Garfein: Tim Anderson hates pitch clock, not Chicago

[The Kids Can Play]

5 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

He won an AL Batting Crown and has/had the highest cumulative batting average in the AL from 2019-22. 

At the very worst, he's a much more athletic DJ LeMahieu. 

We will see soon enough how winning organizations like the Dodgers perceive him from the the outside and what his true trade value is to teams that don't worry as much about chemistry as pure talent. 

The Dodgers are a great example. They have the minor league abundance of talent to afford to give up some good prospects. They also have the veteran players to keep him in line which we don't have. They have veteran manager and coaching staff. Most importantly, they also have one of the best front offices in baseball with the strong leadership and culture to get the best out of TA again. 

[Greg Hibbard]

eh, I’m sick of some of the sideshow that goes with TA, but I don’t really care what he said. If he said “I hate this place” - honestly, good for him if he feels that way. JR, KW, and Hahn have built a toxic culture upon a once-promising rebuild. The fans have a right to boo, and Tim may not have even been referring to the fans. 

I care more that he is not playing well at all, and looks utterly disinterested in playing here now, even if what we can discern about Stone’s comments about him not being 100% are true. 

What’s obvious to me is that Tim wants to be gone, the Sox are fine letting him go, and after this season he will probably sign a 6 year 70-80 million dollar deal somewhere and play a lot better. He will get paid based on his resume, not a bad season on a bad team that can be explained away with culture and injuries.

 Tim is a guy who plays way above his head when he’s feeling great, and way below it when he’s not. 

[caulfield12]

9 minutes ago, The Kids Can Play said:

Your best point is, "Anyone can lead when the ship's going in the right direction." I thought Tim was a better leader and obviously he showed us his true colors when the team was doing bad. It's very disappointing.

As far as his peak value, yes he isn't that same Tim. However as I stated in another post, another owner and GM will see the immense talent Tim has. They will think, oh we can straighten him out. The only reason he isn't doing well, is because he is playing for that shitty White Sox club. We'll fix him!

We should get good value for Tim IMO. However the only problem standing in our way is...Hahn will be making the trade. 

 

For example, he was a totally different player for Team USA during the WBC. 

[Sambuca]

3 minutes ago, Lip Man 1 said:

Only when the team he plays for is a complete mess, the rebuild is right down the toilet, guys can't stay healthy for a week at a time let alone for most of the season and the front office is incompetent. To say nothing of the player in question's history on and off the field. 

Sure, so sounds like you have enough to be mad at without making up things.

[Lip Man 1]

5 minutes ago, Greg Hibbard said:

eh, I’m sick of some of the sideshow that goes with TA, but I don’t really care what he said. If he said “I hate this place” - honestly, good for him if he feels that way. JR, KW, and Hahn have built a toxic culture upon a once-promising rebuild. The fans have a right to boo, and Tim may not have even been referring to the fans. 

I care more that he is not playing well at all, and looks utterly disinterested in playing here now, even if what we can discern about Stone’s comments about him not being 100% are true. 

What’s obvious to me is that Tim wants to be gone, the Sox are fine letting him go, and after this season he will probably sign a 6 year 70-80 million dollar deal somewhere and play a lot better. He will get paid based on his resume, not a bad season on a bad team that can be explained away with culture and injuries.

 Tim is a guy who plays way above his head when he’s feeling great, and way below it when he’s not. 

That's some "professional" there isn't it? ?

And by the way, he's going to be asking for a LOT more than 70 million (which is another reason why he won't be with the Sox)

Edited May 14, 2023 by Lip Man 1

[caulfield12]

5 minutes ago, Greg Hibbard said:

eh, I’m sick of some of the sideshow that goes with TA, but I don’t really care what he said. If he said “I hate this place” - honestly, good for him if he feels that way. JR, KW, and Hahn have built a toxic culture upon a once-promising rebuild. The fans have a right to boo, and Tim may not have even been referring to the fans. 

I care more that he is not playing well at all, and looks utterly disinterested in playing here now, even if what we can discern about Stone’s comments about him not being 100% are true. 

What’s obvious to me is that Tim wants to be gone, the Sox are fine letting him go, and after this season he will probably sign a 6 year 70-80 million dollar deal somewhere and play a lot better. He will get paid based on his resume, not a bad season on a bad team that can be explained away with culture and injuries.

 Tim is a guy who plays way above his head when he’s feeling great, and way below it when he’s not. 

He has another option year...which any acquiring team would much more likelier than not invoke because it's going to be far preferable to his FA price per year, even at age 31/32 in 2024/25. 

Edited May 14, 2023 by caulfield12

[Greg Hibbard]

Just now, Lip Man 1 said:

That's some "professional" there isn't it? ?

Haha sure, but lots of pro Athletes play at completely different levels based on feeling and emotion - and other stuff. Nobody would say Dennis Rodman wasn’t one of the greatest power forwards and rebounders of the late 90s. Would he have been a great office employee? ??

[Greg Hibbard]

2 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

He has another option year...which any acquiring team would much more likelier than not invoke because it's going to be far preferable to his FA price per year, even at age 31/32 in 2024/25. 

Wait is his option this year a player option or a team option? 

[Chisoxfn]

Tim is one of the only fun things about this franchise yet haters gonna hate. 

[caulfield12]

After that Field of Dreams walk off...he was arguably one of the ten most famous players in baseball and the unofficial spokesman for underrepresentation among young African Americans across the sport. 

That also has a lot of added value to other teams...his so called Q Rating that attracted the likes of Middle America business franchises like Dairy Queen and the front cover of video games. 

[caulfield12]

3 minutes ago, Greg Hibbard said:

Wait is his option this year a player option or a team option? 

24:$14M club option ($1M buyout)

That's another reason for trade value optimism. 

He's basically Clevinger. 

[FloydBannister1983]

5 minutes ago, Chisoxfn said:

Tim is one of the only fun things about this franchise yet haters gonna hate. 

When was the last time he did anything “fun”?

[Chick Mercedes]

2 hours ago, Scott Merkin Fan said:

No defense for Tim here. He put on his Astros cap in that moment, for all intents and purposes. Disappointing.

He has his issues. But he is justified. Anyway blowing off steam is likely what happened. Allegedly he wanted an extension. For that, he is crazy. 

Edited May 15, 2023 by Chick Mercedes

[GreenSox]

46 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

We will see soon enough how winning organizations like the Dodgers perceive him from the the outside and what his true trade value is to teams that don't worry as much about chemistry as pure talent. 

I agree.  
The last thing the Sox need is to make a big deal out of this, reducing their leverage in trade negotiations; they already did it for Giolito by mouthing off to Nightengale.

[socksless joe]

Tim said I hate the pitch clock and I totally agree. Don't like the other stupid rule of starting the 10th inning with a runner on second. Now stay off Roger Bossard's lawn. 

[pcq]

I'm not worried about Tim. 

[soxfaninfl]

Another nothing story about someone supposedly saying something. I am not going to pile on the players. They are not playing well and the frustration is apparent. TA has always worn his emotions and I am not about to bash that now.

Bottom line: Hahn and Grifol need to go. The franchise has to prioritize winning and send the message that the current situation is unacceptable. This cannibalism between the front office, players, and fans is only going to get worse. Any other club would have done so already. Once they are gone and the message has been sent, then determine which players respond before we start jettison the whole thing to space.

 

[TheBooneLoganEra]

2 hours ago, superchops70 said:

Why? Why would he be talking about the pitch clock right then at that exact moment when he's shaking his head about the previous play? That makes  zero sense. 
 

Edit: just saw the previous post's exclamation from Tim. He's just covering his butt now

Honestly if he feels he didn't have time lead off and focus because pitchers are now operating much faster, it makes all the sense in the world why he'd say that. Nonetheless, adapt. All the other teams have.

[Sleepy Harold]

1 hour ago, caulfield12 said:

After that Field of Dreams walk off...he was arguably one of the ten most famous players in baseball and the unofficial spokesman for underrepresentation among young African Americans across the sport. 

That also has a lot of added value to other teams...his so called Q Rating that attracted the likes of Middle America business franchises like Dairy Queen and the front cover of video games. 

I'm old enough to remember when someone on here tried arguing that the White Sox shouldn't try to sign Bryce Harper because of his Q Rating.  

[caulfield12]

12 minutes ago, soxfaninfl said:

Another nothing story about someone supposedly saying something. I am not going to pile on the players. They are not playing well and the frustration is apparent. TA has always worn his emotions and I am not about to bash that now.

Bottom line: Hahn and Grifol need to go. The franchise has to prioritize winning and send the message that the current situation is unacceptable. This cannibalism between the front office, players, and fans is only going to get worse. Any other club would have done so already. Once they are gone and the message has been sent, then determine which players respond before we start jettison the whole thing to space.

 

See the Cardinals with Jordan Walker demotion, debate in the dugout and with Carlos Marmol over O'Neill's hustle becoming public...then the demotion of Contreras from starting catcher to DH and then back again in one week when they realized the pitching problems were much more about older/aging vets breaking down than Yadier Molina's leadership from that position.

But this weekend they started to turn the ship around...Pirates and Cubs falling off and that division is still winnable as arguably the Brewers are their biggest competition.

Team addressed the various issues and moved together as a collective/unified whole.

 

Of course, they've only been under .500 something like once in the last decade plus or going back to 2000 or some crazy number like that...everyone perceives them to be a perennially "winning organization" like the Yankees, Braves, Rays, Dodgers, etc.

[caulfield12]

1 minute ago, Sleepy Harold said:

I'm old enough to remember when someone on here tried arguing that the White Sox shouldn't try to sign Bryce Harper because of his Q Rating.  

The White Sox have never understood the bigger picture of marketing...or we would have had more than two Japanese players in the last 25 years or so.

For example, over the last two years the Hispanic players (especially the highest paid ones, or those with "generous" long-term deals) on the team have been pretty strongly criticized or even vilified...obviously, part of that is well-earned, part perhaps goes deeper from a sociological perspective.  Leury was pretty obviously public enemy #1 last year, Jeff Keppinger, for example, didn't have to face nearly that much criticism and disdain from being overplayed by his manager.  Was he supposed to just quit or refuse to play when he wasn't going well? 

I'm not going to get into the criticisms directed towards Tim Anderson or a Frank Thomas/Dick Allen as White Sox, but Robin Ventura even during his 0/41 or whatever it was his rookie year never faced so many personal attacks.

 

Another example.  Luis Robert arguably is the best player (or at least most valuable in terms of trade value) on the White Sox right now...but I'm struggling to think of other 'best players' around the league who have faced more criticism from fans.   Of course, part of its due to expectations the team and GM created.   Sometimes the fan criticism is merited, but some of the hyperbole has been unfair IMO.  We've seen how many NBA players have struggled with being tagged "the next MJ," just like Robert very early on being compared to the physical skills/five tool talent of a Mike Trout.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[South Side Hit Men]

1 hour ago, Lip Man 1 said:

Maybe he didn't but again, just my opinion, the entire body of work, the history...the guy doesn't seem like a good teammate. And the fact that he can't stay healthy isn't helping his situation or giving him the benefit of the doubt.

It may be very unfair but if you are the "face of the franchise" then you are expected to play and conduct yourself to a higher standard. 

I think he needs to go and I've felt that way for a few years now. Not just him but a number of these other underachievers who seem to be babied.

Tim busted his ass for over 8 seasons and what did it get him? Zero Postseason with the absolute trash Hahn fields year in and year out. He had to play the past two seasons with a senile drunk driving assclown. 

I don't blame a single employee (non officers) for hating their current work situation with the White Sox. This is a trash organization, one with a mission statement from their owner to finish in second place. The same team who trashed their greatest players on the way out (Frank Thomas, Carlton Fisk).

The owner and senior executives are among the worst of any sports team. Anyone with any talent would be disgusted with every game they suited up for this clown show, knowing it was completely and utterly futile in terms of team success, and will continue to be until they are finally able to leave and sign elsewhere.

[Quin]

2 hours ago, JoeCredeYes said:

I mean, how much more evidence are the Tim supporters willing to ignore before they can admit to themselves that he's an asshole?

How much more do you need to make up to admit that you just don't like him?

??

The team is better with this "cancer" leading the way.

[South Side Hit Men]

1 minute ago, Quin said:

How much more do you need to make up to admit that you just don't like him?

??

The team is better with this "cancer" leading the way.

Tim Anderson is 38th in fWAR among position players since 2016.

Jose Abreu is 33rd since 2014.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

2 hours ago, Buehrle>Wood said:

I don't know how anyone is drawing anything conclusive from that

Are people reading his lips and able to make out that he said "hate" and filling in the rest of what they think he might have said ?

Even after witnessing him over sliding 2nd base , I realize the guy isn't at 100% but if you can run hard once you make the turn at 1st ( like he did ) what prevented him from running hard to first in order to get a double rather than an out . Run hard from the start and you have an easy double. He got picked off bouncing on his lead towards 2nd the other day. Base running mistakes can be avoided by running hard . Don't bounce , shuffle on leadoffs. Fundamentally TA isn't good. Hustle is just effort and people can see lack of effort especially when replays show you not running that hard to 1st base and then turning on the jets so high that you slid past 2nd base. Leaders lead by example. Tim will never be a leader. He appears selfish in much of what we can see.

He shouldn't wonder or be bothered by boos. Sure fans misinterpret things but when the chips are down leaders set an example and Tim's play is not exactly inspiring.