Chicago White Sox Posted February 5, 2023 Share Posted February 5, 2023 22 minutes ago, Balta1701 said: The only way he isn’t the GM is if Kenny retires and he takes Kenny’s job. I could see a switch to Chris Getz if the team performs poorly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted February 5, 2023 Share Posted February 5, 2023 44 minutes ago, fathom said: I agree with CWS, I think he’s gone if this season goes poorly I’m pretty sure you told me this 7 seasons ago. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxjusttyped Posted February 5, 2023 Share Posted February 5, 2023 30 minutes ago, Balta1701 said: I’m pretty sure you told me this 7 seasons ago. Kenny and Rick both have their jobs for life. *Maybe* if this season is a disaster they find a way to shift Getz into more of a public facing role, but nothing will fundamentally change until there's new ownership. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxjusttyped Posted February 5, 2023 Share Posted February 5, 2023 1 hour ago, Chicago White Sox said: I could see a switch to Chris Getz if the team performs poorly. Maybe publicly like what happened with Kenny. But Hahn isn't going anywhere unless he wants to actually do so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCsoxfan Posted February 5, 2023 Share Posted February 5, 2023 7 hours ago, maxjusttyped said: Kenny and Rick both have their jobs for life. *Maybe* if this season is a disaster they find a way to shift Getz into more of a public facing role, but nothing will fundamentally change until there's new ownership. Exactly, this isn’t a merit/performance driven organization. It’s a cockeyed family run business that pretends to be sophisticated. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2Jimmy0 Posted February 5, 2023 Share Posted February 5, 2023 12 hours ago, Dick Allen said: Based on their moves, the White Sox front office, whether they would ever say so or not, are blaming all the shortcomings on LaRussa. They really have done very little to upgrade a tea mired in mediocrity. A lot of it was related to Tony La Russa and injuries. I don’t think it’s a mediocre baseball team depending on health but we’ll see. They clearly didn’t do enough but it’s tough to upgrade the team without using money in their situation. 10 hours ago, Tnetennba said: Didn’t the Sox take less in return because NYY ate all of the money? That’s how I seem to remember it. That trade was horrible. I’d always heard that they needed the savings to pay the Luis Robert bonus. Mom and pop shop organization. 10 hours ago, Chicago White Sox said: And IMO, Hahn should be relieved of his duties if the team doesn’t make the playoffs. La Russa is long gone and Rick is the guy entering the season with a $180M payroll relying on multiple rookies and with little depth. Tony’s impact may have been massive, but that doesn’t excuse Hahn from not improving the roster. How would you have suggested that he improve the roster? Spending $16 million on Benintendi and Clevinger is a decent use of resources in my opinion. 8 hours ago, Chicago White Sox said: I could see a switch to Chris Getz if the team performs poorly. If there’s a “change”, this is likely it and that wouldn’t constitute a change at all. It’s why I always laugh at the suggestion of just firing Rick Hahn. They don’t need to fire Rick Hahn. They need to completely clean house. As long as Ken Williams is employed, you aren’t a great GM to come work under him. And Jerry doesn’t want someone else at the top of the org because it would require somehow finding qualified replacements and then listening to them tell him how shitty is organization is run. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted February 5, 2023 Share Posted February 5, 2023 5 minutes ago, Y2Jimmy0 said: How would you have suggested that he improve the roster? Spending $16 million on Benintendi and Clevinger is a decent use of resources in my opinion. If there’s a “change”, this is likely it and that wouldn’t constitute a change at all. It’s why I always laugh at the suggestion of just firing Rick Hahn. They don’t need to fire Rick Hahn. They need to completely clean house. As long as Ken Williams is employed, you aren’t a great GM to come work under him. And Jerry doesn’t want someone else at the top of the org because it would require somehow finding qualified replacements and then listening to them tell him how shitty is organization is run. Regarding the first point, he could trade from the farm to improve the major league roster and/or add depth. I get this is still a bottom five farm system, but it still has plenty of talent to tap into if winning next year is truly a priority. IMO, there is zero excuse going into the season with our OF depth. A single injury or Colas struggled and we are pretty much fucked. And I get the point on payroll constraints, but let’s pretend a lot of financial wounds aren’t self inflicted by Rick himself. $180M should be enough to build a more complete roster with far less question marks. As for changing from Rick to Getz, I can’t really say how impactful the change would be and it’s not the move I would make at GM to solve our problems. But I do think it’s possible that Getz represents an improvement. To me, Rick is a very poor talent evaluator and hasn’t installed the analytic resources into the org to make up for that shortcoming. A lot of the latter may be an ownership driven problem, but it’s becoming very clear that Hahn is incapable of being a successful GM in a Jerry led organization. At some point, you give the guy who is highly intelligent and a former baseball player a chance. Maybe it’s all the same outcome due to KW, but Rick can’t keep blaming his shortcomings on Jerry forever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2Jimmy0 Posted February 5, 2023 Share Posted February 5, 2023 3 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said: Regarding the first point, he could trade from the farm to improve the major league roster and/or add depth. I get this is still a bottom five farm system, but it still has plenty of talent to tap into if winning next year is truly a priority. IMO, there is zero excuse going into the season with our OF depth. A single injury or Colas struggled and we are pretty much fucked. And I get the point on payroll constraints, but let’s pretend a lot of financial wounds aren’t self inflicted by Rick himself. $180M should be enough to build a more complete roster with far less question marks. As for changing from Rick to Getz, I can’t really say how impactful the change would be and it’s not the move I would make at GM to solve our problems. But I do think it’s possible that Getz represents an improvement. To me, Rick is a very poor talent evaluator and hasn’t installed the analytic resources into the org to make up for that shortcoming. A lot of the latter may be an ownership driven problem, but it’s becoming very clear that Hahn is incapable of being a successful GM in a Jerry led organization. At some point, you give the guy who is highly intelligent and a former baseball player a chance. Maybe it’s all the same outcome due to KW, but Rick can’t keep blaming his shortcomings on Jerry forever. I just think they don’t want to trade the prospects that people want. The system isn’t in great shape and we all know who the top 11 guys are. The payroll issue is on the front office for sure but there were so many moves influenced by La Russa. Ownership needed to spend like $225 million this year to throw money at the problem. It’s the only thing that made sense but Jerry Reinsdorf doesn’t give a s%*# about that. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted February 5, 2023 Share Posted February 5, 2023 1 hour ago, Y2Jimmy0 said: A lot of it was related to Tony La Russa and injuries. I don’t think it’s a mediocre baseball team depending on health but we’ll see. They clearly didn’t do enough but it’s tough to upgrade the team without using money in their situation. That trade was horrible. I’d always heard that they needed the savings to pay the Luis Robert bonus. Mom and pop shop organization. How would you have suggested that he improve the roster? Spending $16 million on Benintendi and Clevinger is a decent use of resources in my opinion. If there’s a “change”, this is likely it and that wouldn’t constitute a change at all. It’s why I always laugh at the suggestion of just firing Rick Hahn. They don’t need to fire Rick Hahn. They need to completely clean house. As long as Ken Williams is employed, you aren’t a great GM to come work under him. And Jerry doesn’t want someone else at the top of the org because it would require somehow finding qualified replacements and then listening to them tell him how shitty is organization is run. There are lots of ways to improve the roster. One would have been actually spending the international bonus pool money and maybe hitting on a lesser known. When you’re in a rebuild, it may be throwing money away but less than giving Manny Machado’s friends 8 figures combined. And he was letting everyone know how trades were going to happen and he’s being hearing interesting ideas, blah, blah, blah…who knew Franklin German would be his only trade. The whole thing was a bill of goods. Teams with sustained winning always get more expensive and usually quite quickly. Winning means playing well. Playing well means getting paid. If they aren’t willing to cover their recent mistakes with a little more payout, they were never serious about sustained winning and multiple LOL championships. As to KW, I think he has only a year or two left . His wife retired from NBC 5 last year, and he has said he’s on his last contract. So hopefully his leaving will spur some real change because the verdict is in, they don’t have the right people building the team under JRs restrictions. I do think Hahn could possibly build a sustained contender if Steve Cohen was his owner. A few others are far more successful under these conditions. It might not be win a WS, but have fun team that wins most of the time with multiple playoff appearances will do. It’s not like White Sox fans are conditioned for World Series win or bust. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCCWS Posted February 5, 2023 Share Posted February 5, 2023 54 minutes ago, Y2Jimmy0 said: I just think they don’t want to trade the prospects that people want. The system isn’t in great shape and we all know who the top 11 guys are. The payroll issue is on the front office for sure but there were so many moves influenced by La Russa. Ownership needed to spend like $225 million this year to throw money at the problem. It’s the only thing that made sense but Jerry Reinsdorf doesn’t give a s%*# about that. I would add the starters as well. If you can't/won't move the prospects, then the next move is to try and trade a starter or two to improve the overall roster. Maybe last fall, 1 or 2 of Moncada, Anderson, Vaughn, Eloy, Robert or Hendricks could have been moved to try and improve the overall roster without affecting the SP. Now, Abreu is gone, so Vaughn probably has to stay and Hendricks has health issues so he can't be moved as well. Maybe that is too much work on the Front Office to try and trade Anderson, Robert or Eloy and try and create a better overall roster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted February 5, 2023 Share Posted February 5, 2023 (edited) 16 minutes ago, SCCWS said: I would add the starters as well. If you can't/won't move the prospects, then the next move is to try and trade a starter or two to improve the overall roster. Maybe last fall, 1 or 2 of Moncada, Anderson, Vaughn, Eloy, Robert or Hendricks could have been moved to try and improve the overall roster without affecting the SP. Now, Abreu is gone, so Vaughn probably has to stay and Hendricks has health issues so he can't be moved as well. Maybe that is too much work on the Front Office to try and trade Anderson, Robert or Eloy and try and create a better overall roster. Chances are any trade they might have made wouldn’t have worked out anyway. The problem with the White Sox front office is they blame anything and everything other than themselves for their failures. It may be fluke injuries that happen to every team. It may be fans who don’t pay to watch a shitty product. To Rick, Kenny, and Jerry, it’s always on someone or something else other than them, so they will continue to do things wrong. Maybe every 40 or so years, the stars align and everything goes their way, and they can say We told you so. But that’s what we are stuck with. Its why LaRussa was so beloved by JR. He was never wrong. After The second guy he put on with a 1-2 count last year, the Sox got out of the inning. Tony pointed out that proved he was right. That’s like being out totally chewed and not wanting to spend the money on an Uber, so you drive home. You make it without killing anyone or getting pulled over so of course you made the right decision. It’s nuts. Thinking these guys were going to change their stripes was nuts. JR prints money with the Bulls. He had , at least at the time, the worst 5 year record in NBA history after Jordan left. Yet they continued to sell our. His gift to the fans was to never go into luxury tax territory which will eliminate any chance of the Bulls ever going on a run where they could win for multiple years. If he’s that way when he’s printing money, think how it is for the White Sox. Edited February 5, 2023 by Dick Allen 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted February 6, 2023 Share Posted February 6, 2023 Quote “Expect to see lots of Joey Gallo at first base, especially if Alex Kirilloff struggles to get back on track following season-ending wrist surgeries in 2021 and 2022. Gallo is a two-time Gold Glove-winning corner outfielder, and that’s where the Twins would prefer to deploy him, but he also played some first base early in his career with the Rangers and is considered very good there as well.” https://www.nj.com/yankees/2023/02/ex-yankees-bust-joey-gallo-will-have-surprise-role-with-twins.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tnetennba Posted February 6, 2023 Share Posted February 6, 2023 22 minutes ago, Balta1701 said: https://www.nj.com/yankees/2023/02/ex-yankees-bust-joey-gallo-will-have-surprise-role-with-twins.html Seems like a waste of his defensive capabilities but if it weakens them at 1b then all the better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigHurt3515 Posted February 6, 2023 Share Posted February 6, 2023 13 hours ago, Chicago White Sox said: Regarding the first point, he could trade from the farm to improve the major league roster and/or add depth. I get this is still a bottom five farm system, but it still has plenty of talent to tap into if winning next year is truly a priority. IMO, there is zero excuse going into the season with our OF depth. A single injury or Colas struggled and we are pretty much fucked. And I get the point on payroll constraints, but let’s pretend a lot of financial wounds aren’t self inflicted by Rick himself. $180M should be enough to build a more complete roster with far less question marks. As for changing from Rick to Getz, I can’t really say how impactful the change would be and it’s not the move I would make at GM to solve our problems. But I do think it’s possible that Getz represents an improvement. To me, Rick is a very poor talent evaluator and hasn’t installed the analytic resources into the org to make up for that shortcoming. A lot of the latter may be an ownership driven problem, but it’s becoming very clear that Hahn is incapable of being a successful GM in a Jerry led organization. At some point, you give the guy who is highly intelligent and a former baseball player a chance. Maybe it’s all the same outcome due to KW, but Rick can’t keep blaming his shortcomings on Jerry forever. How can you possibly forget about Leury and Sheets as our OF depth? Oh and throwing one of our INF prospects in the OF to fix the issue. So tired of this organization. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted February 6, 2023 Share Posted February 6, 2023 On 2/4/2023 at 5:02 PM, Dick Allen said: JR loved it. He saved a ton of money. Or JR told HAhn and company it wasn’t on LaRussa and he is going to prove it when the team still stinks after this year and than he will let KW retire and fire RH. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted February 6, 2023 Share Posted February 6, 2023 23 hours ago, Balta1701 said: The only way he isn’t the GM is if Kenny retires and he takes Kenny’s job. I think if they stink we will see a change in front office. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soulfly Posted February 6, 2023 Share Posted February 6, 2023 53 minutes ago, Chisoxfn said: I think if they stink we will see a change in front office. At least six years too late. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted February 6, 2023 Share Posted February 6, 2023 1 hour ago, Chisoxfn said: I think if they stink we will see a change in front office. The excuses are already lined up. “No one could have seen what happened to our closer coming” is actually true! You can’t hold this season against this front office. Time for extensions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted February 6, 2023 Share Posted February 6, 2023 54 minutes ago, Balta1701 said: The excuses are already lined up. “No one could have seen what happened to our closer coming” is actually true! You can’t hold this season against this front office. Time for extensions. Even then...a closer in their 30s with that much recent usage with that type of high risk profile contract wasn't perhaps the greatest idea in the world. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harold's Leg Lift Posted February 6, 2023 Share Posted February 6, 2023 23 hours ago, Y2Jimmy0 said: If there’s a “change”, this is likely it and that wouldn’t constitute a change at all. It’s why I always laugh at the suggestion of just firing Rick Hahn. They don’t need to fire Rick Hahn. They need to completely clean house. As long as Ken Williams is employed, you aren’t a great GM to come work under him. And Jerry doesn’t want someone else at the top of the org because it would require somehow finding qualified replacements and then listening to them tell him how shitty is organization is run. It's like how I always laugh at the suggestion that Kenny Williams is sitting in a dark room twisting his mustache plotting ways to prevent Rick Hahn from making all these great moves. Kenny checked out years ago. It's been the Rick and Jeremy show for a long time which is why this organization is such a disaster. I do agree that nothing will change until Reinsdorf sells which is why I want them to go 0-162 this year . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted February 6, 2023 Share Posted February 6, 2023 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirmin' for Yermin Posted February 6, 2023 Share Posted February 6, 2023 Roberto Perez signed a minor league deal.. That would've made too much sense Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lip Man 1 Posted February 6, 2023 Share Posted February 6, 2023 3 hours ago, Harold's Leg Lift said: It's like how I always laugh at the suggestion that Kenny Williams is sitting in a dark room twisting his mustache plotting ways to prevent Rick Hahn from making all these great moves. Kenny checked out years ago. It's been the Rick and Jeremy show for a long time which is why this organization is such a disaster. I do agree that nothing will change until Reinsdorf sells which is why I want them to go 0-162 this year . Even if that were to happen JR wouldn't sell because of the financial tax hit. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2Jimmy0 Posted February 7, 2023 Share Posted February 7, 2023 8 hours ago, Squirmin' for Yermin said: Roberto Perez signed a minor league deal.. That would've made too much sense Would you be fine losing Zavala for nothing to accommodate? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeC Posted February 7, 2023 Share Posted February 7, 2023 9 hours ago, Balta1701 said: Too painfully accurate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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