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4/12 - Sox @ Twins: Let’s Win the Series


ChiSox59

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18 minutes ago, wegner said:

Well sure but hindsight is 2020 isn't it.  Who knew that signing a left handed power hitting superstar RF would have been a good idea, especially one who actually seemed to want to play here??  Plus he was already 26 years old.

I cannot imagine there are many Sox fans that would sit here in April 2023 and say that the Sox made the right decision in coming out of that offseason withOUT one of Harper/Machado.  It was a massive failure, and in hindsight, the deals were pretty fair compared to what is getting signed now a days.  It was a huge miss, I think everyone would agree on that.  Doesn't mean that signing Grandal wasn't the best signing for the club that offseason (it was), or that signing Benintendi wasn't the 2nd best option for the Sox team needs after Nimmo who got a disgusting overpay.  The Sox need to sign more guys in the Grandal / Benintendi range, not less.  Of course sprinkling in a true superstar would help, but until JR moves on and new ownership is in place, that's not gonna happen. 

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1 minute ago, ChiSox59 said:

I cannot imagine there are many Sox fans that would sit here in April 2023 and say that the Sox made the right decision in coming out of that offseason with one of Harper/Machado.  It was a massive failure, and in hindsight, the deals were pretty fair compared to what is getting signed now a days.  It was a huge miss, I think everyone would agree on that.  Doesn't mean that signing Grandal wasn't the best signing for hte club that offseason (it was), or that signing Benintendi wasn't the 2nd best option after Nimmo who got a disgusting overpay.  The Sox need to sign more guys in the Grandal / Benintendi range, not less.  Of course sprinkling in a true superstar would help, but until JR moves on and new ownership is in place, that's not gonna happen. 

I remember at the time talking to my brother and we both thought that the real play was Harper, but they never really tried to pursue him as far as I can tell.  They went all in on Machado, unfortunately their version of all in was signing his brother in law and a friend of his, instead of offering Machado the $$$.  This team is short sighted as far as free agents.  And the one time they try to pony up with Wheeler, they lose out because his wife wants to live on the East Coast.  Very Frustrating.

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14 minutes ago, wegner said:

I remember at the time talking to my brother and we both thought that the real play was Harper, but they never really tried to pursue him as far as I can tell.  They went all in on Machado, unfortunately their version of all in was signing his brother in law and a friend of his, instead of offering Machado the $$$.  This team is short sighted as far as free agents.  And the one time they try to pony up with Wheeler, they lose out because his wife wants to live on the East Coast.  Very Frustrating.

Looking back at that scenario it shows how antiquated and inept this organization is.  Both are great players but Harper brings exactly what they needed. EXACTLY!  They felt they could get Machado for a lower price by surrounding him with family, friends and other Latin players.  In reality they didn't really need him if they felt Moncada was worth the extension.  

Jerry is holding the pearls close to his chest and using none of the value of the franchise to make it better.   He lives on his budget and the fans fans dearly.

He is not selling and losing 75% of the value of his asset but he is also not using his asset to take on debt and make the organization a winner.  There is no reward for him he already has won. 

He doesn't give two craps though.  The Bulls again led the NBA in attendance and they have been dogshit since he ran his greatest asset out of town 25 years ago.

 

 

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50 minutes ago, wegner said:

I remember at the time talking to my brother and we both thought that the real play was Harper, but they never really tried to pursue him as far as I can tell.  They went all in on Machado, unfortunately their version of all in was signing his brother in law and a friend of his, instead of offering Machado the $$$.  This team is short sighted as far as free agents.  And the one time they try to pony up with Wheeler, they lose out because his wife wants to live on the East Coast.  Very Frustrating.

When they signed Machado's dog I thought they went a little too far frankly.

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1 hour ago, ChiSox59 said:

I cannot imagine there are many Sox fans that would sit here in April 2023 and say that the Sox made the right decision in coming out of that offseason withOUT one of Harper/Machado.  It was a massive failure, and in hindsight, the deals were pretty fair compared to what is getting signed now a days.  It was a huge miss, I think everyone would agree on that.  Doesn't mean that signing Grandal wasn't the best signing for the club that offseason (it was), or that signing Benintendi wasn't the 2nd best option for the Sox team needs after Nimmo who got a disgusting overpay.  The Sox need to sign more guys in the Grandal / Benintendi range, not less.  Of course sprinkling in a true superstar would help, but until JR moves on and new ownership is in place, that's not gonna happen. 

I disagree with this, only because what the Sox really need is a pipeline of talent that starts at the draft and can produce solid ML players on a regular basis. Then you don't have to overpay for somewhat average players on the FA market. 

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1 hour ago, Tony said:

I disagree with this, only because what the Sox really need is a pipeline of talent that starts at the draft and can produce solid ML players on a regular basis. Then you don't have to overpay for somewhat average players on the FA market. 

You mean like the Tampa Bay Rays do with one the smallest yearly payrolls and one of the highest yearly ranked farm systems?

Of course we all know, it will be a freezing day in hell before this ever happens here until the POS owner dies or sells the team or just maybe, fires the loser GM Rick Hahn and goes and steals a smart executive from a winning baseball organization and culture...perhaps like the Rays.

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1 hour ago, Tony said:

I disagree with this, only because what the Sox really need is a pipeline of talent that starts at the draft and can produce solid ML players on a regular basis. Then you don't have to overpay for somewhat average players on the FA market. 

Good point. It's a problem of both not ponying up for elite talent when it becomes available via free agency as well as the inability to develop a functional pipepline of minor league talent. 

Also, I'm not certain that the Sox were ever serious on Machado. Those negotiations were all a dog and pony show and the deal was deliberately sabotoged by the Sox.

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21 minutes ago, LittleHurtCG said:

Good point. It's a problem of both not ponying up for elite talent when it becomes available via free agency as well as the inability to develop a functional pipepline of minor league talent. 

Also, I'm not certain that the Sox were ever serious on Machado. Those negotiations were all a dog and pony show and the deal was deliberately sabotoged by the Sox.

Oh, I think they were serious.  Machado and his family posted a custom made White Sox glove he had made and his kid dressed in white Sox gear on socials.  The Padres swooped in last minute and tacked on $50M, and the Sox didn't budge (or didn't believe them).  I truly believe the Sox (and Machado) thought it was a done deal until the very final stages.  Sox thought it was a bluff, and they were wrong. 

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2 hours ago, LittleHurtCG said:

Good point. It's a problem of both not ponying up for elite talent when it becomes available via free agency as well as the inability to develop a functional pipepline of minor league talent. 

Also, I'm not certain that the Sox were ever serious on Machado. Those negotiations were all a dog and pony show and the deal was deliberately sabotoged by the Sox.

I don't know if the Sox deliberately tanked the Machado situation but I was told by a source he used the Sox, he had no intention of signing with them.

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6 minutes ago, Lip Man 1 said:

I don't know if the Sox deliberately tanked the Machado situation but I was told by a source he used the Sox, he had no intention of signing with them.

Unless your source was Machado, his agent or someone similar, that claim would be entirely speculative. No way someone else could know his underlying intentions.

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2 minutes ago, FourEyesShottenhoffer said:

Unless your source was Machado, his agent or someone similar, that claim would be entirely speculative. No way someone else could know his underlying intentions.

Let's just say you are close in your guessing. 

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5 hours ago, Harry Chappas said:

Looking back at that scenario it shows how antiquated and inept this organization is.  Both are great players but Harper brings exactly what they needed. EXACTLY!  They felt they could get Machado for a lower price by surrounding him with family, friends and other Latin players.  In reality they didn't really need him if they felt Moncada was worth the extension.  

Jerry is holding the pearls close to his chest and using none of the value of the franchise to make it better.   He lives on his budget and the fans fans dearly.

He is not selling and losing 75% of the value of his asset but he is also not using his asset to take on debt and make the organization a winner.  There is no reward for him he already has won. 

He doesn't give two craps though.  The Bulls again led the NBA in attendance and they have been dogshit since he ran his greatest asset out of town 25 years ago.

 

 

And ironically the #1 reason Machado provided for signing with SD was the presence of former Sox prospect Tatis Jr. 

With Moncada at third and Anderson at SS, Harper was always the best choice, especially from a marketing standpoint since Manny was pretty much a villain back then before earning a lot of respect back with his level of play and especially maturity/leadership.

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5 hours ago, The Kids Can Play said:

You mean like the Tampa Bay Rays do with one the smallest yearly payrolls and one of the highest yearly ranked farm systems?

Of course we all know, it will be a freezing day in hell before this ever happens here until the POS owner dies or sells the team or just maybe, fires the loser GM Rick Hahn and goes and steals a smart executive from a winning baseball organization and culture...perhaps like the Rays.

That would be Chaim Bloom the former Senior VP of Baseball Operations who the Red Sox hired in 2019 to become Chief Baseball Officer. Bloom's new roster construction quickly developed a last place finish in 2022 and the 2023 outlook is just as bad as the White Sox. Bloom may be is on thin ice for 2023

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