2nd Base I guess it’s going to be Sosa or Gonzalez?

[Tnetennba]

52 minutes ago, Bob Sacamano said:

Forgot about him. Their DH spot is also open for at bats.

Kirk will likely spend more than half his time DHing, but there will be plenty of DH ABs  to go around when he's catching. 

[Tnetennba]

52 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

I'd take Biggio for a song.  

Same, but I don't think the Jays are interested in giving him away for nothing.  Or the equivalent of nothing the Sox can offer.

[Harold's Leg Lift]

Did something happen to George Springer?

[he gone.]

nope, he's the RF. 

Varsho, Keirmeier, Springer in the OF. 

Call me crazy, I can see them taking a low price flier on Cruz in Toronto as well. Or maybe more likely Adam Duvall.  As mentioned that DH spot is going to be split between Kirk, Jansen, Vladdy, Springer, Biggio, etc. etc. They basically have a Rays type setup. Great OF defense, lots of flexibility, but also a good amount of injury history too in some of these spots. 

Not sure if they'd give up Merrifield based on all of that, but certainly worth a call and to me, an overpay from the Sox. 

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

7 hours ago, Texsox said:

There is a chance he was playing hurt for a lot of last season. 

I agree he shouldn't be in the outfield, but they needed him there and so he went. I'm not certain we should be holding that against him. Even after the disaster of last season he's got a career WAR of 1.9. He's the grinder on the team. No surprises, shows up everyday ready to play, gives 100%.

Sure, there isn't anyone on the roster I wouldn't like see upgraded. But with much bigger holes to fill, I'm fine with him as the INF sub. 

As of now though he's the backup OF in CF and in the mix for starting at 2nd base with Romy and Sosa.

A career War of 1.9 playing 10 years isn't really good . You have super subs putting up 1 War per season or more depending on playing time.  There's a chance a lot of guys play with minor injuries . The grind of baseball does that to you. If you play, produce, if not, go on the DL. Negative  War isn't helping the team. At that point you're better off playing just about anyone else . Well maybe not Romy was a negative War guy too.

This is the reason why I want Andrus or really anyone else in the black hole of 2nd base or some guy who can play CF  as the 4th OF. I've been talking about more OF since the Off season began. Outman would look pretty good right about now. But I'm pretty sure the Dodgers will hang onto him.

Contenders do not go into a season witha bunch of negative War from the previos season. Vaughn's negative War you can let slide because he's no OF.

Last Year the Sox had only 4 position players at 2 fWar and above and 2 of them are gone; Andrus 2, Anderson 2, Robert 2.1 and Abreu 3.9. They need a whole lot of health and raised performances  to even come close to winning the division and real live breathing depth is  huge.

 

[Dick Allen]

It just amazes me how unaggressive this front office is. And for whatever reason. They were given a gift when  Pollock didnt exercise his option, yet they almost couldn't be less aggressive. SHOW US YOU WANT TO WIN FOR ONCE.

[ChiSox59]

6 minutes ago, Dick Allen said:

It just amazes me how unaggressive this front office is. And for whatever reason. They were given a gift when  Pollock didnt exercise his option, yet they almost couldn't be less aggressive. SHOW US YOU WANT TO WIN FOR ONCE.

I am pretty comfortable stating that Benintendi wouldn't have signed here had Pollock not declined his option.  Obviously, Sox haven't been super aggressive.  But they don't really have much else to do.  The roster is pretty locked in. 2B and a 4th OF is really the only needs, besides perhaps some SP depth for AAA. 

[Dick Allen]

10 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

I am pretty comfortable stating that Benintendi wouldn't have signed here had Pollock not declined his option.  Obviously, Sox haven't been super aggressive.  But they don't really have much else to do.  The roster is pretty locked in. 2B and a 4th OF is really the only needs, besides perhaps some SP depth for AAA. 

Totally disagree. A team really thinking they are a championship contender doesn't rely almost exclusively on rookies, and not exactly top 50 prospects at that, to cover 2 positions. They need help at catcher. MLBTR had a piece the other day showing their weakest positions last season were C and RF, and they did nothing. I am sure a couple of these guys are going to bounce back, but all of them? And they aren't going to be hurt most of the time/ I think teams that say they are contenders should act like it. 

[he gone.]

we're not a championship contender. we are an 87 win team that hopes to get lucky and hot in october. 

[Texsox]

4 minutes ago, he gone. said:

we're not a championship contender. we are an 87 win team that hopes to get lucky and hot in october. 

Yep. And 87 might be optimistic. They are a couple injuries from a 79 win team. 

[ChiSox59]

1 hour ago, Dick Allen said:

Totally disagree. A team really thinking they are a championship contender doesn't rely almost exclusively on rookies, and not exactly top 50 prospects at that, to cover 2 positions. They need help at catcher. MLBTR had a piece the other day showing their weakest positions last season were C and RF, and they did nothing. I am sure a couple of these guys are going to bounce back, but all of them? And they aren't going to be hurt most of the time/ I think teams that say they are contenders should act like it. 

Sox needed an LH OF.  They signed the 2nd best one available.  They were never going to acquire 2 starting caliber OFs this offseason and effectively block Colas.  The Sox catcher position is full.  There is no room to add another MLB catcher to the roster.  The Sox are still in better shape at the catcher position than most teams.  I would prefer they acquire a real LH 2B, but most expected they'd go with the kids with perhaps a stopgappy cheap vet, and that looks to be the case. 

I am not impressed with the Sox offseason, to be honest.  But its about how I expected it to go.  Sign a backend SP, sign a LH OF, and hope the rest of the team gets healthier and performs better.  My names were Nimmo and Heaney per the OP in the Offseason Plan - they didn't do that good due to how the FA market unfolded, but the Sox signings were not awful by any means.  

The bottom line is this roster was mostly cemented in coming off 2022 due to contractual status, or inability to move due to coming off underperforming seasons.  It is what it is.  I would love for them to add another player than could factor into both the 2B and RF mix, but there really are not any FAs left that fit that bill unless you want to try to get Profar to play 2B for the first time in a few seasons. Just not exactly sure what you expected.  

 

Edited January 3, 2023 by ChiSox59

[ChiSox59]

9 minutes ago, Texsox said:

Yep. And 87 might be optimistic. They are a couple injuries from a 79 win team. 

They were an 81 win team last year, almost no one was healthy, nearly everything went wrong and were managed by a guy that appeared to intentionally put them in a terrible position to win each night.  We basically played the entire 2nd half of the season without TA or Robert.  Robert had 0 HRs and 2 RBI after July 14th. Sure, we lost an aging Abreu.  That hurts.  But our defense has improved drastically getting AV out out the OF, and our lineup is going to perform better against RHP with Benintendi and Colas in the lineup.

IMO, "a couple injuries away from a 79 team" seems wildly pessimistic considering what we saw in 2022. 

Edited January 3, 2023 by ChiSox59

[Tony]

8 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

Sox needed an LH OF.  They signed the 2nd best one available.  They were never going to acquire 2 starting caliber OFs this offseason and effectively block Colas.  The Sox catcher position is full.  There is no room to add another MLB catcher to the roster.  The Sox are still in better shape at the catcher position than most teams.  I would prefer they acquire a real LH 2B, but most expected they'd go with the kids with perhaps a stopgappy cheap vet, and that looks to be the case. 

I am not impressed with the Sox offseason, to be honest.  But its about how I expected it to go.  Sign a backend SP, sign a LH OF, and hope the rest of the team gets healthier and performs better.  My names were Nimmo and Heaney per the OP in the Offseason Plan - they didn't do that good due to how the FA market unfolded, but the Sox signings were not awful by any means.  

The bottom line is this roster was mostly cemented in coming off 2022 due to contractual status, or inability to move due to coming off underperforming seasons.  It is what it is.  I would love for them to add another player than could factor into both the 2B and RF mix, but there really are not any FAs left that fit that bill unless you want to try to get Profar to play 2B for the first time in a few seasons. Just not exactly sure what you expected.  

 

But this continues to be the problem and continues to be what this board keeps talking about. 

It doesn't have to be this way. I don't think @Dick Allenexpected the Sox to add $250 million dollars in contracts this offseason, but why shouldn't we? There is a difference between what we all expect out of a JR lead team, and what we all feel like should happen. I don't anyone was super unrealistic here. Expecting to add some real depth behind Grandal, who literally was one of the worst MLB players last year, something more than Selby Zavala, isn't unrealistic. Adding someone better than Mike Clevinger isn't unrealistic. Adding a veteran 2B that has some track record isn't unrealistic. 

And this is always where the argument starts. It's not that anyone expected the Sox to make all those moves...because we know the sorry history of this team. It doesn't mean we all have to lower our standards and just bend over to what the Sox give us. f*** that. They deserve to be called out after going out of their way to tank in 2017-2018-2019, then in their "World Series Window" not act like an actual contender....they should continue to be held accountable. 

[Squirmin' for Yermin]

31 minutes ago, Texsox said:

Yep. And 87 might be optimistic. They are a couple injuries from a 79 win team. 

and a couple bounce backs away from 90 wins.

[Balta1701]

46 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

Sox needed an LH OF.  They signed the 2nd best one available.  They were never going to acquire 2 starting caliber OFs this offseason and effectively block Colas.  The Sox catcher position is full.  There is no room to add another MLB catcher to the roster.  The Sox are in still in better shape at the catcher position than most teams.  I would prefer they acquire a vet 2B, but most expected they'd go with the kids with perhaps a stopgappy cheap vet, and that looks to be the case. 

I am not impressed with the Sox offseason, to be honest.  But its about how I expected it to go.  Sign a backend SP, sign a LH OF, and hope the rest of the team gets healthier and performs better.  My names were Nimmo and Heaney per the OP in the Offseason Plan - they didn't do that good due to how the FA market unfolded, but the Sox signings were not awful by any means.  

The bottom line is this roster was mostly cemented in coming off 2022 due to contractual status, or inability to move due to coming off underperforming seasons.  It is what it is.  I would love for them to add another player than could factor into both the 2B and RF mix, but there really are not any FAs left that fit that bill unless you want to try to get Profar to play 2B for the first time in a few seasons. Just not exactly sure what you expected.  

 

I would have agreed with you that the catcher's situation was acceptable...in early December, but at that time, we didn't know how severe the back problem for Grandal was. The White Sox did. If Grandal just had repeated leg injuries, then a decent rehab and strengthening program might have had some ability to give him a shot at playing a portion of the season. But, trying to rehab a back injury of the sort that he has seems likely to be a different beast. Learning about that made it seem way less likely that the White Sox have a reliable catcher in Grandal this year, and like it or not - Zavala and Perez with "Maybe Grandal can play through a serious back injury" is not better shape than in most teams. It has an outside chance at working, but it relies very heavily on a guy with a serious back problem. 

Is there a good option there? I'm not sure, the right option was to not trade away their third under control catcher last trade deadline if they had a catcher whose back had gone out. Unfortunately, that can't be easily undone right now. 
 

Also worth noting, I think some of the ludicrous trade proposals we've seen (Hendriks for two top 50 prospects from the Dodgers or for the #1 prospect in baseball!) have left people wondering why there hasn't been more done. Furthermore, this was fed by one "Rick Hahn" who said that he would have to do work on the trade market and who has since made...0 substantive trades, which suggests that perhaps this "Rick Hahn" misread the market and misunderstood his organization again. 

[southsider2k5]

42 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

They were an 81 win team last year, almost no one was healthy, nearly everything went wrong and were managed by a guy that appeared to intentionally put them in a terrible position to win each night.  We basically played the entire 2nd half of the season without TA or Robert.  Robert had 0 HRs and 2 RBI after July 14th. Sure, we lost an aging Abreu.  That hurts.  But our defense has improved drastically getting AV out out the OF, and our lineup is going to perform better against RHP with Benintendi and Colas in the lineup.

IMO, "a couple injuries away from a 79 team" seems wildly pessimistic considering what we saw in 2022. 

It's a 42 win team if they are lucky.

[ChiSox59]

17 minutes ago, Tony said:

But this continues to be the problem and continues to be what this board keeps talking about. 

It doesn't have to be this way. I don't think @Dick Allenexpected the Sox to add $250 million dollars in contracts this offseason, but why shouldn't we? There is a difference between what we all expect out of a JR lead team, and what we all feel like should happen. I don't anyone was super unrealistic here. Expecting to add some real depth behind Grandal, who literally was one of the worst MLB players last year, something more than Selby Zavala, isn't unrealistic. Adding someone better than Mike Clevinger isn't unrealistic. Adding a veteran 2B that has some track record isn't unrealistic. 

And this is always where the argument starts. It's not that anyone expected the Sox to make all those moves...because we know the sorry history of this team. It doesn't mean we all have to lower our standards and just bend over to what the Sox give us. f*** that. They deserve to be called out after going out of their way to tank in 2017-2018-2019, then in their "World Series Window" not act like an actual contender....they should continue to be held accountable. 

I guess I don't really follow.  Be mad, gnash your teeth and light your pitchforks if you wish.  There is good reason to be fed up - the Sox were awful in 2022, and have mostly botched every decision of note since losing to Oakland in October 2020.

But you cannot possibly be suggesting the Chicago White Sox were going to operate with a $250M payroll in 2023.  Its just not reality. 

You can carry 2 MLB catchers on the roster.  One of them is getting paid $18.25M and is going nowhere because of that.  He has also been the 2nd or 3rd best catcher in the game over the past half decade +, and if he can get healthy, its reasonable to expect a better 2023.  Seby Zavala by measure of fWAR was the 6th most valuable catcher in the AL last season. He is also out of options.  Again, there is no room to add another catcher to the roster. 

Clevinger was a perfectly acceptable backend SP add with upside.  I see no reason to be upset about that move. 

Yes, the lack of any move at 2B is frustrating.  I agree.  But again they weren't going to blow by $200M payroll, and its reasonable to expect that Sosa/Romy/JRod can give you close to what Harrison did for 15% of the cost.

It was pretty obvious that the Sox were going to move on from Tony, add around the edges with a focus on getting more left handed and better defensively, and run it back in 2023.  And that is what they've done to date.  I struggle to see why anyone would be surprised by this. 

[ChiSox59]

5 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

I would have agreed with you that the catcher's situation was acceptable...in early December, but at that time, we didn't know how severe the back problem for Grandal was. The White Sox did. If Grandal just had repeated leg injuries, then a decent rehab and strengthening program might have had some ability to give him a shot at playing a portion of the season. But, trying to rehab a back injury of the sort that he has seems likely to be a different beast. Learning about that made it seem way less likely that the White Sox have a reliable catcher in Grandal this year, and like it or not - Zavala and Perez with "Maybe Grandal can play through a serious back injury" is not better shape than in most teams. It has an outside chance at working, but it relies very heavily on a guy with a serious back problem. 

Is there a good option there? I'm not sure, the right option was to not trade away their third under control catcher last trade deadline if they had a catcher whose back had gone out. Unfortunately, that can't be easily undone right now. 
 

Also worth noting, I think some of the ludicrous trade proposals we've seen (Hendriks for two top 50 prospects from the Dodgers or for the #1 prospect in baseball!) have left people wondering why there hasn't been more done. Furthermore, this was fed by one "Rick Hahn" who said that he would have to do work on the trade market and who has since made...0 trades, which suggests that perhaps this "Rick Hahn" misread the market and misunderstood his organization again. 

Grandal has said he's healthy right now.  People can recover from back injuries.  They just need him to be like 60% of his 2019-2021 self to be useful in a platoon.  If he simply can't do it, they have Zavala who is already at least an average MLB catcher - 1.9 fWAR in 2022 was good for 7th in the AL, and 13th in the game.  His fWAR per game played ranked 7th in the game in 2022.

Now is that sustainable for Seby?  Probably not.  But he's at least a league averagish catcher by measure of fWAR.  If Seby had options, I'd be all for brining in another catcher.  But let's not act like the FA market was flush with good options for what they needed.  It just is what it is with Grandal.  Hope he's healthy and can produce in a part time role.  If not, you cut bait in May or June and Seby and Perez duke it out.  Sox also signed that Rivero kid from KC who Grifol loves and at least you have a guy who can excel defensively back there in the event he is needed. I also think Grifol's influence on Seby behind the plate shouldn't be downplayed. 

[Dick Allen]

2 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

I guess I don't really follow.  Be mad, gnash your teeth and light your pitchforks if you wish.  There is good reason to be fed up - the Sox were awful in 2022, and have mostly botched every decision of note since losing to Oakland in October 2020.

But you cannot possibly be suggesting the Chicago White Sox were going to operate with a $250M payroll in 2023.  Its just not reality. 

You can carry 2 MLB catchers on the roster.  One of them is getting paid $18.25M and is going nowhere because of that.  He has also been the 2nd or 3rd best catcher in the game over the past half decade +, and if he can get healthy, its reasonable to expect a better 2023.  Seby Zavala by measure of fWAR was the 6th most valuable catcher in the AL last season. He is also out of options.  Again, there is no room to add another catcher to the roster. 

Clevinger was a perfectly acceptable backend SP add with upside.  I see no reason to be upset about that move. 

Yes, the lack of any move at 2B is frustrating.  I agree.  But again they weren't going to blow by $200M payroll, and its reasonable to expect that Sosa/Romy/JRod can give you close to what Harrison did for 15% of the cost.

It was pretty obvious that the Sox were going to move on from Tony, add around the edges with a focus on getting more left handed and better defensively, and run it back in 2023.  And that is what they've done to date.  I struggle to see why anyone would be surprised by this. 

It’s not realistic but they are nowhere near $250 million. They lost Abreu  and got Pollock to leave. If you are in a championship window, a fan base should expect the payroll to rise each year as core players generally have thei salaries increase. Clevinger hopefully can do what Cueto did last year. Benintendi should help. I like Colas as a prospect, but you are putting a lot on him and either Sosa or Romy and possibly Perez behind the plate. It’s not like the Sox have an upper echelon farm system. There should have been better options. I think they will be better, but if you look at White Sox history under JR, after disappointing seasons, they usually bounce back and win 85.  I will admit I am sick of the team hoping to win instead of trying their best to win.

[ChiSox59]

Just now, Dick Allen said:

It’s not realistic but they are nowhere near $250 million. They lost Abreu  and got Pollock to leave. If you are in a championship window, a fan base should expect the payroll to rise each year as core players generally have thei salaries increase. Clevinger hopefully can do what Cueto did last year. Benintendi should help. I like Colas as a prospect, but you are putting a lot on him and either Sosa or Romy and possibly Perez behind the plate. It’s not like the Sox have an upper echelon farm system. There should have been better options. I think they will be better, but if you look at White Sox history under JR, after disappointing seasons, they usually bounce back and win 85.  I will admit I am sick of the team hoping to win instead of trying their best to win.

That's fair and I get all that.  No argument from me - a bit different than the post I quoted.

And the $250M reference was from Tony's post.  I agree there is no reason the Sox shouldn't be operating right below the luxury tax.  But they're going to be right around $195M_$200M - just like I said all offseason - after everyone was convinced it'd be cut back into the $175M range.  

I do think Rick still has a trade or two in him to improve the club.  He went on and on about trades in the early offseason and hasn't made one.  I suspect he's just waiting for something closer to his ask as opposed to forcing things, and I am OK with that.  

[SoxBlanco]

22 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

Furthermore, this was fed by one "Rick Hahn" who said that he would have to do work on the trade market and who has since made...0 trades

When did Hahn say he had to make trades? I thought he just said trades were more likely than free agent signings. 

Edited January 3, 2023 by SoxBlanco

[Balta1701]

16 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

Grandal has said he's healthy right now.  People can recover from back injuries.  They just need him to be like 60% of his 2019-2021 self to be useful in a platoon.  If he simply can't do it, they have Zavala who is already at least an average MLB catcher - 1.9 fWAR in 2022 was good for 7th in the AL, and 13th in the game.  His fWAR per game played ranked 7th in the game in 2022.

Now is that sustainable for Seby?  Probably not.  But he's at least a league averagish catcher by measure of fWAR.  If Seby had options, I'd be all for brining in another catcher.  But let's not act like the FA market was flush with good options for what they needed.  It just is what it is with Grandal.  Hope he's healthy and can produce in a part time role.  If not, you cut bait in May or June and Seby and Perez duke it out.  Sox also signed that Rivero kid from KC who Grifol loves and at least you have a guy who can excel defensively back there in the event he is needed. I also think Grifol's influence on Seby behind the plate shouldn't be downplayed. 

You really have to make me trash Seby? Come on man, I actually like the improvement he showed, he looked like a legitimate backup catcher. But...he put up a .404 BABIP last year, which isn't going to hold up if he's given more at bats (although his HR rate was a little depressed in the bigs), and I think you're not putting enough skepticism on the huge improvement in his defense observed last year and whether that could be biased because of the small number of innings he played and the issues with counting stats for catchers. UZR puts him, on a per inning basis, as one of the most effective defenders in the game last year, however DRS counts him as slightly above average, which is why B-R counts him as only a 1 WAR player rather than 1.9 for Fangraphs. For a guy who didn't play all that much, I think you're way over-weighting a number there that is difficult to give that amount of precision on. 

Had he played 900 innings, he would have, for example, been on pace to be again at the top of the league in passed balls and in the top 5 in wild pitches, some of which probably goes on the catcher. He had more passed balls than Reese on the year despite 200 fewer innings, Reese threw out runners at a better pace, but UZR thinks Seby was a more effective defender? I just don't buy that. 

I think he's a good option as a backup catcher, but no I don't think he's a starting catcher on a competitive team right now, and I don't think he's "Already an average MLB catcher". 

[ChiSox59]

10 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

You really have to make me trash Seby? Come on man, I actually like the improvement he showed, he looked like a legitimate backup catcher. But...he put up a .404 BABIP last year, which isn't going to hold up if he's given more at bats (although his HR rate was a little depressed in the bigs), and I think you're not putting enough skepticism on the huge improvement in his defense observed last year and whether that could be biased because of the small number of innings he played and the issues with counting stats for catchers. UZR puts him, on a per inning basis, as one of the most effective defenders in the game last year, however DRS counts him as slightly above average, which is why B-R counts him as only a 1 WAR player rather than 1.9 for Fangraphs. For a guy who didn't play all that much, I think you're way over-weighting a number there that is difficult to give that amount of precision on. 

Had he played 900 innings, he would have, for example, been on pace to be again at the top of the league in passed balls and in the top 5 in wild pitches, some of which probably goes on the catcher. He had more passed balls than Reese on the year despite 200 fewer innings, Reese threw out runners at a better pace, but UZR thinks Seby was a more effective defender? I just don't buy that. 

I think he's a good option as a backup catcher, but no I don't think he's a starting catcher on a competitive team right now, and I don't think he's "Already an average MLB catcher". 

It doesn’t take much to be an average mlb catcher statistically. The position is a waste land. I said I wasn’t sure if it’s sustainable with Seby but I think you can do much worse than having him be part of the solution. I also truly believe the level of instruction he is going to receive will be considerably better than what he’s had recently. 

I admit I have higher hopes for Grandal being useful than most. I was encouraged by the Grandal interview when the injuries were discussed; not discouraged. But you simply cannot cut bait on Grandal without trying to resurrect value from that control. Hence the situation the Sox find themselves in….

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

2 hours ago, Dick Allen said:

Totally disagree. A team really thinking they are a championship contender doesn't rely almost exclusively on rookies, and not exactly top 50 prospects at that, to cover 2 positions. They need help at catcher. MLBTR had a piece the other day showing their weakest positions last season were C and RF, and they did nothing. I am sure a couple of these guys are going to bounce back, but all of them? And they aren't going to be hurt most of the time/ I think teams that say they are contenders should act like it. 

When exactly are teams supposed to work in a hot rookie when he's perfect for the opening they have ? By the time Colas started playing, to the people who do the rankings, Colas was just another older Cuban prospect, just a 45FV . By the time the season ended he got ranked in the top 100 and went from A+ to AAA and never slowed down. You saw how Montgomery slowed down once he got to Birmingham 19 yrs old and he  was tired .

Colas was a beast but yes, as of now if you count 2nd base they are counting on rookies . Maybe they rely on Sosa or Romy which is not quite as exciting. But I suggested Andrus , you didn't want him, I agreed that Tony Kemp might be a good option, Escobar would be fine, Gleyber Torres great !.  Who do you like at 2nd base ? Did you agree or disagree they might have to trade Hendriks ? Do they trade minor leaguers ?

You can't just keep crapping on everything.

The Sox had 4 position players with 2 or more War last year. 3 of them barely clinging to 2 War and the top guy walked with 3.9 War and the other 2 WAR guy also walked and you don't like him.

[Dick Allen]

1 minute ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

When exactly are teams supposed to work in a hot rookie when he's perfect for the opening they have ? By the time Colas started playing, to the people who do the rankings, Colas was just another older Cuban prospect, just a 45FV . By the time the season ended he got ranked in the top 100 and went from A+ to AAA and never slowed down. You saw how Montgomery slowed down once he got to Birmingham 19 yrs old and he  was tired .

Colas was a beast but yes, as of now if you count 2nd base they are counting on rookies . Maybe they rely on Sosa or Romy which is not quite as exciting. But I suggested Andrus , you didn't want him, I agreed that Tony Kemp might be a good option, Escobar would be fine, Gleyber Torres great !.  Who do you like at 2nd base ? Did you agree or disagree they might have to trade Hendriks ? Do they trade minor leaguers ?

You can't just keep crapping on everything.

The Sox had 4 position players with 2 or more War last year. 3 of them barely clinging to 2 War and the top guy walked with 3.9 War and the other 2 WAR guy also walked and you don't like him.

I’m not anti rookie, but rookies usually struggle at some, point if not right away.  A supposed championship window isn’t when you usually put that much on them. Who do they have to give Colas a break if he needs if? Who do they have if he struggles? He might be great right away, but it’s unlikely. And they are doing it at 2B as well. Why can’t they ever really go for it?