORE IMPORTANT IMO then keeping one-dimension power hitting LF/RF/1B/DH's. .291 with 31 HR and 113 RBI. Damn you're right. This guy sucks. What was I thinking? Yansy, quit overexagerating. At no point did I say that he sucks, I simple said that he might be a little overrated by some Sox fans. The fact is that OPS is probably the best single stat to measure a hitter, and Lee's OPS of .830 is only slightly above average and not all that impressive for a corner outfield, yet you make it appear that he is the best thing since sliced bread(if you overexagerate then so will I). I would argue that Maggs(.926 OPS) and Thomas(.952) were ahead of Lee as far as being the best/most productive offensive players. I would hate to lose Lee, but a solid middle infielder is harder to find then an average offensive corner outfielder, and it is that simple. If Seattle throws in a solid pitching prospect you have yourself a fair deal for both sides. It is that simple if you look at things from a realistic perspective. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted October 29, 2003 Share Posted October 29, 2003 "I think you'll find a lot of people in here that think Carlos was our best position player last year. As I said, I'll stick with Lee." Certainly debatable, especially if you use stats to make your decision. I love Lee, but I still think people are overexagerating his 2003 season. I personally thought that last year was a better year then this year because of the drastic improvement in plate disipline, which is usually a good sign of development in a young hitter, however, the fact that he regressed this year is discouraging to me. Improving the middle infield is MUCH MORE IMPORTANT IMO then keeping one-dimension power hitting LF/RF/1B/DH's. .291 with 31 HR and 113 RBI. Damn you're right. This guy sucks. What was I thinking? Yansy, quit overexagerating. At no point did I say that he sucks, I simple said that he might be a little overrated by some Sox fans. The fact is that OPS is probably the best single stat to measure a hitter, and Lee's OPS of .830 is only slightly above average and not all that impressive for a corner outfield, yet you make it appear that he is the best thing since sliced bread(if you overexagerate then so will I). I would argue that Maggs(.926 OPS) and Thomas(.952) were ahead of Lee as far as being the best/most productive offensive players. I would hate to lose Lee, but a solid middle infielder is harder to find then an average offensive corner outfielder, and it is that simple. If Seattle throws in a solid pitching prospect you have yourself a fair deal for both sides. It is that simple if you look at things from a realistic perspective. Ok. let's look at this situation. You call Lee a one-dimesional OF-1B-DH type. Yet, he led the team in RBI's despite being bounced around in the lineup. He led the team in stolen bases. He improved his game defensively by an impressive margin this year, as well as his overall baserunning savvy. When this team was struggling early in 2003, playing lethargic, unispired baseball, Carlos Lee was busting his ass trying to make something happen. Anything from diving catches to agreesively running the bases to take an extra base. Hardly a "one dimensional" player. Now, what I'm going to say here is in no way an exaggeration. In my opinion, Carlos Lee was the most valuable non-pitcher on the White Sox in 2003. I restate: No thanks, I'll keep Lee. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted October 29, 2003 Share Posted October 29, 2003 "I think you'll find a lot of people in here that think Carlos was our best position player last year. As I said, I'll stick with Lee." Certainly debatable, especially if you use stats to make your decision. I love Lee, but I still think people are overexagerating his 2003 season. I personally thought that last year was a better year then this year because of the drastic improvement in plate disipline, which is usually a good sign of development in a young hitter, however, the fact that he regressed this year is discouraging to me. Improving the middle infield is MUCH MORE IMPORTANT IMO then keeping one-dimension power hitting LF/RF/1B/DH's. .291 with 31 HR and 113 RBI. Damn you're right. This guy sucks. What was I thinking? Yansy, quit overexagerating. At no point did I say that he sucks, I simple said that he might be a little overrated by some Sox fans. The fact is that OPS is probably the best single stat to measure a hitter, and Lee's OPS of .830 is only slightly above average and not all that impressive for a corner outfield, yet you make it appear that he is the best thing since sliced bread(if you overexagerate then so will I). I would argue that Maggs(.926 OPS) and Thomas(.952) were ahead of Lee as far as being the best/most productive offensive players. I would hate to lose Lee, but a solid middle infielder is harder to find then an average offensive corner outfielder, and it is that simple. If Seattle throws in a solid pitching prospect you have yourself a fair deal for both sides. It is that simple if you look at things from a realistic perspective. But think of it this way, how much would it cost to get someone like Rich Aurilla in here to play shortstop. I think he's a pretty good definition of a "solid" shortstop. Compare that to dealing Lee for Guillen who would make easily as much as Aurilla will get. I think the best option for the Sox is bringing Lee back, hoping that somehow he could become more of a DH eventually with Thomas going elsewhere and Konerko getting dealt. Lee is a keeper, imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastime Posted October 30, 2003 Share Posted October 30, 2003 When it's all said and done, Lee will put up numbers BETTER than Maggs' numbers, IMO. He's more of a natural hitter, and he seems to have better plate discipline. I'd keep him too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted October 30, 2003 Share Posted October 30, 2003 When it's all said and done, Lee will put up numbers BETTER than Maggs' numbers, IMO. He's more of a natural hitter, and he seems to have better plate discipline. I'd keep him too. Carlos is damn good, but that's stretching it a bit. IMHO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastime Posted October 30, 2003 Share Posted October 30, 2003 Yas, I'm an eternal optimist, don't you remember? I think Lee can put up 40 HR and 130 RBI's in the near future. Even Maggs hasn't reached that level yet. Carlos Lee reminds me a lot of a poor man's Manny Ramirez. However, in order to be more like Manny, Carlos needs to have a steady diet of cheeseburgers and pizza. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastime Posted October 30, 2003 Share Posted October 30, 2003 And be a clubhouse cancer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted October 30, 2003 Share Posted October 30, 2003 Yas, I'm an eternal optimist, don't you remember? I think Lee can put up 40 HR and 130 RBI's in the near future. Even Maggs hasn't reached that level yet. Carlos Lee reminds me a lot of a poor man's Manny Ramirez. However, in order to be more like Manny, Carlos needs to have a steady diet of cheeseburgers and pizza. In 2002 Maggs had 38 HR and 135 RBI with a .320 BA and a .978 OPS. I'd say he "reached" that level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastime Posted October 30, 2003 Share Posted October 30, 2003 But his numbers are declining. Has he reached his peak? I don't know. I'm not willing to spend 14 million a year to find out. Sorry. I still think that trading Maggs would be the best thing to happen to this team in the last 20 years. Griffey was traded. The Mariners took the available money and kept winning. A-Rod was traded (let go). The Mariners took the available money and kept winning. I love Maggs, but his salary could make me love 2 or 3 free agents even more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted October 30, 2003 Share Posted October 30, 2003 His number have been on a steady incline until 2003. Was 2003 the beginning of a downward trend or an abberation. I'd be inclined to think it was the latter. Hmmmm .... two different uses of "incline" in the same post, yet with different meanings. Sorry, strange things catch my attention sometimes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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