Andrus to the Sox, expected to play 2B, 1 yr, $3 mil

[chw42]

57 minutes ago, wegner said:

Your 2023 Chicago White Sox....It is what it is.

Sums up my feelings about this team perfectly 

[Nc bobblehead]

I think each person’s wishes for this years team equals how most will feel about this move. If you are hoping they would spend everything in “their” budget to make a fringe run at the playoffs, this is a solid move. If you want to build for a World Series run a few years from now, this is blocking young guys getting reps and in theory spending future payroll.

I lean more towards needing to rebuild but not with the current management which makes almost any move they make a negative. With that said I will always pull for them to win and hope this works out.

[CWSpalehoseCWS]

7 minutes ago, ChiliIrishHammock24 said:

What else should they have spent that $3M on during Spring Training? Or should they have not spent anymore at all?

 

Also you said he's going to be a below average hitter out of the #9 hole.....

The average #9 hitter last season hit .226 with a 81 wRC+. Andrus only one time in his career (29 games in 2020) ever hit below .226, and is a career .270 hitter with career 86 wRC+. 

For a #9 hitter, he will be just fine, and that is ignoring all the positives he brings on the bases, on defense, and in the clubhouse. This isn't an exciting move, but it's a pretty easily a positive one.

Apologies for posting this again in the same thread, but if you want to use wRC+ to evaluate a 9-Hole hitter's value, then you either missed this or chose to ignore it. Player A is Andrus. Player B is Leury Legend. Your eyes aren't deceiving you. Garcia has been the better, more productive player since 2017 using specifically that metric. It also shows that Andrus is actually below average in that department. If he was that highly sought after, he wouldn't have still been looking for a job at this point in the year. Even the Red Sox chose Yu Chang for $800K over Andrus with Story going down with injury.

This isn't a case that Garcia should be starter, just proving that Andrus isn't any better than what currently is on the team (unless you truly value his potential clubhouse leadership at $3M). I liked Andrus when he was picked up last year, and he was a fun player to root for during a s%*# season, but people need to take off the rose colored glasses that those 181 AB's should not be the expectation for a 34 yr old whose about to learn how to play 2B for the first time. 

There's $5.5M tied into Garcia (this year) and now $3M in addition with Andrus - both of whom are essentially the same player with the bat. Imagine if they took that $8.5 and combined it with Clevinger's salary and what they may have been able to add to the team. It's just another classic Sox misuse of limited funds.

FWIW, I believe some combination of Romy and Sosa could have match both of these player levels of production for this season. They both have far more potential than some sort of Garcia/Andrus combo.

[wegner]

18 minutes ago, chw42 said:

Sums up my feelings about this team perfectly 

Let's hope they pleasantly surprise us.

[greg775]

He's one of the few Sox I rooted for at the end of last season. Seemed like he hustled and tried and hit OK.

[caulfield12]

"Seemed like he hustled and tried and hit OK."

 

Send to Brooks Boyer and the White Sox marketing team for their 2023 tagline.

[BigHurt3515]

In reality it is probably the best option at 2B that was available for Jerry's cheap budget. If he can do anything similar to what he did last year he will be a great 8-9 hitter in this lineup

[brijames1957]

Anyone who is upset with this move is just mad at the world and will never be happy. There is no downside to this. He is an above average glove and has some pop in his bat and can also play short. Also a good clubhouse guy. 

[Balta1701]

4 hours ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

At the end of 2022, Elvis Andrus said two things: He was willing to come back and play 2B, and had found something in his swing that had been missing since fracturing his elbow in 2018.

For those who didn’t look at this, Elvis Andrus’s 2022 White Sox stint was the flukiest thing I’ve seen in stats recently. When he joined the White Sox, his exit velocity went down, his ground ball rate went up, his strikeout rate didn’t change, his walk rate dropped dramatically, his launch angle went down, but suddenly his home run rate went up to 20% of his fly balls, which would have been among the top HR hitters in baseball and which is totally unsustainable for a guy with a 6.7% career mark on that. This was statistical payback for Cesar Hernandez, who they acquired after he had a huge HR/FB rate and they were astonished that it went back to normal when he came to the Sox. If the mechanical fix helped him hit more weak ground balls, then it was almost successful except for a few fly balls that went over the fence.

Giving a guy a starting job after a fluke HR/FB season is a Hahn move to the letter. It’s why they acquired Hernandez. It’s exactly what they did with Kimbrel. Can’t ever look past the first row on the MLB.com stats, that’s nerd territory. 

If anyone wants to bet me that he will have 500 plate appearances and a HR/FB rate over 15% this year, let me know what the terms are. That’d be a big drop from last years Sox performance. Go for it.

[AJ'S Cousin]

In various postings I said why not sign Andrus? I’d rather have him out there every day than Garcia, who would be out there 80% of the time if the rookies failed. It’s a one year deal and if he sucks, he could be cut by the all star break and the cost would only be 1.5million. Now if Sosa or Gonzalez get a chance in Spring training to shine and one of them does, than you can trade Garcia for pitching machine or an extra massage table. Is here a better fit than Harrison? Maybe, although Harrison had a semi decent 2nd half and is a real 2nd Baseman. It’s easier to go from SS to 2nd then the reverse. We’re not going anywhere this year anyway so WTF, Lets see what happens. I’m more pissed about the Clevinger than this signing. Sosa and Gonzalez could be better off with 500 at bats in triple A/double A for a September call up. I’m 70% in favor of the move. Garcia has to go if we find a team stupid enough to take his contract. 

Edited February 20, 2023 by AJ'S Cousin

[Dominikk85]

I think andrus is a decent signing, he isn't great but is projected for around a 90 wrc+ and like 1.5 war, for a 9 hitter that is fine.

When healthy the sox have a decent core of hitters, they just need to avoid that black hole situation in the bottom of the lineup where they are forced to play a 70 wrc+, negative war player like EE, mazara and others in the last couple years because a -1 war player basically turns a 4 war player in the middle of the lineup into an average player (4+(-1)= 3 which means the two players average at 1.5 war while if you get a 1.5 war or even just 1.2 war player you come out at like 2.7 war per spot between the two).

Edited February 20, 2023 by Dominikk85

[tray]

Andrus looked like he found something in his game last year. Part of that was his will to win....his attitude as well as his performance in clutch situations. Fans who watch the games saw the same thing. He is another player like Anderson or Eloy that can rally their team with one play or one clutch at-bat. Welcome back Andrus.

[bmags]

7 hours ago, ChiliIrishHammock24 said:

We WISH we were only committed to just $3M for Leury, which again reinforces how much of a steal this is at just $3M. I wouldn't have loved bringing back Andrus for the $10M or so I honestly thought he would have gotten with a starting SS gig, but $3M to be our 2B with his secondary benefit being a legitimate backup plan for TA? This is great.

if we compare every deal to leury garcia, every deal is going to seem great. But at some point this team needs to start compare its decision making to successful teams.

I'd just love a compilation of every 3rd/4th contract veteran signed in late feb/march for low amounts that this board says at that amount is a great deal, only to despise at the end of the year that we relied on a thirty-something year old player for so much playing time when we were in a competitive window.

[vilehoopster]

5 hours ago, brijames1957 said:

Anyone who is upset with this move is just mad at the world and will never be happy. There is no downside to this. He is an above average glove and has some pop in his bat and can also play short. Also a good clubhouse guy. 

I agree with this guy 100%. That people are bitching about is move shows that no matter what is done, people are gonna turn it this way or that to b**** about management and Hahn. Over half the people complaining here are the ones who were complaining about lack of depth and what’s  the fallback if the rookie 2nd basemen don’t work out.

I come here for information and be among my fellow Sox fans, but really, sometimes this board is a total drag. 

Please God, let’s start playing baseball soon.
 

 

[joejoesox]

not a serious franchise 

[Y2Jimmy0]

5 hours ago, Balta1701 said:

For those who didn’t look at this, Elvis Andrus’s 2022 White Sox stint was the flukiest thing I’ve seen in stats recently. When he joined the White Sox, his exit velocity went down, his ground ball rate went up, his strikeout rate didn’t change, his walk rate dropped dramatically, his launch angle went down, but suddenly his home run rate went up to 20% of his fly balls, which would have been among the top HR hitters in baseball and which is totally unsustainable for a guy with a 6.7% career mark on that. This was statistical payback for Cesar Hernandez, who they acquired after he had a huge HR/FB rate and they were astonished that it went back to normal when he came to the Sox. If the mechanical fix helped him hit more weak ground balls, then it was almost successful except for a few fly balls that went over the fence.

Giving a guy a starting job after a fluke HR/FB season is a Hahn move to the letter. It’s why they acquired Hernandez. It’s exactly what they did with Kimbrel. Can’t ever look past the first row on the MLB.com stats, that’s nerd territory. 

If anyone wants to bet me that he will have 500 plate appearances and a HR/FB rate over 15% this year, let me know what the terms are. That’d be a big drop from last years Sox performance. Go for it.

Can he post a 2 WAR season? It would be the first time since 2006 if so. 

[Squirmin' for Yermin]

6 hours ago, brijames1957 said:

Anyone who is upset with this move is just mad at the world and will never be happy. There is no downside to this. He is an above average glove and has some pop in his bat and can also play short. Also a good clubhouse guy. 

The only time Andrus has ever had "pop in his bat" was the month he played with us.  We got lucky lol

[Squirmin' for Yermin]

This seems like such a waste.  we already have a more versatile player in Leury.  Andrus is not good. We just got lucky for 2 months.

[Texsox]

13 hours ago, ChiliIrishHammock24 said:

At only $3M this is an absolute steal. The guy was literally our best position player during the time he was in our team. 

He put up a 2.0 fWAR in only 43 games, which is absurd. Even if he can just do that same production spread out over a full season, it will be the first White Sox 2B to reach 2 WAR since Iguchi in 2005.

 

But it may be rough to repeat that without a hall of fame manager to guide him. 

 

[hogan873]

Absolutely nothing wrong with this signing.  At worst, it adds some depth in case TA goes down with an injury.  At best, we get a guy similar to what we got last season and the 2B hole is filled.  Getting the Andrus of last year for 500+ at-bats is highly unlikely, but the veteran presence, good glove, and added stability make this move solid.

[caulfield12]

19 minutes ago, hogan873 said:

Absolutely nothing wrong with this signing.  At worst, it adds some depth in case TA goes down with an injury.  At best, we get a guy similar to what we got last season and the 2B hole is filled.  Getting the Andrus of last year for 500+ at-bats is highly unlikely, but the veteran presence, good glove, and added stability make this move solid.

Yadier Alonso and Jon Jay say they are willing to add veteran stability and leadership again as well...at a price.

[hogan873]

7 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

Yadier Alonso and Jon Jay say they are willing to add veteran stability and leadership again as well...at a price.

They weren't signed for stability and leadership, and everyone knows that.

[Tnetennba]

21 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

Yadier Alonso and Jon Jay say they are willing to add veteran stability and leadership again as well...at a price.

Yonder

[ChiSoxTrojan]

2 hours ago, vilehoopster said:

I agree with this guy 100%. That people are bitching about is move shows that no matter what is done, people are gonna turn it this way or that to b**** about management and Hahn. Over half the people complaining here are the ones who were complaining about lack of depth and what’s  the fallback if the rookie 2nd basemen don’t work out.

I come here for information and be among my fellow Sox fans, but really, sometimes this board is a total drag. 

Please God, let’s start playing baseball soon.
 

 

The people who are bitching about the move are the ones that think Romy or Sosa could hit just as well as Andrus, with probably more upside. Count me in that group - especially Sosa I was hoping would get a chance to break out, and now he's really blocked. However, I'm rationalizing it as still a good move (at least better than nothing), for the following reasons:

• It raises the floor significantly, as we don't risk dealing with a month or two of a rookie struggling to acclimate to MLB pitching
• He should be better defensively than any of the other options, despite never playing the position before it shouldn't be a hard transition
• Provides middle infield depth, which was essentially non-existent before
• Gives Sosa some more time to develop at AAA and prove last year wasn't a fluke
• It's dirt cheap. At $3M, if Andrus struggles, the Sox can phase him out or cut him by mid-season if Romy or Sosa looks like they could do better.
• I've been thinking that 4th OF is a more important position to fill, but with this move it frees up Romy to maybe take that role? If they keep both Leury and Romy, then between the two of them that's enough roster depth to cover the infield and outfield. CF is the thinnest spot, but Colas, Leury, and even Benintendi are options there.

[ChiSox59]

6 hours ago, Balta1701 said:

Giving a guy a starting job after a fluke HR/FB season is a Hahn move to the letter. It’s why they acquired Hernandez. It’s exactly what they did with Kimbrel. Can’t ever look past the first row on the MLB.com stats, that’s nerd territory. 

If anyone wants to bet me that he will have 500 plate appearances and a HR/FB rate over 15% this year, let me know what the terms are. That’d be a big drop from last years Sox performance. Go for it.

Where did anyone with the White Sox state that they're "giving" Andrus the 2nd base job?  He's obviously the most qualified person on the roster, but just because they signed him does not mean that Romy or Sosa cannot earn the job in ST, or throughout the season.  

You're usually a big depth guy, so surprised to see you make this take other than it being the negative one towards the Sox.  Its the exact type of move you'd be pounding the table about all season "Who could have possibly thought that Romy would be bad and hurt, and Sosa would be completely overwhelmed by major league RHP!?! Dumb White Sox!!" 

Seriously though, if Sox didn't sign Elvis, Romy earned the job and had like a 60 wRC+ thru May, and Sosa wasn't performing super well in Charlotte, then what?  Play Leury more?  Wouldn't you rather have a guy like Elvis around to backstop that?  At least he'll play good defense, and is an intelligent baseball player.   Elvis obviously is not going to re-create his 3 week run of excellence with the Sox in 2023, but he's also very likely an improvement on the other options they have.  Its not like $3M is a lot of money or stopping the Sox from signing better players at this point, because there aren't any available.