2nd Base I guess it’s going to be Sosa or Gonzalez?

[TheFutureIsNear]

10 minutes ago, AJ'S Cousin said:

I believe the solution is still Elvis. A 2 year deal is appropriate for about 10 to 12 million. We lost out on all the other legitimate 2nd basemen. No trades on the horizon, no idiotic ideas please like Garcia playing 80 games at second, converting Burger to 2nd Base. Elvis is the answer for now if he’s willing to play second. If he insists on playing SS then no, don’t sign him. Sosa and Gonzalez are a risk but we may have no choice. 

2 years 12 mil for Andrus is an awful deal no matter where he plays. He had a hot month or so but his larger sample size going back to 2018 is right on par with Leury. No idea why people are so terrified that we can’t get .240 BA with a .700 OPS production out of Romy/Sosa. Continuously blocking young players with mediocre (at best) production isn’t the direction this team should be going. 

[ChiSox59]

1 hour ago, Jack Parkman said:

no

La Stella makes a ton of sense as an milb flier.  The awful defense scares me, but what's the harm in bringing him in for the league min if he makes the roster?  

I certainly wouldn't guarantee him a roster spot, however. 

[CBJ03]

27 minutes ago, AJ'S Cousin said:

I believe the solution is still Elvis. A 2 year deal is appropriate for about 10 to 12 million. We lost out on all the other legitimate 2nd basemen. No trades on the horizon, no idiotic ideas please like Garcia playing 80 games at second, converting Burger to 2nd Base. Elvis is the answer for now if he’s willing to play second. If he insists on playing SS then no, don’t sign him. Sosa and Gonzalez are a risk but we may have no choice. 

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

5 minutes ago, AJ'S Cousin said:

I believe the solution is still Elvis. A 2 year deal is appropriate for about 10 to 12 million. We lost out on all the other legitimate 2nd basemen. No trades on the horizon, no idiotic ideas please like Garcia playing 80 games at second, converting Burger to 2nd Base. Elvis is the answer for now if he’s willing to play second. If he insists on playing SS then no, don’t sign him. Sosa and Gonzalez are a risk but we may have no choice. 

Pretty unlikely anyone signs him for 2 years at his age and offense prior to 2022. No one will think he can get 3.5 War again but a solid 2.0 WAR could still be in the cards for him with regular playing time .Plus if he plays 2nd base it's likely he won't be getting the same defensive high marks he did at SS.

Anyway here's an article on Fangraphs from 9/20/2022 that searches for answers about why Andrus did so well with the White Sox. Hint: Doesn't look like he found any real answers. Most Sox fans who enjoyed watching Andrus last year will enjoy this article. https://blogs.fangraphs.com/elvis-lives/

[Bob Sacamano]

If/when Elvis wants or has to settle for a backup IF job, I'd be interested. I don't really want to sign him to start though.

Edited January 6, 2023 by Bob Sacamano

[Jack Parkman]

What would you guys think of Santiago Espinal? 

To me he seems like a younger Harrison. 

Idk how much that's worth on the trade market. 

I was ok with Biggio until I realized how bad his contact issues are. 

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

22 minutes ago, TheFutureIsNear said:

2 years 12 mil for Andrus is an awful deal no matter where he plays. He had a hot month or so but his larger sample size going back to 2018 is right on par with Leury. No idea why people are so terrified that we can’t get .240 BA with a .700 OPS production out of Romy/Sosa. Continuously blocking young players with mediocre (at best) production isn’t the direction this team should be going. 

You're a reasonable guy. Offensive production all around baseball was bad last year. I don't know how much the new shift rules will help but I don't understand how Andrus on a 1 year deal is blocking anyone. Popeye isn't ready. Romy looked legit in 2021 in Birmingham for 400 AB's and for 15 games in Charlotte but expecting a .700 OPS from him seems farfetched given his setbacks in the minors in 2022.

Sosa is capable of that and I sure as hell hope that he hits the dickens out of the ball in ST if no one else in brought in. Romy could surprise us too if 2021 wasn't a mirage. It's just very hard to know what to expect from those guys because their track records were kind of skewed by missing 2020. All we have to go on with Romy is a very good year in the AA in 2021.

I don't see how this argument about Andrus as depth and with his hitting being on par with Leury's going back to 2018 means anything. Leury doesnt even have a career War total to match what Andrus did in 1 year which is the most recent sample from 2022. The aggregate of Andrus skills as a total player dwarfs Leury's skills  unless the ability to play a lot of positions badly means that much to you.

But so be it. With a good organization that would spend some money we wouldn't even be having these petty arguments about who's the best slug to start and backup at 2nd base. Depth be damned lets go Leury ,Romy and Sosa !

 

 

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

45 minutes ago, Bob Sacamano said:

If/when Elvis wants or has to settle for a backup IF job, I'd be interested. I don't really want to sign him to start though.

Who should start ? I can't  find a reason for Romy to start or Leury . That leaves Sosa or someone not yet on the team.

[ChiSoxTrojan]

46 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

What would you guys think of Santiago Espinal? 

To me he seems like a younger Harrison. 

Idk how much that's worth on the trade market. 

I was ok with Biggio until I realized how bad his contact issues are. 

I prefer Biggio, for a few reasons:

• He's left-handed and should hit right-handed pitching better than Espinal, and better than Romy/Sosa/Leury are likely to produce next year. Even if it's not a straight platoon it gives Biggio more of a defined role and would reduce the burden on the rookies.
• He has experience in RF and at 1B (I imagine he'd take Sheets spot on the roster, so he could be the backup 1B).
• Biggio probably comes cheaper coming off a down year.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

20 hours ago, ChiSoxTrojan said:

I prefer Biggio, for a few reasons:

• He's left-handed and should hit right-handed pitching better than Espinal, and better than Romy/Sosa/Leury are likely to produce next year. Even if it's not a straight platoon it gives Biggio more of a defined role and would reduce the burden on the rookies.
• He has experience in RF and at 1B (I imagine he'd take Sheets spot on the roster, so he could be the backup 1B).
• Biggio probably comes cheaper coming off a down year.

Except Biggio still has 3 years of eligibility left and as you said is LH and Toronto needs their LHH's so he wouldn't be as cheap as you think. Espinal isn't a FA until 2027.

Sox aren't exactly flush with LH minor leaguers or pitching depth in the minors so finding a way to pry Biggio from the Jays seems difficult.

Between Merrifield, Espinal and Biggio they have depth at a lot of positions . If they gave up anyone it would be Merrifeld the oldest and most expensive of the 3 and ChucK Garfien would be very happy.

Edited January 7, 2023 by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

[TheFutureIsNear]

58 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

You're a reasonable guy. Offensive production all around baseball was bad last year. I don't know how much the new shift rules will help but I don't understand how Andrus on a 1 year deal is blocking anyone. Popeye isn't ready. Romy looked legit in 2021 in Birmingham for 400 AB's and for 15 games in Charlotte but expecting a .700 OPS from him seems farfetched given his setbacks in the minors in 2022.

Sosa is capable of that and I sure as hell hope that he hits the dickens out of the ball in ST if no one else in brought in. Romy could surprise us too if 2021 wasn't a mirage. It's just very hard to know what to expect from those guys because their track records were kind of skewed by missing 2020. All we have to go on with Romy is a very good year in the AA in 2021.

I don't see how this argument about Andrus as depth and with his hitting being on par with Leury's going back to 2018 means anything. Leury doesnt even have a career War total to match what Andrus did in 1 year which is the most recent sample from 2022. The aggregate of Andrus skills as a total player dwarfs Leury's skills  unless the ability to play a lot of positions badly means that much to you.

But so be it. With a good organization that would spend some money we wouldn't even be having these petty arguments about who's the best slug to start and backup at 2nd base. Depth be damned lets go Leury ,Romy and Sosa !

 

 

I’m not 100% against Andrus in general. But I am 100% against giving him a 2 year deal that all but guarantees him the starting 2B job without competition. I actually think the biggest knock against signing Andrus doesn’t even have to do with him…it’s Leury. In a perfect world Andrus would be a good bench piece that gets a crack at the starting 2B job in spring training. Unfortunately Luery and his bad contract already occupy the backup INF spots and I don’t see a world where you can keep Andrus and Luery without 1 starting pretty much everyday.

 

Personally I just don’t see Andrus as a good enough everyday player to take away the ability for Sosa/Romy to compete for the job. Especially when we are talking $6M vs league minimum 

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

21 minutes ago, TheFutureIsNear said:

I’m not 100% against Andrus in general. But I am 100% against giving him a 2 year deal that all but guarantees him the starting 2B job without competition. I actually think the biggest knock against signing Andrus doesn’t even have to do with him…it’s Leury. In a perfect world Andrus would be a good bench piece that gets a crack at the starting 2B job in spring training. Unfortunately Luery and his bad contract already occupy the backup INF spots and I don’t see a world where you can keep Andrus and Luery without 1 starting pretty much everyday.

 

Personally I just don’t see Andrus as a good enough everyday player to take away the ability for Sosa/Romy to compete for the job. Especially when we are talking $6M vs league minimum 

Right, I agree, all things I brought up when addressing a 2 year contract and Leury and the cost of Andrus just for a year given the Sox will spend as little as possible to address needs. Of course in a perfect world Leury would be the one hoping for a minor league deal and an invite to ST. Still hoping he get's Keuchel'd but then we're right back to the Sox spending as little as possible now, if that is indeed the case.

[ChiSoxTrojan]

1 hour ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

Accept Biggio still has 3 years of eligibility left and as you said is LH and Toronto needs their LHH's so he wouldn't be as cheap as you think. Espinal isn't a FA until 2027.

Sox aren't exactly flush with LH minor leaguers or pitching depth in the minors so finding a way to pry Biggio from the Jays seems difficult.

Between Merrifield, Espinal and Biggio they have depth at a lot of positions . If they gave up anyone it would be Merrifeld the oldest and most expensive of the 3 and ChucK Garfien would be very happy.

Merrifield would also be a great fit on the Sox, as he could platoon with Colas in RF in addition to his starts at 2B. I just don't think the Sox have anything to offer the Jays that would make them give up their starting 2B. They're not in a position to be trading quality major leaguers for prospects, and the Sox don't have any expendable major leaguers.

[Chicago White Sox]

3 hours ago, ChiSoxTrojan said:

Merrifield would also be a great fit on the Sox, as he could platoon with Colas in RF in addition to his starts at 2B. I just don't think the Sox have anything to offer the Jays that would make them give up their starting 2B. They're not in a position to be trading quality major leaguers for prospects, and the Sox don't have any expendable major leaguers.

Merifield can’t hit anymore…

[DirtySox]

 

[Chicago White Sox]

4 minutes ago, DirtySox said:

 

This would be a no brainer IMO.  Can we afford his ~$10M salary though?

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Squirmin' for Yermin]

25 minutes ago, DirtySox said:

 

No brainer 

[ChiSox59]

25 minutes ago, DirtySox said:

 

I struggle to see why NYY would make this deal unless they’re simply looking to get rid of Gleyber. Which isn’t super encouraging. 

[Squirmin' for Yermin]

1 minute ago, ChiSox59 said:

I struggle to see why NYY would make this deal unless they’re simply looking to get rid of Gleyber. Which isn’t super encouraging. 

Their bullpen needs some work.. but I agree crochet alone probs doesn’t donit

[Bob Sacamano]

10 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

I struggle to see why NYY would make this deal unless they’re simply looking to get rid of Gleyber. Which isn’t super encouraging. 

Assuming they plug Peraza in at SS, they kind of have a logjam in the infield, although with Donaldson and Stanton, probably smarter to keep the depth since those guys will end up on the IL at some point.

[GreenSox]

47 minutes ago, DirtySox said:

 

Not sound defensively. Average player.  Wouldn't surprise me if they'd trade him for young pitching - that's what good teams do.   

[ShoeLessRob]

Bruce Levine doesn’t know s%*#. 

[bmags]

32 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

I struggle to see why NYY would make this deal unless they’re simply looking to get rid of Gleyber. Which isn’t super encouraging. 

Many yankee fans weren’t even sure they were going to pick up the option before he got hot in September.

Read an article in the pinstripe alley blog they thought he was out

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

14 minutes ago, GreenSox said:

Not sound defensively. Average player.  Wouldn't surprise me if they'd trade him for young pitching - that's what good teams do.   

Actually he was sound defensively in 2022. Good power. Can always use more of that. But him for Crochet who probably won't be pitch til July or August is laughable. Levine can speculate all he wants but I wouldn't even rank his speculation or ideas for trades equal to some of the best fans here.

[Chicago White Sox]

48 minutes ago, Squirmin' for Yermin said:

Their bullpen needs some work.. but I agree crochet alone probs doesn’t donit

BBTV says it does and they’re never wrong on player valuation ?