2023-24 NFL Season Thread

[bmags]

We can’t draft a qb because we need a halfback

[Boopa1219]

9 hours ago, The Beast said:

This is where I am at but the QB. There are so many holes on this team that I can’t justify drafting another one high when Fields is around. I may not be a Williams fan yet, but even if Fields holds the ball long enough, I see so many positions that need more, like OL, DE, FS, WR and HB. I thought Poles was going to build the line out and have a team that would win at the trenches. I haven’t seen that yet.

I couldn't agree more. 

If they don't build out the trenches and add some weapons, the next QB they bring in will suffer the same fate as Fields. I am also shocked that Pace has really ignored the trenches on both sides of the ball, especially with him being a former OL.

[Dick Allen]

Fields dislocated his thumb.

[caulfield12]

What is the recovery time like? Louis offers this advice: “The predicted recovery time after a finger or thumb dislocation is three to six months(Healing time for this injury is about six weeks, however, it can take several months for symptoms to settle and to regain function)

[SoxAce]

40 minutes ago, Boopa1219 said:

I am also shocked that Pace has really ignored the trenches on both sides of the ball, especially with him being a former OL.

 

Pace? no. Poles? yes.

[bmags]

I don't think there is any one road to making the right QB decision.

Sitting QBs is sure route to success! Except we'd have way more examples of QBs who slowly developed on the bench and not just Geno Smith. Right? If Mahomes is mahomes because he wasn't thrown into the fire, there are bunches of QBs every year that enter the bench-mode. Surely more would turn out to be viable?

It's all situation! Well let's let Trey Lance be the forever blaring warning sign that it is NOT all situation. The guy had the best situation in the world, had all the talent in the world, and yet it is still a high likelihood that this position is so hard that you can still be a complete nothing.

Let's also gander at the Atlanta Falcons. They built up their offense. They now have a great offensive line. They invested in top ten TEs and WRs and RB. They build up their Oline. They have an offensive-minded head coach who has pulled efficient offenses out of poor QB play.

And yet they timed it to have Desmond Ridder, who had time to sizzle on the bench, took him 3rd round instead of a first round QB, and is terrible. So they are all likely to get fired he is so bad and they spent so many years ignoring QB to build up the rest of the infrastructure.

The STL rams made everyones favorite trade. They ignored the stupid idea to take a high QB and got a ton of picks. And they were miserable for 4 more years until they got a hall of fame coach.

I guess all I'm saying is you don't make a heuristic this early.

Say it's March 15th 2024 and you'll have: Fired Eberflus and hired Ben Johnson as your new OC. You splurged on Tee Higgins and sign Connor Williams as C from Miami. You get one of the washington edges.

Then it's draft day and you could take Caleb Williams and Fashanu. 

I don't think it's obvious that you pass that up at all. 

 

[T R U]

3 minutes ago, bmags said:

I don't think there is any one road to making the right QB decision.

Sitting QBs is sure route to success! Except we'd have way more examples of QBs who slowly developed on the bench and not just Geno Smith. Right? If Mahomes is mahomes because he wasn't thrown into the fire, there are bunches of QBs every year that enter the bench-mode. Surely more would turn out to be viable?

It's all situation! Well let's let Trey Lance be the forever blaring warning sign that it is NOT all situation. The guy had the best situation in the world, had all the talent in the world, and yet it is still a high likelihood that this position is so hard that you can still be a complete nothing.

Let's also gander at the Atlanta Falcons. They built up their offense. They now have a great offensive line. They invested in top ten TEs and WRs and RB. They build up their Oline. They have an offensive-minded head coach who has pulled efficient offenses out of poor QB play.

And yet they timed it to have Desmond Ridder, who had time to sizzle on the bench, took him 3rd round instead of a first round QB, and is terrible. So they are all likely to get fired he is so bad and they spent so many years ignoring QB to build up the rest of the infrastructure.

The STL rams made everyones favorite trade. They ignored the stupid idea to take a high QB and got a ton of picks. And they were miserable for 4 more years until they got a hall of fame coach.

I guess all I'm saying is you don't make a heuristic this early.

Say it's March 15th 2024 and you'll have: Fired Eberflus and hired Ben Johnson as your new OC. You splurged on Tee Higgins and sign Connor Williams as C from Miami. You get one of the washington edges.

Then it's draft day and you could take Caleb Williams and Fashanu. 

I don't think it's obvious that you pass that up at all. 

 

Atlanta messed up, if you're going to ignore the QB position and draft all these elite skill players then you need to sign a veteran QB type to "Trent Dilfer" your team. You don't draft a 3rd or later round QB and hope they hit. That gives you the time to try and develop those later QB's instead of thrusting them into a contention window.

Their whole division is trash though, so they may still win it anyways but there's no way that's a championship caliber team.

[bmags]

Just now, T R U said:

Atlanta messed up, if you're going to ignore the QB position and draft all these elite skill players then you need to sign a veteran QB type to "Trent Dilfer" your team. You don't draft a 3rd or later round QB and hope they hit. That gives you the time to try and develop those later QB's instead of thrusting them into a contention window.

Their whole division is trash though, so they may still win it anyways but there's no way that's a championship caliber team.

Even then I think they tried to with Mariota. But you can look to Indy as the opposite of that. Ballard survived, but eventually time runs out and it's not easy to decide when to pull the trigger, especially if your scouts are all like "this guy is good we like him".

They obviously could have made other choices. Jimmy G or Darnold or Lance trade, but no matter what people get in this mode of treating even a 3rd round QB with kid gloves where he has to be treated as the leader.

[T R U]

15 minutes ago, bmags said:

Even then I think they tried to with Mariota. But you can look to Indy as the opposite of that. Ballard survived, but eventually time runs out and it's not easy to decide when to pull the trigger, especially if your scouts are all like "this guy is good we like him".

They obviously could have made other choices. Jimmy G or Darnold or Lance trade, but no matter what people get in this mode of treating even a 3rd round QB with kid gloves where he has to be treated as the leader.

Yep, basically you just can't skip out on the QB position.

If you're in a position to take one high in the draft and you need one, you just have to do it.

[Kyyle23]

Eberflus refusing to admit that they benched Whitehair for his inability to snap the ball is just another thing in a series of weird things that Eberflus does 

[Harold's Leg Lift]

They had the #1 pick and the most cap space in the league and somehow managed to get worse.  That's not easy to do. 

[Chisoxfn]

I am really hoping this is a 2-4 week thing for Fields. That way he can sit on the sideline, absorb what he's learned, whats been working and not, and than come back for the final half of the season to hopefully build on the positives from the prior 2 weeks.  If he misses the season - than things get interesting, cause now odds of 2 top 5 picks go through the roof.  

Albeit - outside of the weak arm, I saw a lot to like about Bagent. The problem is - that arm.  Drew Brees made it work but that is 1 in a million.  

[Chisoxfn]

1 hour ago, Kyyle23 said:

Eberflus refusing to admit that they benched Whitehair for his inability to snap the ball is just another thing in a series of weird things that Eberflus does 

I don't really blame him.  You don't need to say to the media - we benched him because he stunk or whatever. Everyone in the lockeroom knows and Whitehair knows.  

[Kyyle23]

Just now, Chisoxfn said:

I don't really blame him.  You don't need to say to the media - we benched him because he stunk or whatever. Everyone in the lockeroom knows and Whitehair knows.  

Disagree when it’s that obvious.  Cody is a big boy and this is a tire fire, time to stop hiding 

[Chisoxfn]

13 hours ago, Tony said:

Absolutely none of the holes you listed mean anything if the Bears don't find their "guy" at QB. 

This. And the Bears can absolutely afford to use one of their top picks on a QB while still using cap space and draft capital to make the rest of the parts better. They have DJ Moore and Kmet. They have some solid running backs and the oline while not good yesterday isn't the dumpster fire it was 2-3 years ago.  Wright will continue to grow - lets see what Jones does, lets see if Jenkins can be healthy (when he is - he is a monster).  Davis actually looked pretty good prior to getting hurt too.  They need a center and potentially a LT (and that is potentially).  

Defensively - the secondary looks to be improving. Jackson is no good, but otherwise a lot of players flashing and growing.  Pass rush needs help. A good QB gets this team better fast and resetting the clock while you continue to stockpile asset (key is drafting well) and this could get better really fast (it may not feel like it, but it could).  Not saying next year fast - cause rookie QB's will struggle in year 1.  

[Chisoxfn]

2 hours ago, bmags said:

I don't think there is any one road to making the right QB decision.

Sitting QBs is sure route to success! Except we'd have way more examples of QBs who slowly developed on the bench and not just Geno Smith. Right? If Mahomes is mahomes because he wasn't thrown into the fire, there are bunches of QBs every year that enter the bench-mode. Surely more would turn out to be viable?

It's all situation! Well let's let Trey Lance be the forever blaring warning sign that it is NOT all situation. The guy had the best situation in the world, had all the talent in the world, and yet it is still a high likelihood that this position is so hard that you can still be a complete nothing.

Let's also gander at the Atlanta Falcons. They built up their offense. They now have a great offensive line. They invested in top ten TEs and WRs and RB. They build up their Oline. They have an offensive-minded head coach who has pulled efficient offenses out of poor QB play.

And yet they timed it to have Desmond Ridder, who had time to sizzle on the bench, took him 3rd round instead of a first round QB, and is terrible. So they are all likely to get fired he is so bad and they spent so many years ignoring QB to build up the rest of the infrastructure.

The STL rams made everyones favorite trade. They ignored the stupid idea to take a high QB and got a ton of picks. And they were miserable for 4 more years until they got a hall of fame coach.

I guess all I'm saying is you don't make a heuristic this early.

Say it's March 15th 2024 and you'll have: Fired Eberflus and hired Ben Johnson as your new OC. You splurged on Tee Higgins and sign Connor Williams as C from Miami. You get one of the washington edges.

Then it's draft day and you could take Caleb Williams and Fashanu. 

I don't think it's obvious that you pass that up at all. 

 

That sounds pretty good to me.  And I like the idea of resetting the clock and paying Higgins a ton, put him with Moore, Scott and draft another wideout (doesn't need to be Marvin Harrison). IF you want - take the stud TE to pair with Kmet.  That is a ton of weapons and you CAN afford it because you have a QB on a rookie deal.  

Take another oline or edge spot, draft or sign a center in FA, spend money on a Dlinemen in FA and use a bunch of other picks. If this year's draft picks show growth, that is the beginnings of a much improved roster and you are putting your young QB in a good spot. And by the way - you can sit the young QB behind Fields for the season too - see if it turns into a Drew Brees / Phillip Rivers situation like San Diego had.

If Fields kicks butt you franchise and trade him (or trade your young QB - I don't care).  

[Balta1701]

20 minutes ago, Chisoxfn said:

That sounds pretty good to me.  And I like the idea of resetting the clock and paying Higgins a ton, put him with Moore, Scott and draft another wideout (doesn't need to be Marvin Harrison). IF you want - take the stud TE to pair with Kmet.  That is a ton of weapons and you CAN afford it because you have a QB on a rookie deal.  

Take another oline or edge spot, draft or sign a center in FA, spend money on a Dlinemen in FA and use a bunch of other picks. If this year's draft picks show growth, that is the beginnings of a much improved roster and you are putting your young QB in a good spot. And by the way - you can sit the young QB behind Fields for the season too - see if it turns into a Drew Brees / Phillip Rivers situation like San Diego had.

If Fields kicks butt you franchise and trade him (or trade your young QB - I don't care).  

IF the Bears are taking Williams, I would take the best draft pick I can get for Fields and be content with it. Depending on his stats for the rest of the season, that could be a 2nd or 3rd round pick. Should be worth a little more than Rosen was at this point, right? 

That's not likely to be there next year, given the way the options and contracts work. 

[Quin]

4 hours ago, bmags said:

We can’t draft a qb because we need a halfback

The phrasing of this sentence reminds me of A&W's Third-of-a-Pound burger: https://www.snopes.com/news/2022/06/17/third-pound-burger-fractions/

Quote

More than half of the people surveyed about why they didn't buy the burger, which cost the same as the Quarter Pounder, said it was because they were being charged the same price for a smaller burger

Anyway, that's my sparse contribution to this thread.

[Dick Allen]

One of those on line injury doctors thinks this is at least a 4 to 6 week injury to Fields.

[pettie4sox]

56 minutes ago, Quin said:

The phrasing of this sentence reminds me of A&W's Third-of-a-Pound burger: https://www.snopes.com/news/2022/06/17/third-pound-burger-fractions/

Anyway, that's my sparse contribution to this thread.

Hahahahah this post spun me bro and people will never cease to amaze you with their ignorance.

Off topic, but the weight of the burgers is always pre-cooked, right?

[Quin]

13 minutes ago, pettie4sox said:

Hahahahah this post spun me bro and people will never cease to amaze you with their ignorance.

Off topic, but the weight of the burgers is always pre-cooked, right?

I mean, it has to be. It'd be so weird to take it off the griddle and place it on the scale.

[Kyyle23]

https://x.com/mdwojak94/status/1713976186341032110?s=20

 

bears hire a defensive intern friend because why bother actually hiring a guy for the open job

[bmags]

1 hour ago, Quin said:

The phrasing of this sentence reminds me of A&W's Third-of-a-Pound burger: https://www.snopes.com/news/2022/06/17/third-pound-burger-fractions/

Anyway, that's my sparse contribution to this thread.

I'm sympathetic because my brain does dumb stuff like that all the time. 

My pancake recipe calls for 2.75 tablespoons of baking powder and the amount of times I'll put in 2 table spoons and 3/4 of a tea spoon is insane. My brain just seamlessly problem solves like " ah, this has 3/4s on it, it's this"

[Quin]

8 minutes ago, bmags said:

I'm sympathetic because my brain does dumb stuff like that all the time. 

My pancake recipe calls for 2.75 tablespoons of baking powder and the amount of times I'll put in 2 table spoons and 3/4 of a tea spoon is insane. My brain just seamlessly problem solves like " ah, this has 3/4s on it, it's this"

I mean, I also do this.

It's also why the Bears should take a fullback at #1.

[The Beast]

20 hours ago, Tony said:

Absolutely none of the holes you listed mean anything if the Bears don't find their "guy" at QB. 

How do we know that Fields isn’t their guy and that they are going to give him one more year at quarterback? Should they trade him if he’s not in the plans and they draft Williams?

13 hours ago, Kyyle23 said:

Yea without knowing 1 is the guy all of this is meaningless.  At this point you can’t wait anymore.  Not sure how you can’t justify drafting the biggest need this team has ever had for all time

So what are they going to do with Fields? What if Williams is drafted and we have the same mediocrity we have had for what seems like forever since Smith left?

11 hours ago, bmags said:

We can’t draft a qb because we need a halfback

That’s not what I said. I was talking collectively about depth, specifically in the trenches.

10 hours ago, Boopa1219 said:

I couldn't agree more. 

If they don't build out the trenches and add some weapons, the next QB they bring in will suffer the same fate as Fields. I am also shocked that Pace has really ignored the trenches on both sides of the ball, especially with him being a former OL.

Yep. I’m most concerned with the lack of depth on the offensive and defensive lines. As a team, something is wrong with them and I don’t think it’s primarily Fields. I don’t know if it is coaching, play calling, depth issues or something else. It’s hard to put my finger on it. Maybe Poles will select Williams but I am concerned that they’ll end up in a similar spot to where they are now. However maybe Williams IS the guy and the Bears end up like Kansas City. There are lots of unknowns.

9 hours ago, bmags said:

I don't think there is any one road to making the right QB decision.

Sitting QBs is sure route to success! Except we'd have way more examples of QBs who slowly developed on the bench and not just Geno Smith. Right? If Mahomes is mahomes because he wasn't thrown into the fire, there are bunches of QBs every year that enter the bench-mode. Surely more would turn out to be viable?

It's all situation! Well let's let Trey Lance be the forever blaring warning sign that it is NOT all situation. The guy had the best situation in the world, had all the talent in the world, and yet it is still a high likelihood that this position is so hard that you can still be a complete nothing.

Let's also gander at the Atlanta Falcons. They built up their offense. They now have a great offensive line. They invested in top ten TEs and WRs and RB. They build up their Oline. They have an offensive-minded head coach who has pulled efficient offenses out of poor QB play.

And yet they timed it to have Desmond Ridder, who had time to sizzle on the bench, took him 3rd round instead of a first round QB, and is terrible. So they are all likely to get fired he is so bad and they spent so many years ignoring QB to build up the rest of the infrastructure.

The STL rams made everyones favorite trade. They ignored the stupid idea to take a high QB and got a ton of picks. And they were miserable for 4 more years until they got a hall of fame coach.

I guess all I'm saying is you don't make a heuristic this early.

Say it's March 15th 2024 and you'll have: Fired Eberflus and hired Ben Johnson as your new OC. You splurged on Tee Higgins and sign Connor Williams as C from Miami. You get one of the washington edges.

Then it's draft day and you could take Caleb Williams and Fashanu. 

I don't think it's obvious that you pass that up at all. 

 

 

7 hours ago, Chisoxfn said:

This. And the Bears can absolutely afford to use one of their top picks on a QB while still using cap space and draft capital to make the rest of the parts better. They have DJ Moore and Kmet. They have some solid running backs and the oline while not good yesterday isn't the dumpster fire it was 2-3 years ago.  Wright will continue to grow - lets see what Jones does, lets see if Jenkins can be healthy (when he is - he is a monster).  Davis actually looked pretty good prior to getting hurt too.  They need a center and potentially a LT (and that is potentially).  

Defensively - the secondary looks to be improving. Jackson is no good, but otherwise a lot of players flashing and growing.  Pass rush needs help. A good QB gets this team better fast and resetting the clock while you continue to stockpile asset (key is drafting well) and this could get better really fast (it may not feel like it, but it could).  Not saying next year fast - cause rookie QB's will struggle in year 1.  

If that’s the direction that they take, I hope you are both right and they end up like KC after they took Mahomes instead of the Bears with how bad they’ve been since Smith was gone.

Edited October 16, 2023 by The Beast