Fire Rick Hahn

[South Side Hit Men]

18 hours ago, Balta1701 said:

But one of them is definitely Shelly Duncan and the long experience and skill that earned him the job totally offsets some of that. 

Statistically, La Russia’s teams did better when Tony’s veterinarian friend was at the helm. His reign also coincided with Tony working in solid organizations (Oakland and Saint Louis), and before the onset of his cognitive decline.

TWTW, for all intents and purposes, remains the extent of White Sox “strategery”.

Hahn is responsible for the past ten years to develop a plan to install competent qualified people to develop an analytics program and convince Jerry of the benefits. He has failed at this task.

Hahn’s primary claim to fame was exploiting young immigrant labor with “team friendly contracts”, threatening to let them rot in the minor leagues if they didn’t sign, and pawning off what he inherited from Kenny after 2016. He will finish his tenure as the worst GM in club history.

The sooner this happens, the sooner the White Sox can possibly improve to the point they can actually be legitimate contenders. Likely won’t happen until Jerry is gone as well.

[oldsox]

1 hour ago, South Side Hit Men said:

Statistically, La Russia’s teams did better when Tony’s veterinarian friend was at the helm. His reign also coincided with Tony working in solid organizations (Oakland and Saint Louis), and before the onset of his cognitive decline.

TWTW, for all intents and purposes, remains the extent of White Sox “strategery”.

Hahn is responsible for the past ten years to develop a plan to install competent qualified people to develop an analytics program and convince Jerry of the benefits. He has failed at this task.

Hahn’s primary claim to fame was exploiting young immigrant labor with “team friendly contracts”, threatening to let them rot in the minor leagues if they didn’t sign, and pawning off what he inherited from Kenny after 2016. He will finish his tenure as the worst GM in club history.

The sooner this happens, the sooner the White Sox can possibly improve to the point they can actually be legitimate contenders. Likely won’t happen until Jerry is gone as well.

Hahn certainly does not need me to defend him, since I have long advocated that he be gone, but you are exaggerating a bit, aren't you?

[Timmy U]

Maybe we should merge all these threads into a massive "fire everyone" thread. Hahn, Menechino, and TLR should all go. None of that's gonna happen unless KW goes.  KW is not going anywhere unless JR goes.  Mellody Hobson/George Lucas buying controlling interest in the team is now my New Hope (pun intended).  They don't have to become Steve Cohen-like spenders. Just bringing the F.O. up to 2010 level in analytics would make a huge difference.

[Flash]

The White Sox misery circle...'Eloy (or fill in the name) sucks'... 'but its TLRs fault for sticking him in LF'...'but its Hahns fault for hiring the old fossil in the first place'...'but its JRs fault for hiring Hahn'. In the end, there is plenty of blame to go around and not much hope for change unless/until a smart baseball mind starts calling the shots (see Milwaukee, Tampa Bay, St. Louis, not to mention bigger market teams NYY, LAD, and rebuilders like the Nats and Red Sox). The difference is they have highly competent leadership who figure out how to get the job done within the framework of their markets and any limitations imposed by ownership. Here's an unpopular perspective...watch the Cubs for the playbook. My guess is they will develop into the better team for years to come.

[The Grinder]

7 minutes ago, Flash said:

The White Sox misery circle...'Eloy (or fill in the name) sucks'... 'but its TLRs fault for sticking him in LF'...'but its Hahns fault for hiring the old fossil in the first place'...'but its JRs fault for hiring Hahn'. In the end, there is plenty of blame to go around and not much hope for change unless/until a smart baseball mind starts calling the shots (see Milwaukee, Tampa Bay, St. Louis, not to mention bigger market teams NYY, LAD, and rebuilders like the Nats and Red Sox). The difference is they have highly competent leadership who figure out how to get the job done within the framework of their markets and any limitations imposed by ownership. Here's an unpopular perspective...watch the Cubs for the playbook. My guess is they will develop into the better team for years to come.

I hope Im wrong but the cubs organization scares me at time, as bad as they are they seem to outdo us on certain things. I bet cub fans are loving how disheveled this franchise is these days

[GREEDY]

3 hours ago, Dominikk85 said:

 

Sox also tried to install some more modern coaches like this lisle guy a couple years ago but it didn't work, probably because he wasn't able to get through the old school coaches. 

That guy steals memes and quotes and puts them on your mom's facebook feed.  He had less than zero to offer.   Laughable hire.  

That chart is misleading.  It has more to do with how an organization labels their scouts and player development staff.  The Sox are loyal to a fault so most of their front office staff have been there for awhile, prior to new hires getting fancy new-age analyst type titles.

I will say for years at Camelback you could see a drastic difference with between the technology being utilized by the Dodgers and the lack of anything on the Sox' side.  It used to make me so irrationally upset.  As of this year though,  we appear to be pretty well caught up.  My gut feeling is they aren't as light years behind other clubs that the chart makes it seem.  

[reiks12]

4 hours ago, South Side Hit Men said:

Statistically, La Russia’s teams did better when Tony’s veterinarian friend was at the helm. His reign also coincided with Tony working in solid organizations (Oakland and Saint Louis), and before the onset of his cognitive decline.

TWTW, for all intents and purposes, remains the extent of White Sox “strategery”.

Hahn is responsible for the past ten years to develop a plan to install competent qualified people to develop an analytics program and convince Jerry of the benefits. He has failed at this task.

Hahn’s primary claim to fame was exploiting young immigrant labor with “team friendly contracts”, threatening to let them rot in the minor leagues if they didn’t sign, and pawning off what he inherited from Kenny after 2016. He will finish his tenure as the worst GM in club history.

The sooner this happens, the sooner the White Sox can possibly improve to the point they can actually be legitimate contenders. Likely won’t happen until Jerry is gone as well.

This is 100% the truth. 

[Tnetennba]

“Celebrations”…

[Lip Man 1]

46 minutes ago, Tnetennba said:

“Celebrations”…

Read this "interview" myself a short time ago. Not surprised there weren't any 'hard hitting' questions like 'what were the results of the Sox off-season injury study?' 'why do the Sox usually play shorthanded for 3-4 days while figuring out a player's injury and what to do?' 'what does Hahn think of the job TLR has done so far and is the criticism fair?'

Instead we get more non-answers.

No accountability and the media usually doesn't even ask good follow up questions instead taking all answers at face value. Although to his credit Paul Sullivan has been taking critical aim at the Sox issues in his recent columns including today's, he and DVS of the Sun-Times (read his game wrap up stories and look for the phrases he uses and the adjectives he is writing) seem to be the only ones willing to show a little honesty. (Full disclosure: I know DVS and he's a big Sox fan, you can tell he's as frustrated as many fans are)   

Edited August 23, 2022 by Lip Man 1

[oldsox]

I haven't liked Hahn for years, but now I actually understand him.  He's a fucking jerk.

[Lip Man 1]

I mentioned how DVS of the Sun-Times is getting his point across with how he is writing and phrasing things about how bad the Sox have been in an honest manner. Here is the link to his post game story after the loss to the O's. You can see in at least three places where he doesn't mince words:

https://chicago.suntimes.com/white-sox/2022/8/23/23319106/white-sox-out-hit-orioles-11-5-but-lose-for-fifth-time-in-six-games

[hi8is]

#FireEverybody

[maxjusttyped]

 

[Sarava]

5 hours ago, maxjusttyped said:

 

We've gone over this a billion times. It's probably more Jerry's doing. He won't commit to long-term, big dollar contracts. He will spend in the short term though, which both Yaz and Keuchel were.

[caulfield12]

15 minutes ago, Sarava said:

We've gone over this a billion times. It's probably more Jerry's doing. He won't commit to long-term, big dollar contracts. He will spend in the short term though, which both Yaz and Keuchel were.

If 3-4 years for Grandal and Hendriks is really short term.

To me, it’s always three years or less vs. 4-5-6 or more.  Like all those extensions for younger Sox core players…but definitely no $20-30 million yearly FA’s.

Edited August 24, 2022 by caulfield12

[Sarava]

11 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

If 3-4 years for Grandal and Hendriks is really short term.

To me, it’s always three years or less vs. 4-5-6 or more.  Like all those extensions for younger Sox core players…but definitely no $20-30 million yearly FA’s.

They are short-term compared to what Machado, Harper or any other major star will get in free agency.

After the 2022 season, the Sox owe Grandal 18.25 mil, and Keuchel's contract is off the books. This is what it's about for Jerry.

Meanwhile, the Harper and Machado contracts have this left after 2022:

Manny Machado - 6 years left for $180 mil

Bryce Harper - 9 years left for $222 mil

[caulfield12]

https://detroitsportsnation.com/the-athletic-writer-lists-10-candidates-for-detroit-tigers-next-gm/wgbrady/mlb/detroit-tigers-news/08/12/2022/286688/

From The Athletic:

I’m saving a definitive list of candidates until it can be something more than pure speculation. Consider these simply some names that jump to the top of my mind: Brandon Gomes (Dodgers general manager), Alex Slater (Dodgers assistant GM), Dana Brown (Braves VP of scouting), Pete Putila (Astros assistant GM), Matt Arnold (Brewers GM) and Randy Flores (Cardinals assistant GM). The idea of hiring a young executive from a winning and forward-thinking organization seems like the type of move that could benefit the Tigers. Theo Epstein and Jeff Luhnow are the most fun to talk about, but I’m not sure either one is realistic. You can bet more names will surface in the days and weeks ahead.

Edited August 26, 2022 by caulfield12

[caulfield12]

https://theathletic.com/3071499/2022/01/18/this-is-the-best-job-in-baseball-why-the-assistant-gm-role-has-become-so-popular-in-mlb-front-offices/

The fourth paragraph sounds exactly like the reasons recently discussed why Hahn won't quit his job as "assistant" GM with the White Sox so easily.

The fifth might as well be a shot across the bow at Jeremy Haber and largely insular hiring practices.

Edited August 26, 2022 by caulfield12

[caulfield12]

Homegrown talent entering 2022 season...

 

Chicago White Sox #11

40-Man Roster: 15/40

Key MLB Players: SS Tim Anderson, CF Luis Robert, 1B/OF Andrew Vaughn, DH Gavin Sheets, OF Adam Engel, LHP Aaron Bummer

The Rest: LHP Tanner Banks, RHP Jason Bilous, 3B Jake Burger, RHP Matt Foster, LHP Garrett Crochet, IF Romy Gonzalez, RHP Jimmy Lambert, IF/OF Danny Mendick, LHP Bennett Sousa, RHP Jonathan Stiever (60-day IL)

Shortstop Tim Anderson and center fielder Luis Robert are two of the best players on the White Sox roster and in the entire American League when playing up to their full potential.

With Eloy Jimenez sidelined for the foreseeable future with a hamstring injury, Andrew Vaughn will have an opportunity to showcase why he was the No. 3 overall pick in the 2019 draft.

 

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2955651-ranking-all-30-mlb-teams-homegrown-talent-for-the-2022-season

Some quite interesting teams in the 20s and high teens.

 

 

Edited August 26, 2022 by caulfield12

[maloney.adam]

There is no accountability in the organization. whatsoever. Until JR sells the team expect more of the same. 

[Dick Allen]

If the offseason and trade deadline doesn't convince you RH is not a championship GM, nothing will.

[southsider2k5]

1 hour ago, Dick Allen said:

If the offseason and trade deadline doesn't convince you RH is not a championship GM, nothing will.

I said it right before the deadline and will say it again.  This team wasn't worth significantly adding to at the deadline unless we got long term talent, and I am glad we didn't waste resources chasing at rental.  Rick Hahn's best move this year was no acting like this team had a chance to win at the deadline.

[bmags]

On 8/20/2022 at 11:55 AM, GREEDY said:

That guy steals memes and quotes and puts them on your mom's facebook feed.  He had less than zero to offer.   Laughable hire.  

That chart is misleading.  It has more to do with how an organization labels their scouts and player development staff.  The Sox are loyal to a fault so most of their front office staff have been there for awhile, prior to new hires getting fancy new-age analyst type titles.

I will say for years at Camelback you could see a drastic difference with between the technology being utilized by the Dodgers and the lack of anything on the Sox' side.  It used to make me so irrationally upset.  As of this year though,  we appear to be pretty well caught up.  My gut feeling is they aren't as light years behind other clubs that the chart makes it seem.  

This is all correct to me, with big issue being we will always let other clubs set the standards we need to catch up to.

[caulfield12]

32 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

I said it right before the deadline and will say it again.  This team wasn't worth significantly adding to at the deadline unless we got long term talent, and I am glad we didn't waste resources chasing at rental.  Rick Hahn's best move this year was no acting like this team had a chance to win at the deadline.

The Guardians did worse.

They traded Sandy Leon to their rival the  Twins and LHP Alex Young to the scuffling Giants.

Didn't affect or faze their young players at all.

[GREEDY]

25 minutes ago, bmags said:

This is all correct to me, with big issue being we will always let other clubs set the standards we need to catch up to.

30 clubs.  Most run by smart people.  Many with even more financial resources.  It is tough to win.

If the Sox decided to zig when virtually everyone else was zagging... while it certainly wouldn't have been my strategy of choice, I would have accepted that. 

And it isn't like Hahn can come out and tell everyone what they were doing, it wouldn't be in their best interest to advertise they were bucking the trend.

So maybe they tried?  And it didn't work?