2023-24 NFL Season Thread

[bmags]

11 minutes ago, Kyyle23 said:

I mean the defense can definitely be better when it’s missing it’s starting safety, number 1 corner and nickel

I will say that a reminder to myself last night was how little I remembered of the first four games last year.  And I say that just because I was pretty excited about this secondary. And I certainly underrated how young that group is in actual age and experience. But probably the best part about the game last night defensively imo was STroman and Smith. I think in terms of the 5 sacks, Washington is just absolutely the worst oline in the league imo. I still think they looked trash. But the coverage I think can improve with both health and experience.

 

[Kyyle23]

6 minutes ago, bmags said:

I will say that a reminder to myself last night was how little I remembered of the first four games last year.  And I say that just because I was pretty excited about this secondary. And I certainly underrated how young that group is in actual age and experience. But probably the best part about the game last night defensively imo was STroman and Smith. I think in terms of the 5 sacks, Washington is just absolutely the worst oline in the league imo. I still think they looked trash. But the coverage I think can improve with both health and experience.

 

The guys that stepped in last night were total heroes, they really filled the stat sheet

[Chisoxfn]

Claypool is going to a very good situation though.  

[scs787]

3 hours ago, Harry Chappas said:

The Panthers are going to get the 1.1 and the Bears will then have one heck of a decision especially if they are sitting around 1.6.

If Fields continues looking like the guy then the 1.1 haul could be epic but for or against. 

Man... I think I posted just a few days ago that I'd still draft Williams, but if Justin keeps playing like this for 12 more weeks, I think you gottttta stick with him....Again, this assumes 12 more weeks of looking like an MVP candidate.  

 

If they can do Moore type trade again for an impact DLineman that'd be huge....Like replace Moore with Maxx Crosby or something. 

Edited October 6, 2023 by scs787

[chw42]

1 hour ago, CentralChamps21 said:

So has the offense turned a corner or is this just a case of taking advantage of two really bad defenses?

The defense can't be fixed, not with these players. Just not enough talent to stop anybody. Might as well gamble on turnovers and blitz like hell. If it results in long TDs that just gets us the inevitable result faster.

A little of both. Washington's defense is very overrated. Their defensive line has a bunch of high draft picks, but I don't think they play great as a unit. Their defensive backs are really bad, as we saw last night. Denver is Denver. 

The offense looks different. The play calling is different. I think Getsy realized that Fields does not do well on throws down the middle. We saw his hesitation to throw the deep ins the first 2 games. They were wide open and he straight up just did not throw them. So these last 2 games has seen a lot of throws to the sidelines. When you have a young QB who is not good at anticipation throws, the last thing you want him to do is to throw it between 3 zones in the middle of the field. There's also been way more designed runs, which is something that was basically non-existent the first 2 weeks and something you have to make the opposing defense at least prepare for. Lastly, they finally started doing the tush push on 3rd/4th and shorts and it worked every time last night. No more stupid Kmet sneaks. No more runs out of shotgun. The lack of execution on those short yardage situations might have cost the Bears at least a game, so it's good they finally adapted to what the whole league has been doing. 

The thing is that the upcoming schedule has a lot of bad defenses. So there's a chance Fields comes out of this 4 week stretch with some good numbers. 

[bmags]

1 hour ago, scs787 said:

Man... I think I posted just a few days ago that I'd still draft Williams, but if Justin keeps playing like this for 12 more weeks, I think you gottttta stick with him....Again, this assumes 12 more weeks of looking like an MVP candidate.  

 

If they can do Moore type trade again for an impact DLineman that'd be huge....Like replace Moore with Maxx Crosby or something. 

I think my biggest concern with Justin is that when the game starts turning against him (i.e. not that bears are losing, but he's playing bad) that it turns him worse. His mechanics change, he gets even more risk averse and therefore becomes more risky as he telegraphs everything. 

WHen things are rolling, he rolls. 

If we are 1-1, I still think you trade fields. But if he really does keep throwing like the last two games, and showing he can handle zone looks, then you trade that and just load up.

[chw42]

3 minutes ago, bmags said:

I think my biggest concern with Justin is that when the game starts turning against him (i.e. not that bears are losing, but he's playing bad) that it turns him worse. His mechanics change, he gets even more risk averse and therefore becomes more risky as he telegraphs everything. 

WHen things are rolling, he rolls. 

If we are 1-1, I still think you trade fields. But if he really does keep throwing like the last two games, and showing he can handle zone looks, then you trade that and just load up.

Yeah his track record in the 4th quarter and close is not good. When the defense tightens up and the situation takes away things he's comfortable with, he has to be better. 

[Balta1701]

2 minutes ago, bmags said:

I think my biggest concern with Justin is that when the game starts turning against him (i.e. not that bears are losing, but he's playing bad) that it turns him worse. His mechanics change, he gets even more risk averse and therefore becomes more risky as he telegraphs everything. 

WHen things are rolling, he rolls. 

If we are 1-1, I still think you trade fields. But if he really does keep throwing like the last two games, and showing he can handle zone looks, then you trade that and just load up.

This is a lot better than where we were 2 weeks ago, but there's a couple things worth keeping in mind:

1. We have seen Fields put up good numbers the last 2 weeks against teams that aren't particularly strong, both are in the bottom 10 defensively in yards/game, so the games against better defenses in the Saints and Lions later this year will be particularly telling. 

2. The other factor to keep in mind if you have an opportunity to draft Williams with either of those picks is the contract extension. This offseason, Fields will be a free agent in 2 years, so either next year or the following year you are going to have to commit a contract extension to him if you aren't picking up someone else. The Daniel Jones model suggests that the salary for keeping a middling QB on their 2nd deal right now is $40 million a year. If you were to trade that pick and go with Fields based on this performance, you better be confident enough to extend him.

If you're not confident enough to extend him, then trying to trade him to a team that thinks their close (Saints, Bucs, Falcons, apparently the entire NFC South it seems) and pick up a mid or late first round pick looks like the smartest option to me. You continue the rebuild with Williams and you let a team take a 2-3 year attempt to compete with Fields before they fully commit to extending him.

[bmags]

1 minute ago, Balta1701 said:

This is a lot better than where we were 2 weeks ago, but there's a couple things worth keeping in mind:

1. We have seen Fields put up good numbers the last 2 weeks against teams that aren't particularly strong, both are in the bottom 10 defensively in yards/game, so the games against better defenses in the Saints and Lions later this year will be particularly telling. 

2. The other factor to keep in mind if you have an opportunity to draft Williams with either of those picks is the contract extension. This offseason, Fields will be a free agent in 2 years, so either next year or the following year you are going to have to commit a contract extension to him if you aren't picking up someone else. The Daniel Jones model suggests that the salary for keeping a middling QB on their 2nd deal right now is $40 million a year. If you were to trade that pick and go with Fields based on this performance, you better be confident enough to extend him.

If you're not confident enough to extend him, then trying to trade him to a team that thinks their close (Saints, Bucs, Falcons, apparently the entire NFC South it seems) and pick up a mid or late first round pick looks like the smartest option to me. You continue the rebuild with Williams and you let a team take a 2-3 year attempt to compete with Fields before they fully commit to extending him.

Fields has been facing bad defenses, BUT he's also been beating them via the air which is what is interesting. 

[Balta1701]

1 minute ago, bmags said:

Fields has been facing bad defenses, BUT he's also been beating them via the air which is what is interesting. 

I will definitely admit this was a significant improvement and IIRC somewhere in this thread I was begging him to just throw the ball into the area of Moore and let him make a few plays so it's darn nice to see this happening. They have better weapons this year than last year, so he does need to make use of them. He's got to both keep it up and show up against better defenses though, if you want to think about this as a long term option.

[Stinky Stanky]

That last TD throw was in exactly the right place where the defender had no chance to get at the ball.  Pinpoint accuracy or luck?  I'm not sure.  I still have questions about his seeing the field and not showing escapability in the pocket, but this one was sort of fun.  For sure he's shed any reputation as inaccurate.  I'm happy for him, he's a really nice kid.

[chw42]

1 minute ago, Stinky Stanky said:

That last TD throw was in exactly the right place where the defender had no chance to get at the ball.  Pinpoint accuracy or luck?  I'm not sure.  I still have questions about his seeing the field and not showing escapability in the pocket, but this one was sort of fun.  For sure he's shed any reputation as inaccurate.  I'm happy for him, he's a really nice kid.

On first look, I thought it was a bad throw, but at the same time, it was so high the defender had no chance to pick it off. 

Watching QB School's breakdown of the game last night, Fields still struggles with the timing on those hitch/come back routes. He's just slightly late on them because he does this weird stutter step when he already has his back foot in the ground. If he just rips it without that split second hesitation, he wouldn't need Moore to get like 3-4 yards of separation on those routes. Because not every WR can separate like Moore. 

[Kyyle23]

14 minutes ago, chw42 said:

On first look, I thought it was a bad throw, but at the same time, it was so high the defender had no chance to pick it off. 

Watching QB School's breakdown of the game last night, Fields still struggles with the timing on those hitch/come back routes. He's just slightly late on them because he does this weird stutter step when he already has his back foot in the ground. If he just rips it without that split second hesitation, he wouldn't need Moore to get like 3-4 yards of separation on those routes. Because not every WR can separate like Moore. 

I felt like the difference of speed between Moore and Mooney was the reason Mooney and Fields were having issues yesterday

[scs787]

7 hours ago, bmags said:

Fields has been facing bad defenses, BUT he's also been beating them via the air which is what is interesting. 

He has, but he was still fitting balls into tight coverages and putting the ball where it needs to be regardless. He really hasn't really feasting on wide open throws because said teams are bad. 

[lostfan]

10 hours ago, SoxAce said:

Good riddance to that bum. One of the worst Bears WR I've ever seen. Not because of talent, there hasn't many that have come across as talented as Claypool. Not because of not catching the ball consistently because there have been much worse WR that have come across worse than Claypool. But there's not a single receiver past or present that was those things plus lazy, plus gives up on plays, plus was entitled like Claypool was. 

Dude is built like Randy Moss, but stronger, and plays like he is built like Simone Biles (Simone would play with more heart though, I'm certain). Biggest p**** I've ever seen in a Bears uniform. He is down there with Anthony Miller for Bears players I hate most.

[lostfan]

7 hours ago, Stinky Stanky said:

That last TD throw was in exactly the right place where the defender had no chance to get at the ball.  Pinpoint accuracy or luck?  I'm not sure.  I still have questions about his seeing the field and not showing escapability in the pocket, but this one was sort of fun.  For sure he's shed any reputation as inaccurate.  I'm happy for him, he's a really nice kid.

He's always been accurate and he's always had great ball placement, that's never been the issue with him (except that throw on the run to Herbert last night that was so bad he broke Herbert, but that was an anomaly. 3 yards to the left and that's a huge gain and probably a TD). WHEN he's able to identify the throw, he'll let it rip and the throw is money. He just hasn't always been able to see those throws in time or know what specifically to do on a play.

It's just a relief to see that Fields, at least for now, is not actually dead in the water, and does have NFL talent.

[Chisoxfn]

3 hours ago, lostfan said:

He's always been accurate and he's always had great ball placement, that's never been the issue with him (except that throw on the run to Herbert last night that was so bad he broke Herbert, but that was an anomaly. 3 yards to the left and that's a huge gain and probably a TD). WHEN he's able to identify the throw, he'll let it rip and the throw is money. He just hasn't always been able to see those throws in time or know what specifically to do on a play.

It's just a relief to see that Fields, at least for now, is not actually dead in the water, and does have NFL talent.

Well said. 

[SoxAce]

What a rant

[Stinky Stanky]

16 hours ago, lostfan said:

He's always been accurate and he's always had great ball placement, that's never been the issue with him (except that throw on the run to Herbert last night that was so bad he broke Herbert, but that was an anomaly. 3 yards to the left and that's a huge gain and probably a TD). WHEN he's able to identify the throw, he'll let it rip and the throw is money. He just hasn't always been able to see those throws in time or know what specifically to do on a play.

It's just a relief to see that Fields, at least for now, is not actually dead in the water, and does have NFL talent.

All very true except that I recall some overthrowing receivers \n Year 1.

[Soxfest]

Cesspool won’t last long in Miami 

[The Beast]

Has anyone seen Caleb Williams play? I am watching him for the first time and don’t see why the Bears should draft him and get rid of Fields aside from resetting the contract clock. Not sure what Williams does that Fields can’t do.

Edited October 8, 2023 by The Beast

[Chisoxfn]

2 hours ago, The Beast said:

Has anyone seen Caleb Williams play? I am watching him for the first time and don’t see why the Bears should draft him and get rid of Fields aside from resetting the contract clock. Not sure what Williams does that Fields can’t do.

This is probably his worse game and he is still making plays. Dude is incredible. If Bears have #1 pick - they have to take him unless Fields is literally averaging 275+ and 3TD per game. Williams is ridiculous. 

[lostfan]

The amount of smoke a QB gets for shitting the bed the way Lamar Jackson just did depends largely on which QB it is, and whether they've reached certain artificial benchmarks in past seasons. Lamar isn't solely responsible for that loss and I'm just using him as an example. There's usually some other thing from earlier in the game someone *else* was responsible for (Zay Flowers catches a wide open pass instead of falling down) that would've made the later mistakes irrelevant but whether people choose to acknowledge this happened depends on the vibes.

When Mahomes threw a pick-6 in the first week almost everyone watching it understood he made a throw on the money and Toney tipped it right at the DB, and said so in the commentary after the game. But if it had been Daniel Jones, Kirk Cousins, or even Dak Prescott doing the exact same thing? It'd just be a bunch of jokes and mocking.

[caulfield12]

On 10/6/2023 at 11:54 PM, SoxAce said:

Good riddance to that bum. One of the worst Bears WR I've ever seen. Not because of talent, there hasn't many that have come across as talented as Claypool. Not because of not catching the ball consistently because there have been much worse WR that have come across worse than Claypool. But there's not a single receiver past or present that was those things plus lazy, plus gives up on plays, plus was entitled like Claypool was. 

Those that don't or can't fit in with Tomlin...usually they're pretty strong judges of character over there.

[CentralChamps21]

Man the 49ers are good. I'd make them the favorites to win it all right now. Shows you that if you have a really good OL and skill players, you don't need a superstar QB to win.

Bears need to stop worrying about Fields and very aggressively target OL and WR upgrades (plus the defense).