Your 2023 Off-Season Plan

[Ozzie for Manager]

My offseason plan was for the Sox to sign 1 marginal SP and a borderline minor leaguer while letting Abreu walk .  I wanted to watch every other decent team shell out expensive contracts on actual good players that will allow them to compete for championships. I was hoping Hahn and JR would make the team worse (as if that was possible) in order to alienate fans like my wife and myself who travel from NC every other year for a couple games. 

Congrats Sox for carrying out my offseason plan perfectly. I no longer have to waste money to come to Chicago and I can stop watching games sooner rather than later in the year because we will be out of contention much earlier.

Go Sox!!!

[pcq]

The ALC needs to be relegated to the Sally League. Their one big budget team wasted their money on junk food. 

[TheFutureIsNear]

An uninspiring Gallo signing is looking more and more likely.

 

The only logical scenario I see is trade for a Dbacks OF’er, but there seems to be a decent market there and that rarely bodes well for us. 

[Jack Parkman]

Just now, pcq said:

The ALC needs to be relegated to the Sally League. Their one big budget team wasted their money on junk food. 

Btw this is funny haha and not funny ridiculous. 

[Chicago White Sox]

I really wonder what the f*** Hahn’s plan is right now.  I know people blame Jerry and rightfully so, but Rick has shown time & time again that he lacks any real creativity and that’s what is needed right now assuming we’re capped out.

This farm is still bottom 10, but it’s made significant progress over the past 12 months.  IMO, Montgomery & Colas need to be off-limits, but there are other pieces in our system that should be able to get you a LH hitting 2B or OF.  Ramos is a legit 50 FV prospect right now IMO with some serious helium and I’m guessing multiple organizations would have him as a top 100 guy.  He can be a centerpiece for the right player.  And we finally have enough interesting secondary pieces to round out a trade.  Vera & Mena are both probably 45+ FV guys right now who have a shot to skyrocket up prospect lists next year if they can prove successful at AA.  And then you have Popeye & Sosa as versatile, near major league ready infield prospects who passed the AA test and have a legit chance at being major league regulars.

Ultimately, my point is there is ammo there to make a trade without having to move Montgomery.  Some team would be excited about a Ramos, Vera/Mena, & Popeye/Sosa package even if it won’t get you Bryan Reynolds.  And if money is the problem, then the market is affording you a chance to move Liam for more prospect currency or a major league ready piece while freeing up payroll space.  There is legit zero excuse for not improving the team.  The levers are there to get better, even if it takes a one step back to take two steps forward type move to enable it.  But unfortunately for us, Hahn lacks the creativity and vision to pull off a complicated series of moves that results in a stronger overall roster next year without completely gutting the farm.  As such, he’ll continue to play the middle and go the easy route instead of trying something bold that could help us win a Championship in 2023.

[SoxBlanco]

6 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

I really wonder what the f*** Hahn’s plan is right now.  I know people blame Jerry and rightfully so, but Rick has shown time & time again that he lacks any real creativity and that’s what is needed right now assuming we’re capped out.

This farm is still bottom 10, but it’s made significant progress over the past 12 months.  IMO, Montgomery & Colas need to be off-limits, but there are other pieces in our system that should be able to get you a LH hitting 2B or OF.  Ramos is a legit 50 FV prospect right now IMO with some serious helium and I’m guessing multiple organizations would have him as a top 100 guy.  He can be a centerpiece for the right player.  And we finally have enough interesting secondary pieces to round out a trade.  Vera & Mena are both probably 45+ FV guys right now who have a shot to skyrocket up prospect lists next year if they can prove successful at AA.  And then you have Popeye & Sosa as versatile, near major league ready infield prospects who passed the AA test and have a legit chance at being major league regulars.

Ultimately, my point is there is ammo there to make a trade without having to move Montgomery.  Some team would be excited about a Ramos, Vera/Mena, & Popeye/Sosa package even if it won’t get you Bryan Reynolds.  And if money is the problem, then the market is affording you a chance to move Liam for more prospect currency or a major league ready piece while freeing up payroll space.  There is legit zero excuse for not improving the team.  The levers are there to get better, even if it takes a one step back to take two steps forward type move to enable it.  But unfortunately for us, Hahn lacks the creativity and vision to pull off a complicated series of moves that results in a stronger overall roster next year without completely gutting the farm.  As such, he’ll continue to play the middle and go the easy route instead of trying something bold that could help us win a Championship in 2023.

I get what you’re saying, but who do you have in mind?  If that hypothetical package you presented doesn’t get you Reynolds, then who might it get? And if sending a package of Ramos/Vera/Sosa gets you somebody worse than Reynolds, then is it really a bold move that could help us win a championship in 2023?

[Tnetennba]

10 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

I really wonder what the f*** Hahn’s plan is right now.  I know people blame Jerry and rightfully so, but Rick has shown time & time again that he lacks any real creativity and that’s what is needed right now assuming we’re capped out.

This farm is still bottom 10, but it’s made significant progress over the past 12 months.  IMO, Montgomery & Colas need to be off-limits, but there are other pieces in our system that should be able to get you a LH hitting 2B or OF.  Ramos is a legit 50 FV prospect right now IMO with some serious helium and I’m guessing multiple organizations would have him as a top 100 guy.  He can be a centerpiece for the right player.  And we finally have enough interesting secondary pieces to round out a trade.  Vera & Mena are both probably 45+ FV guys right now who have a shot to skyrocket up prospect lists next year if they can prove successful at AA.  And then you have Popeye & Sosa as versatile, near major league ready infield prospects who passed the AA test and have a legit chance at being major league regulars.

Ultimately, my point is there is ammo there to make a trade without having to move Montgomery.  Some team would be excited about a Ramos, Vera/Mena, & Popeye/Sosa package even if it won’t get you Bryan Reynolds.  And if money is the problem, then the market is affording you a chance to move Liam for more prospect currency or a major league ready piece while freeing up payroll space.  There is legit zero excuse for not improving the team.  The levers are there to get better, even if it takes a one step back to take two steps forward type move to enable it.  But unfortunately for us, Hahn lacks the creativity and vision to pull off a complicated series of moves that results in a stronger overall roster next year without completely gutting the farm.  As such, he’ll continue to play the middle and go the easy route instead of trying something bold that could help us win a Championship in 2023.

He’s likely waiting out Correa and Swanson signing before stupidly trading off parts of the roster.  It’s really his one play.  He’s waiting anxiously for someone to get desperate to make his own desperation move.  

Edited December 13, 2022 by Tnetennba

[poppysox]

1 hour ago, pmb0928 said:

My offseason plan was for the Sox to sign 1 marginal SP and a borderline minor leaguer while letting Abreu walk .  I wanted to watch every other decent team shell out expensive contracts on actual good players that will allow them to compete for championships. I was hoping Hahn and JR would make the team worse (as if that was possible) in order to alienate fans like my wife and myself who travel from NC every other year for a couple games. 

Congrats Sox for carrying out my offseason plan perfectly. I no longer have to waste money to come to Chicago and I can stop watching games sooner rather than later in the year because we will be out of contention much earlier.

Go Sox!!!

You are having a really great offseason.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

5 hours ago, Jack Parkman said:

 

I'd say it's a bit over 40% of the roster but point taken by the hyperbole.

[Chicago White Sox]

7 minutes ago, SoxBlanco said:

I get what you’re saying, but who do you have in mind?  If that hypothetical package you presented doesn’t get you Reynolds, then who might it get? And if sending a package of Ramos/Vera/Sosa gets you somebody worse than Reynolds, then is it really a bold move that could help us win a championship in 2023?

What if that package could get you Brandon Lowe?

[Chisoxfn]

33 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

I really wonder what the f*** Hahn’s plan is right now.  I know people blame Jerry and rightfully so, but Rick has shown time & time again that he lacks any real creativity and that’s what is needed right now assuming we’re capped out.

This farm is still bottom 10, but it’s made significant progress over the past 12 months.  IMO, Montgomery & Colas need to be off-limits, but there are other pieces in our system that should be able to get you a LH hitting 2B or OF.  Ramos is a legit 50 FV prospect right now IMO with some serious helium and I’m guessing multiple organizations would have him as a top 100 guy.  He can be a centerpiece for the right player.  And we finally have enough interesting secondary pieces to round out a trade.  Vera & Mena are both probably 45+ FV guys right now who have a shot to skyrocket up prospect lists next year if they can prove successful at AA.  And then you have Popeye & Sosa as versatile, near major league ready infield prospects who passed the AA test and have a legit chance at being major league regulars.

Ultimately, my point is there is ammo there to make a trade without having to move Montgomery.  Some team would be excited about a Ramos, Vera/Mena, & Popeye/Sosa package even if it won’t get you Bryan Reynolds.  And if money is the problem, then the market is affording you a chance to move Liam for more prospect currency or a major league ready piece while freeing up payroll space.  There is legit zero excuse for not improving the team.  The levers are there to get better, even if it takes a one step back to take two steps forward type move to enable it.  But unfortunately for us, Hahn lacks the creativity and vision to pull off a complicated series of moves that results in a stronger overall roster next year without completely gutting the farm.  As such, he’ll continue to play the middle and go the easy route instead of trying something bold that could help us win a Championship in 2023.

Jerry has given the payroll the past couple years. I could argue whether they could spend more - but end of the day, outside of the TLR stuff (which is obviously on JR) - Hahn gets zero pass. He has zero excuse unless someone pulled the rug out of him and he was planning some completely different budget (and we know that isn't true).  

This front office is a mess.  

[maxjusttyped]

10 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

What if that package could get you Brandon Lowe?

The Rays are too smart for that unless Lowe's medicals are a disaster.

[Tony]

To answer the OP's question:

Not this

[Chicago White Sox]

7 minutes ago, maxjusttyped said:

The Rays are too smart for that unless Lowe's medicals are a disaster.

Perhaps they are worried about his back and/or his ability to be passable at 2B moving forward with the shift changes.  Or maybe they view this as a way to get a potential plus 3B, a #3 caliber starter, and a solid regular 2B for a guy whose value has peaked.  Perhaps I’m totally wrong here and this doesn’t move the needle for the Rays, but my point is Hahn has some chips to work with.  And if the teams that can solve his needs aren’t interested in his prospects or players, then he needs to think outside of the box on how to get this done.  Can’t keep going into every season with the same couple holes in the OF & 2B.

[southsider2k5]

On 9/23/2022 at 2:40 PM, southsider2k5 said:

My plan?  Sit around, do nothing, wait for baseball and complain about everything the entire winter.  Probably drink some beer while I am at it.

✓ 

[SoxBlanco]

1 hour ago, Chicago White Sox said:

What if that package could get you Brandon Lowe?

I would definitely think about pulling the trigger on that, but then what would we do in the outfield? We’d still need to sign somebody. And since we need to sign an OF anyway, it might be better to just keep the prospects, sign someone like Conforto, and let the youngsters battle for the 2B job. 

The success of the 2023 will come down to the health and bounce back ability of several guys. Even if we acquired Lowe, we’d still need our core to bounce back, so I don’t see someone like Lowe (I realize he was just one example that came to mind for you) being a bold move that pushes us over the top. 

In my opinion, the only kind of move that would have a really significant impact is something that will cost money that JR is unwilling to spend. And since we all know that’s not changing, I really don’t see much that Hahn can do at this point. That’s not to say he doesn’t deserve blame, because some of his bad contracts put us in this position, but I’m just talking about what he can do from this point forward. 

[hi8is]

Are we there yet?

[Chicago White Sox]

6 minutes ago, SoxBlanco said:

I would definitely think about pulling the trigger on that, but then what would we do in the outfield? We’d still need to sign somebody. And since we need to sign an OF anyway, it might be better to just keep the prospects, sign someone like Conforto, and let the youngsters battle for the 2B job. 

The success of the 2023 will come down to the health and bounce back ability of several guys. Even if we acquired Lowe, we’d still need our core to bounce back, so I don’t see someone like Lowe (I realize he was just one example that came to mind for you) being a bold move that pushes us over the top. 

In my opinion, the only kind of move that would have a really significant impact is something that will cost money that JR is unwilling to spend. And since we all know that’s not changing, I really don’t see much that Hahn can do at this point. That’s not to say he doesn’t deserve blame, because some of his bad contracts put us in this position, but I’m just talking about what he can do from this point forward. 

I’d pair a theoretical Lowe trade with an OF signing (Conforto ideally) and fund it financially by moving Hendriks for prospects (let’s say Pepiot+).  Despite the downgrade at closer, I’d prefer that option vs. going with someone like Peralta in the OF, Sosa/Romy at 2B, and Martin as our only SP depth.

I just don’t think you roll back the same crew and think you’re a serious World Series contender next year.  We have to fill the same couple of holes that have plagued us for multiple seasons, especially with Jose gone and Grandal likely not the same guy we saw in 2021.

[SoxBlanco]

3 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

I’d pair a theoretical Lowe trade with an OF signing (Conforto ideally) and fund it financially by moving Hendriks for prospects (let’s say Pepiot+).  Despite the downgrade at closer, I’d prefer that option vs. going with someone like Peralta in the OF, Sosa/Romy at 2B, and Martin as our only SP depth.

I just don’t think you roll back the same crew and think you’re a serious World Series contender next year.  We have to fill the same couple of holes that have plagued us for multiple seasons, especially with Jose gone and Grandal likely not the same guy we saw in 2021.

I would definitely get behind that plan. And I don’t disagree with your second paragraph. I think I’ve just entered the depression stage after seeing all of these huge contracts. I just keep thinking, “Wow, there’s really not much we can do, and all we can do is hope for a miracle where everything goes right in 2023.”

Hell, maybe we are due after everything that went wrong in 2022.  

[Sleepy Harold]

I'm leery of Lowe mainly because I don't trust back injuries. 

[maxjusttyped]

Lowe is such an awesome player and his contract is so ridiculously team friendly that the only way he gets traded is if either there's real concern with his back or someone offers a godfather offer with multiple top 50 prospects etc. The Sox don't have close to enough to land him if he's available and other teams aren't scared off by his medicals.

[Jack Parkman]

3 hours ago, Chisoxfn said:

Jerry has given the payroll the past couple years. I could argue whether they could spend more - but end of the day, outside of the TLR stuff (which is obviously on JR) - Hahn gets zero pass. He has zero excuse unless someone pulled the rug out of him and he was planning some completely different budget (and we know that isn't true).  

This front office is a mess.  

Jerry sucks. 

Hahn sucks. 

They are not mutually exclusive. 

[Snopek]

10 hours ago, hi8is said:

Are we there yet?

We are not there yet. We are not actually in the car yet. In fact, we don’t even have a car yet because Hahn is waiting for the right deal on a 94 Mercury Sable to present itself.

[Tnetennba]

55 minutes ago, Snopek said:

We are not there yet. We are not actually in the car yet. In fact, we don’t even have a car yet because Hahn is waiting for the right deal on a 94 Mercury Sable to present itself.

While hoping to barter for said Mercury Sable.

[southsider2k5]