The State of the Sox...

[Lip Man 1]

For the last several weeks I've been working on a story trying to find out what is going on with this organization in an extremely crucial off season. It may be the last chance they have to get the rebuild/contention window right.

The Sox of course are being very tight lipped as per usual, Sox Fest has been cancelled, no chance for anyone to ask the brass any questions... so I went to a half dozen sources who know the organization to try to get a handle on what may be happening. 

If you read the story I describe those sources in general terms but not specifically because I wanted honest answers.

I believe what they've told me on a number of issues. 

I've been a Sox Fan for 62 seasons NO ONE wants this rebuild/contention window to succeed more than I do, but I've got to tell you, based of what I've been told, I think the chances are very slim. This organization simply is "mired in mediocrity" for wont of a better word and in my opinion until new ownership and a new front office is brought in I suspect it will be more of "one step forward, two steps back..."

But we'll see.

Here is the link to the story: 

https://www.wsiforumstoo.com/74118-the-state-of-the-sox

Edited November 2, 2022 by Lip Man 1

[Buehrle>Wood]

I've been really impressed with the manager hiring process and saying the right things in terms of control for Grifol, as well as getting his guys in there. On the surface it seems like a complete 180 from what we know about this franchise but these last couple weeks have been such a small blip on the radar of years of terrible moves so no real trust has been gained anyways.

[Buehrle>Wood]

And lol what the hell happened to white sox interactive

Edited November 2, 2022 by Buehrle>Wood

[Lip Man 1]

47 minutes ago, Buehrle>Wood said:

I've been really impressed with the manager hiring process and saying the right things in terms of control for Grifol, as well as getting his guys in there. On the surface it seems like a complete 180 from what we know about this franchise but these last couple weeks have been such a small blip on the radar of years of terrible moves so no real trust has been gained anyways.

The fact that it seems he's going to be allowed to bring in his own coaches is certainly a step in the right direction, no question about that.

[CWSpalehoseCWS]

Well, that's depressing. We need to plan a party and dance in the streets once JR becomes worm food. 

[South Side Fireworks Man]

Great article. Thanks Lip!

“The problem is some of these guys just don’t care, they want to win sure but they already have gotten their money with these contracts before they proved anything. Moncada would strike out and just walk back to the dugout like no big deal, he fouls a ball off and now he can’t play for three days? His contract makes him untradable but he needs to go.”
 

Is there hope?
“It could happen, maybe there’s a 5% chance this front office could get it right. But first the front office has to admit they made mistakes. The catcher (Yamani Grandal), third baseman (Moncada) and shortstop (Tim Anderson) need to go. They need to get guys with a higher baseball acumen, the lack of urgency, the way they beat themselves this season was embarrassing. Anderson needs to go because the organization gave him the keys to the car and he drove it off the cliff. And he’s getting up in years (Author’s Note: Anderson will turn 30 this season), get something for him while you can, some talented young players. The organization also needs a major off season from the scouts, they have to find guys they can buy low on with a good upside and hope they produce.”
 

That's what I've been saying for a while.

[CWSpalehoseCWS]

22 minutes ago, South Side Fireworks Man said:

Great article. Thanks Lip!

“The problem is some of these guys just don’t care, they want to win sure but they already have gotten their money with these contracts before they proved anything. Moncada would strike out and just walk back to the dugout like no big deal, he fouls a ball off and now he can’t play for three days? His contract makes him untradable but he needs to go.”
 

Is there hope?
“It could happen, maybe there’s a 5% chance this front office could get it right. But first the front office has to admit they made mistakes. The catcher (Yamani Grandal), third baseman (Moncada) and shortstop (Tim Anderson) need to go. They need to get guys with a higher baseball acumen, the lack of urgency, the way they beat themselves this season was embarrassing. Anderson needs to go because the organization gave him the keys to the car and he drove it off the cliff. And he’s getting up in years (Author’s Note: Anderson will turn 30 this season), get something for him while you can, some talented young players. The organization also needs a major off season from the scouts, they have to find guys they can buy low on with a good upside and hope they produce.”
 

That's what I've been saying for a while.

Interesting re: Anderson. I guess I never really looked at the possibility of him being moved. I wonder if they would actually have the balls to move him AND cut ties with Abreu in the same offseason.

[Pants Rowland]

Thanks for sharing. Great tidbits and not much of a surprise on most levels. I am curious if you can elaborate on why Anderson is deemed such a problem. He's clearly still got defensive issues but the statement about driving the car off a cliff is pretty damning. Thanks again for all this insight. 

[hi8is]

17 minutes ago, Pants Rowland said:

the statement about driving the car off a cliff is pretty damning

It’s pretty easy to see Tim’s off field s%*# effected him a lot.

[PitchatRisktoZisk]

Interesting insights, thank you! Now I think I'll go drive MY car off a cliff! Seriously, I can't say many of the quotes surprise me. That said, having spent time in both public and private companies, many of those quotes could have come from any of those places as well. Hopefully hiring Grifol and (supposedly) letting him hire his coaches is a step in the right direction. 

[hi8is]

Should have titled it the last tag of the article ?

[greg775]

The Sox are a mess. The last game of the season says it all. 10-0 loss right? To Minnie?

Sox appear to be a team that doesn't care when it plays a Central Division team. The team generally plays well against teams in other divisions. They can't be bothered to excel against their division neighbors.

The manager hire is a big yawn which is fine. It's the same as most teams managers. Renteria should still be manager. At least the teams were exciting. Sad state of affairs. Sox sadly are going nowhere. Not sure what it will take to get the team to wake up.

[SonofaRoache]

We don't have spending money, we don't have a good farm system, and we don't have a truly competitive team.... good luck. 

[Kyyle23]

7 hours ago, greg775 said:

The Sox are a mess. The last game of the season says it all. 10-0 loss right? To Minnie?

Sox appear to be a team that doesn't care when it plays a Central Division team. The team generally plays well against teams in other divisions. They can't be bothered to excel against their division neighbors.

The manager hire is a big yawn which is fine. It's the same as most teams managers. Renteria should still be manager. At least the teams were exciting. Sad state of affairs. Sox sadly are going nowhere. Not sure what it will take to get the team to wake up.

Did you really believe that Dan Johnson was on the team for next year 

[Highland]

Very interesting piece. Shows that things are as bad as we imagined. I do think major changes have to come this off season. If they can get something valuable, they should trade Anderson. They can't be afraid of making changes or bold moves. Just hoping players will come back healthy and perform won't work. The only thing I disagree with is that one person was acting as if things just went south the last two years. This team has done very little since 2008. At least they made an effort in recruiitng  a managter. Now they need to do much more.

[CentralChamps21]

Illinois (though it was almost Florida at one time)

[ShoeLessRob]

SOS

[SoxFanForever]

Great, if not depressing article on the state of the Sox.  A change in ownership and leadership can't come soon enough.

[whitesoxwinner]

What an article. #ThankYouLipMan

[Pants Rowland]

12 hours ago, hi8is said:

It’s pretty easy to see Tim’s off field s%*# effected him a lot.

Was there more beyond the multiple "allegations" of infidelity? Just seems that stuff is not uncommon for young star athletes so I am curious if only that would have such an impact on Tim and the entire team. 

[The Mighty Mite]

I was called out back in June on 2 different sites for saying we had dumb and lazy players and lo and behold those issues were addressed in the article. I've been a baseball and Sox fan since 1952 and I'm  pretty sure I can figure out what my eyes tell me and nothing in that article surprises me. The front office is going to have a tough off season with figuring out how to move some of these guys hopefully starting with Moncada. It wouldn't surprise me that the Sox were turned down by many people that the Sox wanted as manager, who would want to step into this mess.

 

[Highland]

8 minutes ago, Pants Rowland said:

Was there more beyond the multiple "allegations" of infidelity? Just seems that stuff is not uncommon for young star athletes so I am curious if only that would have such an impact on Tim and the entire team. 

I don't know anything about Anderson's personal life, but he just didn't look like the same guy. His average was okay, but he wasn't providing the spark he did in other years. A malaise seemed to surround this team. New manager has a real challenge in front of him. 

[Balta1701]

43 minutes ago, Highland said:

I don't know anything about Anderson's personal life, but he just didn't look like the same guy. His average was okay, but he wasn't providing the spark he did in other years. A malaise seemed to surround this team. New manager has a real challenge in front of him. 

I don't know what it was, but it also wasn't just Anderson. I still go back to the first 8 game losing streak the Sox had this year, game 2 was against the Guardians, Keuchel was on the mound, and the entire infield forgot how to catch the ball. Anderson was the worst of these, he had 3 errors in the first couple innings and then followed that up with 3 more errors the next 2 days...but it wasn't just Anderson. Abreu had one error that was credited and another that was put on the board and taken away. I believe Moncada may have had another bonehead play that day, and then 2 days later we started getting the "Leury Garcia is hitting 3rd, 2nd, and first" bullcrap. 

Anderson was a key part of that messy losing streak, but he was not the only part of it. There was clearly something going on involving Anderson, but it wasn't just Anderson, there were things hitting several people at once and LaRussa doing his maddening "Leury is awesome" stuff. They never really got going again and spent half the year fighting to recover from that losing streak. 

[Lip Man 1]

1 hour ago, Highland said:

I don't know anything about Anderson's personal life, but he just didn't look like the same guy. His average was okay, but he wasn't providing the spark he did in other years. A malaise seemed to surround this team. New manager has a real challenge in front of him. 

 

1 hour ago, Pants Rowland said:

Was there more beyond the multiple "allegations" of infidelity? Just seems that stuff is not uncommon for young star athletes so I am curious if only that would have such an impact on Tim and the entire team. 

I think and this is just my opinion, that part of the thinking behind the comment of "drove it off the cliff" were the suspensions, flipping off the fans in Cleveland, the confrontations with umpires and in general the arrogant comments especially in spring training.

[Lip Man 1]

Just heard from a source who spoke with a player agent who read the story. According to this person the agent told them the story was "fascinating and pretty much the truth." (direct quote) 

This source also relayed to me they have heard last night that more folks are about to leave the Sox from the business side of the organization.