Sox vs Cubs 2023 roster moves

[AJ'S Cousin]

just something to post, a comparison mostly about the front office’s and what they accomplished 

 

The Cubs basically redesigned there entire roster, they definitely needed more than the Sox but in my opinion they outdid the the Sox

Cubs — Swanson , Bellinger, Taillon, Barnhart, Hosmer, Mancini, plus many minor adjustments. 

Sox— Clevenger, Benintendi, Hamilton, some minor adjustments 

Cubs up the middle now —  SS Swanson, 2nd Horner/ Madrigal CF Bellinger  C Gomes/Barnhart 

Sox up the middle now — SS  Anderson, 2nd  ????? , CF  Robert, C  Grandal/Zavala

Corner infielders    

Cubs—- 1st Base/DH Hosmer, Mancini, Wisdom 3rd Baseman Wisdom 

Sox — 1st Base/DH  Vaughn , Sheets, Jimenez  3rd Baseman Moncada, Burger 

Corner Outfielders 

Cubs —- Left  Happ Right Suzuki

Sox —- Left Benintendi  Right Colas 

Starting Pitching and Bullpen too much to list but I’ll give the Sox the edge even without Hendriks 

Bench is up to interpretation.

Sox —- Garcia, Hamilton Sosa, Gonzalez, currently the  2nd Baseman will come from this crew 3rd Base, Burger 

Cubs—- Madrigal, Hosmer Mancini Morel  and others to be determined 

The Sox currently have 6 starters, Gio, Lynn  Cease, Kopech, Clevinger, and Alternate if a pitcher goes down, Martin 

Bullpen still solid even with Hendriks out for an extended period ( I think the Sox knew he had cancer and did the right thing and not traded him) , that would of looked shady if they traded him. Kelly could be used in a trade to clear some payroll   Burger and Sheets are trade chips to help get a legit everyday 2nd baseman.

Benintendi was a good move, would have been nice to get Conforto to give Colas more experience 

Gleyber Torres or Madrigal trade possible? 
 

Cubs spent more, made many more moves. Taking a chance on Bellinger for 1 year at 17 million in that hitters park a good move, will Suzuki  be what he’s supposed to be? Will they trade Madrigal to the Sox or anyone? Mancini and Hosmer could alternatives at DH/1st Base. 
 

Sox gambling on Clevinger for 1 year at 13 million, might work out, more of an insurance policy if Kopech isn’t ready

Can the Sox still get a legit full time 2nd baseman still? Doubt it, Torres and Madrigal seem to be the only ones still out there worth it . 

The Cub front office was much more aggressive with low risk 1 and 2 year contracts   Sox afraid to spend and risk trading Sheets, Burger, Colas etc  

this is a discussion to have fun with, things could still change  HOPEFULLY  Not sold on the current makeup of the team  VERY WEAK BENCH 

 

[AJ'S Cousin]

this is an abbreviated version of my other post which goes into more detail by the same title. , i had a problem posting the longer version and thought it didn’t post when the site went down yea
 

Who did better, I say the Cubs, they were more aggressive, made calculated 1 and 2 year deals with Hosmer, Mancini, Bellinger etc. 

Spent on Swanson and Tallion. 
 

We got Benintendi and Clevinger, no legit 2nd Baseman. Still overloaded with DH’s and 1st Basemen. A possible rookie with no real at bats in the majors in right field Colas instead of Conforto who was there for the taking 

Benintendi was a good move, Clevinger a risk but only for a year. Martin as a backup 5th Starter or 5th Starter if Kopech is still mending is ok . 
our bench is a joke Hamilton, Garcia Sosa and Gonzalez? Come on, really? Is Gleyber Torres really available? Is Madragil really available ?

Edited January 16, 2023 by AJ'S Cousin

[Highland]

The Sox FO did address a couple problems but that was about it. Hahn did say in so many words that the team wouldn't do anything over dramatic. It appears that they are hoping the core players of the rebuild will stay healthy enough to get the team into the playoffs. I don't know if the FO will do anything big at the trade deadline, if they do anything at all. 

[Tnetennba]

And why the f*** do we care about what the Cubs did this winter?

[Bossanoveralls]

f*** the Cubs.

[Bossanoveralls]

I say f*** the Cubs.

And I always say that, too.

[AJ'S Cousin]

47 minutes ago, Tnetennba said:

And why the f*** do we care about what the Cubs did this winter?

i don't care either what the cubs do, i'm just illustrate the difference in our terrible Front Office and the little disregard for our fan base. JR, Kenny and Hahn just don't seem to care. They only care about payroll and not whether we win or lose. Maybe one day we'll get an owner like SD, NY, LA has. AN owner that wants to win at all costs. 

[AJ'S Cousin]

Just now, AJ'S Cousin said:

i don't care either what the cubs do, i'm just illustrate the difference in our terrible Front Office and the little disregard for our fan base. JR, Kenny and Hahn just don't seem to care. They only care about payroll and not whether we win or lose. Maybe one day we'll get an owner like SD, NY, LA has. AN owner that wants to win at all costs. 

PS. remove the Cub comparison and answer this? Did the Sox do all that they could to get back to the playoffs? I say no. 

[AJ'S Cousin]

43 minutes ago, Bossanoveralls said:

f*** the Cubs.

and F*** the Sox, because our Front Office just doesn't care 

[AJ'S Cousin]

1 hour ago, Highland said:

The Sox FO did address a couple problems but that was about it. Hahn did say in so many words that the team wouldn't do anything over dramatic. It appears that they are hoping the core players of the rebuild will stay healthy enough to get the team into the playoffs. I don't know if the FO will do anything big at the trade deadline, if they do anything at all. 

they didn't do enough considering what was availble, Conforto and Segura as a start. Colas may be a star in the making but he's not ready. Is Clevinger going to be the the Clevinger we saw dominate? Doubt it, they're already saying he's lost 3 or 4 miles off of his fast ball. Is Kopech going to ready? Did they really do anything beyoud Benintendi, which i liked the signing. Too many 1st Baseman DH types. Which Gandal shows up? If Colas fails at the plate we'll have a Garcia Sheets Right Field when Garcia is not playing second  Hamilton signing is a joke, i'd rather of had Harrison back and not a fan of Harrison but he's better than Garcia/Sosa/Gonzalez at this time. 

We have too many player who spend more time on the IR list than on the fiels. 

[southsider2k5]

I will never understand the little brother thing the Sox have for the Cubs. 

[4uckOffCommieScum]

I wouldn’t say the Sox starting depth beyond the starting five is ok. Martin followed by nothing apparently serviceable is pretty weak. Not really a believer in Martin, I have to admit

[AJ'S Cousin]

11 minutes ago, FourEyesShottenhoffer said:

I wouldn’t say the Sox starting depth beyond the starting five is ok. Martin followed by nothing apparently serviceable is pretty weak. Not really a believer in Martin, I have to admit

agree, but you got to play the hand you're dealt. too msny porclean dolls on this team this is what the cheapo's gave us this year.  

[Flash]

I grew up in Chgo in the 60s and my dad regularly took brothers and me to both Sox and Cub games. Fondly remember Pete Ward, Ron Hanson, Don Buford, Tommy Agee, Moose Skowren, Ken Berry, Gary Peters, Hoyt Wilhem, Joel Horlen, etc. On the north side, Ernie Banks, Ron Santo, Don Kessinger, Glen Beckert, Randy Hundley, Billy Williams, Fergis Jenkins, etc. I (we) were Chicago fans and pulled for both teams equally. I remain a Chicago fan till this day. Yes...its not heresy to be both. That said (and I commented here earlier, prior to Cubs signing Swanson and Sox signing Benentendi) the Cubs are on a better trajectory than the Sox. Sox might have higher profile pitchers but Cubs starting pitching is stronger and deeper. I'm actually of the belief the Cubs have a fighting chance of winning division and I cannot say the same about Sox. In terms of this offseason, Cubs were the clear winners but only time will tell.

[wegner]

2 hours ago, Tnetennba said:

And why the f*** do we care about what the Cubs did this winter?

Honestly I don't really know what they did.....I think they signed a shortstop?  If so or even if not so, I wouldn't mind the White Sox taking Nico Hoerner off their hands.

[Bob Sacamano]

11 minutes ago, wegner said:

Honestly I don't really know what they did.....I think they signed a shortstop?  If so or even if not so, I wouldn't mind the White Sox taking Nico Hoerner off their hands.

With the guys they’ve signed, they could be boom or mostly bust. Might have a few decent pieces to trade deadline or actually contend in that division. Their depth seems decent though.

[Harry Chappas]

If the White Sox did what the cubs did, blocked their young talent with a bunch of old guys (I include Bellinger in this group), there would be an uproar.  None of those guys outside of Swanson do anything to make the cubs window any more near than it was last year.   Their whole offseason was signing guys that when you open a pack of baseball cards you just shrug when you se them.  They made some headlines and increase their payroll.  This was what the Sox and done previously and were lambasted for it. 

[fathom]

8 minutes ago, Harry Chappas said:

If the White Sox did what the cubs did, blocked their young talent with a bunch of old guys (I include Bellinger in this group), there would be an uproar.  None of those guys outside of Swanson do anything to make the cubs window any more near than it was last year.   Their whole offseason was signing guys that when you open a pack of baseball cards you just shrug when you se them.  They made some headlines and increase their payroll.  This was what the Sox and done previously and were lambasted for it. 

Chances Dicaro would imply the Sox were racist if they made the moves the Cubs did?

Edited January 17, 2023 by fathom

[Quin]

Hosmer, Mancini and Bellinger OPS in 2022: .716, .710, .654

[he gone.]

On 1/16/2023 at 8:55 AM, Tnetennba said:

And why the f*** do we care about what the Cubs did this winter?

Cause we just do. It won't ever change. Rivalries and sports go hand and hand. 

[he gone.]

I believe that our payrolls are very, very similar as well. Like, within a few million. I'd be interested to ask who put together a better team, better composition, better future, better path to a championship in both the short, mid and long term. 

Considering offense, defense, arms, flexibility, depth, etc.? 

For me, I always start with arms and on that alone I think the Sox probably have the overall edge no matter what. I would absolutely love to bring in one more arm kind of like a Greinke type. I'm okay going with a 6 man rotation for as long as we have to knowing that we're going to have injuries. But not a convo for this thread... we have the arms, somewhat reliable depth in Davis Martin, etc. Bullpen is better. I really like the defense up the middle for the Cubs, though a healthy Robert and a strong arm Romy isn't awful. In general the Cubs have a pretty solid team. No giant holes & have some depth in the infield to work through injuries. Outfield as well. Speaking of  Greinke type - think the Cubs are likely done, but they could really use an extra arm, but think they also want to give some of their younger guys a look. Both teams read to me like a 83-93 win type teams in any perfect or worst case scenario. For this year alone I'd take the Sox at an equal payroll due to the upside of our pitching staff, especially at the top. If we were ever to lock in for a playoff series and have a fully firing staff of Cease, Lynn, Giolito, Kopech and Clevinger? That's a HUGE advantage and the type of staff that still gives you hope of a WS. Everything else? I give a slight edge to the Cubs. I'll go Sox 89 wins, Cubs 86

For mid-term - aka next two years? I'd have to say the flexibility the Cubs have given themselves + upside of adding payroll compared to the Sox? They also have some decent depth in the minors. They have the ability to make a meaningful splash and we obviously will not do that. Some of their guys are going to switch hands, but by 2025 i dont see how the cubs aren't better. 

Long term - if there's any consolation Hahn did pull off good return on some of his past trades Cease/Eloy, Moncada/Kopech, Gio/Lopez, Dunning/Lynn. I just don't get the sense he's fully in charge or has the ability to pull the trigger when he wants. This next go-round has to be meticulously managed for optimal outcome. we have a weak farm system, expiring contracts, and still have to balance that against going for it & keeping a payroll that is tier 2/3 in the MLB. Smart move is picking and choosing who you realistically can extend and who gives you the immediate value v the trade value. A guy like Giolito is this year's case. Next year it's Lynn and Hendriks. I have to give the nod long term to the Cubs. They have an entire ecosystem, neighborhood revenue, and open checkbook. Hahn will have to be masterful to pull it off and his track record is anything but that. He's a C+ to be B- GM under his circumstances. Can pass the smell test, but is mediocre.  

 

[35thstreetswarm]

The Cubs "did more" than the Sox in the 2023 offseason.  They "did more" than the Astros, too.  The thing is, the Cubs still stink.  So who cares?

[pcq]

On 1/16/2023 at 8:29 AM, AJ'S Cousin said:

just something to post, a comparison mostly about the front office’s and what they accomplished 

 

The Cubs basically redesigned there entire roster, they definitely needed more than the Sox but in my opinion they outdid the the Sox

Cubs — Swanson , Bellinger, Taillon, Barnhart, Hosmer, Mancini, plus many minor adjustments. 

Sox— Clevenger, Benintendi, Hamilton, some minor adjustments 

Cubs up the middle now —  SS Swanson, 2nd Horner/ Madrigal CF Bellinger  C Gomes/Barnhart 

Sox up the middle now — SS  Anderson, 2nd  ????? , CF  Robert, C  Grandal/Zavala

Corner infielders    

Cubs—- 1st Base/DH Hosmer, Mancini, Wisdom 3rd Baseman Wisdom 

Sox — 1st Base/DH  Vaughn , Sheets, Jimenez  3rd Baseman Moncada, Burger 

Corner Outfielders 

Cubs —- Left  Happ Right Suzuki

Sox —- Left Benintendi  Right Colas 

Starting Pitching and Bullpen too much to list but I’ll give the Sox the edge even without Hendriks 

Bench is up to interpretation.

Sox —- Garcia, Hamilton Sosa, Gonzalez, currently the  2nd Baseman will come from this crew 3rd Base, Burger 

Cubs—- Madrigal, Hosmer Mancini Morel  and others to be determined 

The Sox currently have 6 starters, Gio, Lynn  Cease, Kopech, Clevinger, and Alternate if a pitcher goes down, Martin 

Bullpen still solid even with Hendriks out for an extended period ( I think the Sox knew he had cancer and did the right thing and not traded him) , that would of looked shady if they traded him. Kelly could be used in a trade to clear some payroll   Burger and Sheets are trade chips to help get a legit everyday 2nd baseman.

Benintendi was a good move, would have been nice to get Conforto to give Colas more experience 

Gleyber Torres or Madrigal trade possible? 
 

Cubs spent more, made many more moves. Taking a chance on Bellinger for 1 year at 17 million in that hitters park a good move, will Suzuki  be what he’s supposed to be? Will they trade Madrigal to the Sox or anyone? Mancini and Hosmer could alternatives at DH/1st Base. 
 

Sox gambling on Clevinger for 1 year at 13 million, might work out, more of an insurance policy if Kopech isn’t ready

Can the Sox still get a legit full time 2nd baseman still? Doubt it, Torres and Madrigal seem to be the only ones still out there worth it . 

The Cub front office was much more aggressive with low risk 1 and 2 year contracts   Sox afraid to spend and risk trading Sheets, Burger, Colas etc  

this is a discussion to have fun with, things could still change  HOPEFULLY  Not sold on the current makeup of the team  VERY WEAK BENCH 

 

Why??

[Quin]

Wait, I just noticed this in the OP:

Quote

Can the Sox still get a legit full time 2nd baseman still? Doubt it, Torres and Madrigal seem to be the only ones still out there worth it . 

Madrigal is straight trash.

[LittleHurtCG]

17 minutes ago, Quin said:

Wait, I just noticed this in the OP:

Madrigal is straight trash.

Straight trash that this brillant front office used a top 5 pick on lol. Epic fail there. You never ever use a top 5 pick on a college player who can barely clear the fence during BP.