VAUGHN vs ABREU APRIL RESULTS

[gogosox1959]

We've come to expect Abreu to be bad in April but part of the blame was always on Chicago weather.  Houston was to have helped.   AV destroyed him in April.  JA has become a singles hitter.   

APRIL	vaughn	abreu
average	255	235
OBP	358	267
OPS	792	537
HR	3	0
RBI	20	11
BB	13	4
K	24	27
extra base hits	13	4
salary - year	$760,000	$19,500,000

[Greg Hibbard]

If we’ve learned one thing over the last 7 years, it’s that making negative threads about Abreu definitely paints a TOTALLY ACCURATE picture of how he will perform from that point forward!

[gogosox1959]

While it's true that he has always gotten better, his home run production has shockingly gone down.  Last year he had three home runs from 8/1 to the end. Here is homers by month in 2022:  apr-2, may-3, june-4, july-3, aug-2, sept-1.

My intent wasn't a negative thread about Abreu per se.  More about showing AV's value.  I had thought that in 2023 JA would be better than AV and that may still be true; in 2024 AV=JA; 2025 and beyond AV would be better.

 

[Greg Hibbard]

Do you think a .792 OPS from Andrew Vaughn is below, at, or above what you expected from him at this point in his MLB career?

[Dick Allen]

7 hours ago, gogosox1959 said:

While it's true that he has always gotten better, his home run production has shockingly gone down.  Last year he had three home runs from 8/1 to the end. Here is homers by month in 2022:  apr-2, may-3, june-4, july-3, aug-2, sept-1.

My intent wasn't a negative thread about Abreu per se.  More about showing AV's value.  I had thought that in 2023 JA would be better than AV and that may still be true; in 2024 AV=JA; 2025 and beyond AV would be better.

 

Only 4 homers his last 400 PA. Basically Leury Garcia’s pace. I loved him as a player and person, but it was time for him to move along, and he got a ton of money. My question would be do we really know how old he is? A year or two off at this stage is a huge deal.

Edited May 1, 2023 by Dick Allen

[JoeC]

Also, shouldn’t the comparison be Abreu vs. Benentendi?

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

So what you’re saying is the Sox would have the same record as the A’s right now if they resigned Abreu? 

[Chicago White Sox]

8 hours ago, Greg Hibbard said:

Do you think a .792 OPS from Andrew Vaughn is below, at, or above what you expected from him at this point in his MLB career?

It’s very disappointing to me.  He’s simply got to hit for more power.  He’s sitting at 0 WAR right now as his 124 wRC+ is completely offset by the 1B positional adjustment and his below average defense.

[bmags]

Congrats to vaughn but he was a terrible pick at this point. While obviously CJ Abrams hasn't produced much yet, he held much higher prospect value (as seen by netting one of the best players in baseball). I hope that's a lesson to those who railed against him as a "KW pick" and "Just an athlete"

[The Kids Can Play]

10 hours ago, gogosox1959 said:

We've come to expect Abreu to be bad in April but part of the blame was always on Chicago weather.  Houston was to have helped.   AV destroyed him in April.  JA has become a singles hitter.   

APRIL	vaughn	abreu
average	255	235
OBP	358	267
OPS	792	537
HR	3	0
RBI	20	11
BB	13	4
K	24	27
extra base hits	13	4
salary - year	$760,000	$19,500,000

I think Vaughn's numbers will only go up as he keeps getting experience and playing daily. The last few years he has played out of position and part time. Now he is playing a position he is comfortable with and not having to waste mental energy on a position he never played before until he came to the Sox. 

I will always treasure the great years Jose gave the Sox. However it was the right time to move on and obviously we are seeing the results prove it, especially with what we are paying Vaughn as opposed to Jose's salary. 

You're so right we always gave Abreu a break for the April cold weather. However I find it interesting that it sure isn't cold in Houston. The Astros have played 16 home games  and 12 road games at Minn, Pitt, Atl, TB. Other than Pitt and Minn, all warm weather cities, so the April thing isn't a valid excuse anymore. 

[Bob Sacamano]

9 hours ago, Greg Hibbard said:

Do you think a .792 OPS from Andrew Vaughn is below, at, or above what you expected from him at this point in his MLB career?

Below for sure

[Squirmin' for Yermin]

9 hours ago, Greg Hibbard said:

Do you think a .792 OPS from Andrew Vaughn is below, at, or above what you expected from him at this point in his MLB career?

below

[Tnetennba]

1 hour ago, Chicago White Sox said:

It’s very disappointing to me.  He’s simply got to hit for more power.  He’s sitting at 0 WAR right now as his 124 wRC+ is completely offset by the 1B positional adjustment and his below average defense.

I just wanted to echo all of this.  AV needs to be a lot better.  The lack of power and poor D really drag down any positives. 

[bmags]

To be #3 pick as a 1b only, RH only player, he needed to be Pete Alonso level. In all his complete, real seasons, he's been at 140 wRC+

He's settling into some Rhys Hoskins level. Which is fine. But Hoskins was selected in the 5th. Alonso was selected in the 2nd. Their career to date, he's been basically outplayed by Sheets, a 2nd round pick.

And only sox fans, scarred by a SS moving to 2B, could still believe that asking baseball players to play different positions screws them up so much. To the extent that vaughn is so unathletic and weak in the legs he gets worn down so easily, it's another case against taking him 3rd overall.

[EloyJenkins]

Abreu at a .537 OPS is almost making him a DFA candidate. Seriously. For a team trying to win back to back titles...if May improvements don't happen, how quick does he get benched?

[hogan873]

Abreu's lack of power is concerning.  We saw that last season, and it seemed like he was just another victim of the White Sox overall power outage.  I think he'll improve as the season goes along, but we can't just write off his slow start to his typical slow start in the cold month on April.

Vaughn needs to hit for more power.  He has the power; he just needs to tap into it.  His RBIs are up there, which is good to see.  I thing as the team starts performing better (hopefully), we'll see more production out of Vaughn.

At the end of the season, I believe Vaughn will have a batter average, more HRs, and more RBIs than Abreu.  Abreu's contract with Houston may not age well.

[Greg Hibbard]

25 minutes ago, EloyJenkins said:

Abreu at a .537 OPS is almost making him a DFA candidate. Seriously. For a team trying to win back to back titles...if May improvements don't happen, how quick does he get benched?

Jose has had very poor 30 game stretches before, particularly early in the season. It’s concerning, but I don’t think there’s any way Houston doesn’t let him try to play through it for the whole year with maybe a couple days off to clear his head if it gets really bad. 

[BigHurt3515]

2 hours ago, bmags said:

Congrats to vaughn but he was a terrible pick at this point. While obviously CJ Abrams hasn't produced much yet, he held much higher prospect value (as seen by netting one of the best players in baseball). I hope that's a lesson to those who railed against him as a "KW pick" and "Just an athlete"

It is only terrible because everyone else sucks and haven't lived up to their potential. They drafted him because he was nearly MLB ready and would be a good compliment when we were supposed to be competing. He is still a good player, it just doesn't look as good when the team is awful

[GreenSox]

To me the comparison is more Abreu v. Benintendi.  It's not like we were going to dump Vaughn if we kept Abreu.

Or maybe the comparison should be Benintendi v. Haseley:  $75 million slap-hitter v.  AAA slap-hitter.

[Chick Mercedes]

3 hours ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

So what you’re saying is the Sox would have the same record as the A’s right now if they resigned Abreu? 

They should have traded him really while they had the chance. That would never happen in Chicago though. Jerry has sacred cows aplenty. Basically every veteran player is a sacred cow. Unless I guess that one time. In band camp.

Edited May 1, 2023 by Chick Mercedes

[chitownsportsfan]

1 hour ago, BigHurt3515 said:

It is only terrible because everyone else sucks and haven't lived up to their potential. They drafted him because he was nearly MLB ready and would be a good compliment when we were supposed to be competing. He is still a good player, it just doesn't look as good when the team is awful

He's not a good player tho. He's barely replacement.

[Buehrle>Wood]

20 minutes ago, Chick Mercedes said:

They should have traded him really while they had the chance. That would never happen in Chicago though. Jerry has sacred cows aplenty. Basically every veteran player is a sacred cow. Unless I guess that one time. In band camp.

Trading their best position player (an aging 1B impending free agent no-less)  at the deadline last year while the team sat 2 games out would have been next level stupid, even by Hahn standards.

[Chick Mercedes]

24 minutes ago, Buehrle>Wood said:

Trading their best position player (an aging 1B impending free agent no-less)  at the deadline last year while the team sat 2 games out would have been next level stupid, even by Hahn standards.

I wasn’t talking about last season at the deadline. By the way, you don’t have to post replies to people like a next level jerk.

Edited May 1, 2023 by Chick Mercedes

[Buehrle>Wood]

23 minutes ago, Chick Mercedes said:

I wasn’t talking about last season at the deadline. By the way, you don’t have to post replies to people like a next level jerk.

Then when were you talking about?

[Tnetennba]

2 hours ago, BigHurt3515 said:

It is only terrible because everyone else sucks and haven't lived up to their potential. They drafted him because he was nearly MLB ready and would be a good compliment when we were supposed to be competing. He is still a good player, it just doesn't look as good when the team is awful

Even if everyone else hit their full potential, Vaughn as is would still be a disappointment.  Granted, the team wouldn’t be so dependent on his production but it would still be suboptimal for his position.