2023-24 NFL Season Thread

[Chicago White Sox]

Super disappointing start to free agency.  Not addressing the O-Line or D-Line is highly concerning given some of the options at Center & EDGE.  Still quite a few WRs available, but don’t love any of them all that much outside of Ridley.  Hopefully there is something else to come, but I generally hate the “spread the wealth” approach when there is legit impact talent at positions of need.

[WhiteSox2023]

6 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Super disappointing start to free agency.  Not addressing the O-Line or D-Line is highly concerning given some of the options at Center & EDGE.  Still quite a few WRs available, but don’t love any of them all that much outside of Ridley.  Hopefully there is something else to come, but I generally hate the “spread the wealth” approach when there is legit impact talent at positions of need.

Spreading the money around on mediocre to decent players, rather than going after a whale.

Seems like a Sox offseason so far.  Poles is avoiding the big money positions like OL and DL.  Bates for center and a couple older safeties.  Meh.

Edited March 12 by WhiteSox2023

[CentralChamps21]

4 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Super disappointing start to free agency.  Not addressing the O-Line or D-Line is highly concerning given some of the options at Center & EDGE.  Still quite a few WRs available, but don’t love any of them all that much outside of Ridley.  Hopefully there is something else to come, but I generally hate the “spread the wealth” approach when there is legit impact talent at positions of need.

Everybody needs to go watch the USC-Notre Dame game to see what happens when Caleb Williams' offensive line gets overwhelmed. It wasn't pretty (for him). It's exactly what's going to happen to him in Chicago. Fields will get traded to a team with a good OL and get MVP votes.

[WhiteSox2023]

1 hour ago, CentralChamps21 said:

Everybody needs to go watch the USC-Notre Dame game to see what happens when Caleb Williams' offensive line gets overwhelmed. It wasn't pretty (for him). It's exactly what's going to happen to him in Chicago. Fields will get traded to a team with a good OL and get MVP votes.

Yep, I watched that game.  He needs good protection, like all QB’s and especially rookie QB’s.  He also needs a defense that is better than sucky ass USC’s so he doesn’t have to score 45+ points a game, which he will have with the Bears.

Regarding your Fields comment, you need to get a grip.  If any NFL team thought he was worth a damn, he would’ve been traded already.  Dude can’t throw regardless of protection and all 32 NFL teams realize this, including the Bears.  Until he learns how to read a defense and spot an open target, he’s a RB playing QB.  He’s like a kid playing Madden that only ever throws to the highlighted route and primary target in every play that he chooses.

Edited March 13 by WhiteSox2023

[RTC]

It’s like Poles likes the general idea of having cap space but not actually using it.

Does anyone know if there’s a real time cap space tracker anywhere?  Curious how much they have left because 2 yrs for Hunter, even at $24M per, is not crazy. (specifically the 2 yr part)

Edited March 12 by RTC

[chw42]

6 minutes ago, CentralChamps21 said:

Everybody needs to go watch the USC-Notre Dame game to see what happens when Caleb Williams' offensive line gets overwhelmed. It wasn't pretty (for him). It's exactly what's going to happen to him in Chicago. Fields will get traded to a team with a good OL and get MVP votes.

Fields isn't even guaranteed a starting role next year. The fact that teams are signing backups before he's traded should tell you all you need to know.

[chw42]

Hunter apparently gave Houston a discount. But money always talks. Poles could have guaranteed more money. I guess he's saving it for Armstead or Mack when he eventually gets cut?

Being frugal doesn't make a ton of sense honestly. They spent almost $20 million a year on Edmunds last year, an off-ball linebacker, while not addressing center or the pass rush. Poles might be saying one thing but his actions really haven't shown that he's adamant about building the team in the trenches.

[Chicago White Sox]

10 minutes ago, CentralChamps21 said:

Everybody needs to go watch the USC-Notre Dame game to see what happens when Caleb Williams' offensive line gets overwhelmed. It wasn't pretty (for him). It's exactly what's going to happen to him in Chicago. Fields will get traded to a team with a good OL and get MVP votes.

No one wants Fields though, so I wouldn’t worry about him too much.  But it would be nice to beef up the line somewhere and yes I’m aware we traded for Bates.  Banking on the draft to provide that depth is risky with so few picks at the moment and a massive hole at WR and still real on the D-Line.

[CentralChamps21]

1 minute ago, Chicago White Sox said:

No one wants Fields though, so I wouldn’t worry about him too much.  But it would be nice to beef up the line somewhere and yes I’m aware we traded for Bates.  Banking on the draft to provide that depth is risky with so few picks at the moment and a massive hole at WR and still real on the D-Line.

This is a deep WR draft. Can get a good guy in the 3rd round. 9th pick can go to OL or DL but gonna need a big time FA for the other.

[Chicago White Sox]

1 minute ago, chw42 said:

Hunter apparently gave Houston a discount. But money always talks. Poles could have guaranteed more money. I guess he's saving it for Armstead or Mack when he eventually gets cut?

Being frugal doesn't make a ton of sense honestly. They spent almost $20 million a year on Edmunds last year, an off-ball linebacker, while not addressing center or the pass rush. Poles might be saying one thing but his actions really haven't shown that he's adamant about building the team in the trenches.

The only thing I can think of is Poles is pursuing Ridley and then feels he can trade down at 1.09 and land both an EDGE and more picks.  That probably allows you to add WR #3 in the 3rd and more depth later.  But I don’t actually believe Poles will sign Ridley and more likely signs a Reynolds type at WR to be the WR #3.

[Chicago White Sox]

2 minutes ago, CentralChamps21 said:

This is a deep WR draft. Can get a good guy in the 3rd round. 9th pick can go to OL or DL but gonna need a big time FA for the other.

Unlikely to get a WR #2 in the 3rd, at least not one who can provide that type of production right away.

[LittleHurtCG]

16 minutes ago, chw42 said:

Hunter apparently gave Houston a discount. But money always talks. Poles could have guaranteed more money. I guess he's saving it for Armstead or Mack when he eventually gets cut?

Being frugal doesn't make a ton of sense honestly. They spent almost $20 million a year on Edmunds last year, an off-ball linebacker, while not addressing center or the pass rush. Poles might be saying one thing but his actions really haven't shown that he's adamant about building the team in the trenches.

I'm starting to think that Ryan Poles may be in over his head as a general manager in the national football league. Still time to change that narrative but this offseason and the current Fields situation points to a dude that is GMing scared. 

Getting the number #1 pick two years in a row is a feather in his cap, but there was also a ton of luck involved in that. 

[Tony]

8 minutes ago, LittleHurtCG said:

I'm starting to think that Ryan Poles may be in over his head as a general manager in the national football league. Still time to change that narrative but this offseason and the current Fields situation points to a dude that is GMing scared. 

Getting the number #1 pick two years in a row is a feather in his cap, but there was also a ton of luck involved in that. 

There is also much more to it than that. The package he got from Carolina at that current moment was franchise altering. Not only securing the No. 1 pick, but securing a true No. 1 is not easy, and he accomplished both, and still ended up with a key piece in Wright. 

Now, with that said, he’s being far too conservative with the cap. He’s shown he’s willing to be aggressive (Claypool comes to mind) but it obviously didn’t work out. It seems like he’s taking the Hoyer approach of “We want this guy but if it becomes a bidding war, we’re sticking to our projections” and sometimes you have to bite the bullet and get your guy. You can always screw with the cap and kick the can down the road if you really need to. 

[WhiteSox2023]

6 minutes ago, Tony said:

There is also much more to it than that. The package he got from Carolina at that current moment was franchise altering. Not only securing the No. 1 pick, but securing a true No. 1 is not easy, and he accomplished both, and still ended up with a key piece in Wright. 

Now, with that said, he’s being far too conservative with the cap. He’s shown he’s willing to be aggressive (Claypool comes to mind) but it obviously didn’t work out. It seems like he’s taking the Hoyer approach of “We want this guy but if it becomes a bidding war, we’re sticking to our projections” and sometimes you have to bite the bullet and get your guy. You can always screw with the cap and kick the can down the road if you really need to. 

Good points.  Last year’s draft pick trade was great but you could also say he’s basically thrown away a 2nd (Claypool) and perhaps a 5th round pick (Bates), if the Bills were going to cut Bates anyways, which appears likely.  He’s definitely not perfect.

Edited March 12 by WhiteSox2023

[WhiteSox2023]

Mahomes just cleared $21.6 million in cap space for the Chiefs.

 

[WhiteSox2023]

 

[chw42]

8 minutes ago, Tony said:

There is also much more to it than that. The package he got from Carolina at that current moment was franchise altering. Not only securing the No. 1 pick, but securing a true No. 1 is not easy, and he accomplished both, and still ended up with a key piece in Wright. 

Now, with that said, he’s being far too conservative with the cap. He’s shown he’s willing to be aggressive (Claypool comes to mind) but it obviously didn’t work out. It seems like he’s taking the Hoyer approach of “We want this guy but if it becomes a bidding war, we’re sticking to our projections” and sometimes you have to bite the bullet and get your guy. You can always screw with the cap and kick the can down the road if you really need to. 

They made Johnson's cap hit only $13 million this year. If they weren't going to use all of their cap space what was the point of that? It seems like to me that they did have aspirations to sign guys and simply said "welp too bad" when they got outbid.

I still go back to the Edmunds signing last year as an example that the Bears will overpay. It just irks me that they overpaid a middle linebacker when they had so many other more important holes to fill. It's like Rick Hahn spending big money on the bullpen. What made that signing worse was that Edmunds wasn't even that good.

[WhiteSox2023]

2 minutes ago, chw42 said:

They made Johnson's cap hit only $13 million this year. If they weren't going to use all of their cap space what was the point of that? It seems like to me that they did have aspirations to sign guys and simply said "welp too bad" when they got outbid.

I still go back to the Edmunds signing last year as an example that the Bears will overpay. It just irks me that they overpaid a middle linebacker when they had so many other more important holes to fill. It's like Rick Hahn spending big money on the bullpen. What made that signing worse was that Edmunds wasn't even that good.

It’s a Chicago tradition.  If you miss out on Machado and Harper, you just bank the money.

[chw42]

Just now, WhiteSox2023 said:

It’s a Chicago tradition.  If you miss out on Machado and Harper, you just bank the money.

That would the the dumbest thing to do in a league with a hard cap and a spending floor.

[Milkman delivers]

10 hours ago, LittleHurtCG said:

According to Ian Rappaport, the Bears haven't even put Justin Fields on the trade market. Is there a chance that Poles and company trade out of the #1 slot again and bring Justin back? Or maybe they give Fields another elite weapon and take Harrison Jr 1.1? 

Sure, if they’re idiots.

[Chisoxfn]

3 hours ago, Tony said:

There is also much more to it than that. The package he got from Carolina at that current moment was franchise altering. Not only securing the No. 1 pick, but securing a true No. 1 is not easy, and he accomplished both, and still ended up with a key piece in Wright. 

Now, with that said, he’s being far too conservative with the cap. He’s shown he’s willing to be aggressive (Claypool comes to mind) but it obviously didn’t work out. It seems like he’s taking the Hoyer approach of “We want this guy but if it becomes a bidding war, we’re sticking to our projections” and sometimes you have to bite the bullet and get your guy. You can always screw with the cap and kick the can down the road if you really need to. 

It’s not like Bears are a Super Bowl team next year so in some ways patience is fine. Making a bad deal and blowing 25M in long term cap space can be a disaster. 
 

I do think Hunter should have been a no brainer - short term cap space usage for an elite player - even if he is a bit old. 
 

I wonder if they will be interested in Bosa or Mack if they get cut? Or heck maybe some creative trade of Fields to Chargers as a back up and somehow make a cap friendly play for Bosa and Mike Williams (I think Bears get a benefit if you trade for them). 

[Chisoxfn]

2 hours ago, chw42 said:

That would the the dumbest thing to do in a league with a hard cap and a spending floor.

The cap can be rolled forward. 

[Tony]

53 minutes ago, Chisoxfn said:

It’s not like Bears are a Super Bowl team next year so in some ways patience is fine. Making a bad deal and blowing 25M in long term cap space can be a disaster. 
 

I do think Hunter should have been a no brainer - short term cap space usage for an elite player - even if he is a bit old. 
 

I wonder if they will be interested in Bosa or Mack if they get cut? Or heck maybe some creative trade of Fields to Chargers as a back up and somehow make a cap friendly play for Bosa and Mike Williams (I think Bears get a benefit if you trade for them). 

If they don’t make the playoffs this upcoming season, it was a failed year. I don’t expect them to win the SB, but they won 7 games and blew three losses where they had a +90% win expectancy in the 2nd half of those games. We’ve obviously seen you can win with a rookie QB, so it’s go time now. “Rebuilding” is over 

[Chisoxfn]

47 minutes ago, Tony said:

If they don’t make the playoffs this upcoming season, it was a failed year. I don’t expect them to win the SB, but they won 7 games and blew three losses where they had a +90% win expectancy in the 2nd half of those games. We’ve obviously seen you can win with a rookie QB, so it’s go time now. “Rebuilding” is over 

I don’t think you can state that. There have been very very few teams led by a rookie qb to ever make the playoffs. So no I don’t think not making the playoffs would be a failure. I think building a real offense and seeing real progress and lots of upside from Caleb and the offense will be important and continued growth in defense will also be key - but no this isn’t the year to put all your chips in just yet.  Now I do think this is the type of team that if Caleb can get to that high level by year 2 than you are talking about getting to high high aspirations quickly. 
 

It has happened only 14 times and that counts Brock Purdy (who didn’t exactly lead the team all season) in NFL history. A few more are guys like Field Yates and Aaron Brooks who again got into playoffs but didn’t lead the team to playoffs.

 

Stroud 

Big Ben 

Russel Wilson

Shaun King (benefited from historically great defenses)

Joe Flacco (some damn good defenses)

Mark Sanchez (amazing how went to 2 AFC conference games before totally being a bust)

Aaron Brooks (3-2 in regular season)

Field Yates - I believe he relieved for an injured Matt Schaub) 

 

Above are recent examples. 

[Chisoxfn]

50 minutes ago, Tony said:

If they don’t make the playoffs this upcoming season, it was a failed year. I don’t expect them to win the SB, but they won 7 games and blew three losses where they had a +90% win expectancy in the 2nd half of those games. We’ve obviously seen you can win with a rookie QB, so it’s go time now. “Rebuilding” is over 

Now being cheap on oline and wideout when you need to develop Caleb that would be stupid - but they don’t need to blow it all on some stud defensive player just yet - they can still be patient. 
 

But I will be livid if they hand Caleb some crap wide receiver corps. Go sign Samuel or Ridley plus wait around and draft one and than either draft one more or sign one of the vets who is caught waiting longer than expected.