Will the Sox do the right thing when Eloy comes back and move Yoan to 2B?

[The Kids Can Play]

25 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

Did you watch Burger everyday at third the last couple of weeks before he was Injured?

The gap is closing.

Not to mention almost nobody believes Moncada is a part of the long term future of the organization at this point.

As you correctly pointed out, Jake has closed the gap at third. The Sox will be fine with Burger at third and trade Moncada. 

Plus Burger is a more charismatic and fun player to watch over Moncada. If Jake continues this great play not only this year, but for years to come, he will be a guy that the Sox fans will want to cheer for and want to come to the ballpark to see play. 

You are also right Moncada is not part of the long range Sox future. Get what you can for him and move on. 

[baseball_gal_aly]

They should trade Vaughn for a similar pitcher and stick Burger at 1B. He profiles better there than AV. 

Moncada isn't going anywhere until after the 2024 season. 

[Greg Hibbard]

Moncada isn’t tradeable.

Burger needs to be in the lineup. 

If you’re going to try to get away with Hanser at 2nd, you can try Burger there.

[2Deep]

49 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

Then we should have drafted Kwan to win the GG in LF and saved $75 million to protect the starting rotation as well as investing in 2B RF and a top defensive C instead of wasting even more money. 

That's not what we are discussing 

[Tnetennba]

3 hours ago, wegner said:

That sounds like an injury waiting to happen.

Let’s be honest, what doesn’t with him?

[Tnetennba]

I’m at the burn all to the ground stage, so I really don’t care about any of these guys not named Robert.  Eloy and Vaughn are first on my trade block for anything of value.  Plug Burger in at 1B, DH Sheets, and let Colas learn in the bigs.  If they are gonna be bad, let them at least hit some homers and be fun on some level. 

[CentralChamps21]

1 hour ago, The Kids Can Play said:

As you correctly pointed out, Jake has closed the gap at third. The Sox will be fine with Burger at third and trade Moncada. 

Plus Burger is a more charismatic and fun player to watch over Moncada. If Jake continues this great play not only this year, but for years to come, he will be a guy that the Sox fans will want to cheer for and want to come to the ballpark to see play. 

You are also right Moncada is not part of the long range Sox future. Get what you can for him and move on. 

I don't agree that Burger has closed the gap at 3rd. Moncada is a superior fielder to the point that it makes a difference. He's also a lefty/switch bat and a guy who reliably supplements his OBP by taking walks, both scarcities on this team.

Eloy, if anybody, is the one who needs to get moved, especially if he can't handle playing RF regularly.

[Illinibat]

Moncada played 2B most of his life.

Burger played 3B most of his life.

Seems obvious.

[Illinibat]

1 hour ago, CentralChamps21 said:

I don't agree that Burger has closed the gap at 3rd. Moncada is a superior fielder to the point that it makes a difference.

2023 Moncada - DWAR -.1 / 1 Error / 2.53 Range Factor

2023 Burger - DWAR -.2 / 1 Error / 2.25 Range Factor

Not much of a difference

[CentralChamps21]

42 minutes ago, Illinibat said:

2023 Moncada - DWAR -.1 / 1 Error / 2.53 Range Factor

2023 Burger - DWAR -.2 / 1 Error / 2.25 Range Factor

Not much of a difference

Not enough of a sample size for either to be meaningful.

[Tnetennba]

I love cherry picked stats in small sample sizes…

[pcq]

7 hours ago, joejoesox said:

@The Kids Can PlayVinnie Duber talked to Grifol about moving Moncada to 2B, and he sounds like that isn't even a thought. They're good with Sheets/Burger DH platoon. I can't fathom a top tier team who would turn their best/second best offensive player into a platoon role. But this is the white sox we are talking about. 

You don't move a glove like Moncada around. You move the fringe guys around. 

[caulfield12]

6 minutes ago, pcq said:

You don't move a glove like Moncada around. You move the fringe guys around. 

You do when you have to develop your young players for the next rebuild AND demonstrate his versatility to acquiring teams in order to boost his tepid trade value. 

[kitekrazy]

The dilemma of a bad baseball organization.  When guys are hot at the plate catching the baseball is secondary.  We've seen enough where catching the baseball is secondary. 

Also drafting one dimensional players is gonna get you.  Too often is they can hit better than they field which only the best accomplish 30%.  So the solution is for 1B/DH. 

As for trades do I need to remind you that Hahn and co. are bad at it?   It makes you more irritated when they play much better for the team they are traded to.

This Jake Burger story is a feel good story.  Who remembers that no long after he was drafted and those injuries many didn't know he existed anymore.

 

[Balta1701]

5 hours ago, Illinibat said:

2023 Moncada - DWAR -.1 / 1 Error / 2.53 Range Factor

2023 Burger - DWAR -.2 / 1 Error / 2.25 Range Factor

Not much of a difference

If everything else was the same between them, a difference in range factor of 0.25 means an extra out every 4 games. That means an extra 27 outs every 108 games. In a full season, that tiny difference would translate to an extra 1.5 defensive wins if everything else were the same. 

[Tnetennba]

43 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

If everything else was the same between them, a difference in range factor of 0.25 means an extra out every 4 games. That means an extra 27 outs every 108 games. In a full season, that tiny difference would translate to an extra 1.5 defensive wins if everything else were the same. 

And everything else isn’t remotely the same, which makes their troll bit so tired. 

[caulfield12]

29 minutes ago, Tnetennba said:

And everything else isn’t remotely the same, which makes their troll bit so tired. 

Odds of Moncada playing 117 more lol? 

[JoeC]

Since when is Jake Burger considered a more durable option?

I am in the "trade Moncada" camp if we are looking for a 2Bman, not because I think Burger is better, but because I think Moncada can still command a good return. IMO Burger is "good enough" at 3B to roll the dice on his bat. You only do that if you think you can cash out on Yoan's value and trade him for a 2B or SOLID RF.

[caulfield12]

1 hour ago, JoeC said:

Since when is Jake Burger considered a more durable option?

I am in the "trade Moncada" camp if we are looking for a 2Bman, not because I think Burger is better, but because I think Moncada can still command a good return. IMO Burger is "good enough" at 3B to roll the dice on his bat. You only do that if you think you can cash out on Yoan's value and trade him for a 2B or SOLID RF.

You realize the acquiring team would have to pay him at least $37.5 million guaranteed for July 1st 2023 through the end of next season (including $5 million buyout or $25 million guaranteed in 2025). 

2024 contract already guaranteed at $24 million!!! 

Would be $56.5 million for 2.5 seasons at max contract. 

Edited May 19, 2023 by caulfield12

[JoeC]

4 hours ago, caulfield12 said:

You realize the acquiring team would have to pay him at least $37.5 million guaranteed for July 1st 2023 through the end of next season (including $5 million buyout or $25 million guaranteed in 2025). 

2024 contract already guaranteed at $24 million!!! 

Would be $56.5 million for 2.5 seasons at max contract. 

Yep.

still has more trade value than Burger.

[Bob Sacamano]

7 minutes ago, JoeC said:

Yep.

still has more trade value than Burger.

Agree with that but disagree Moncada can bring back a good return. He’s a salary dump.

[JoeC]

33 minutes ago, Bob Sacamano said:

Agree with that but disagree Moncada can bring back a good return. He’s a salary dump.

For a deadline team looking for elite 3B defense with an above average bat (and potentially elite bat in there somewhere)?

I can see a team overpaying for that if they think it can a) put them over the top for a championship run; and b) fix his bat and keep him healthy.

[caulfield12]

37 minutes ago, Bob Sacamano said:

Agree with that but disagree Moncada can bring back a good return. He’s a salary dump.

The main point is they need a 3B for the next five years…it’s obviously not going to be Yoan Moncada.

Any trade value is going to be mostly about simply offloading as much of his future salary as possible.

[Hamhock]

I never fail to be amused by the duality of “This player is worthless - get rid of him/we will reap the finest crop of prospects in exchange for his outstanding talent” that is sports fandom. No slight intended to anyone here; every team’s fanbase does this. It’s just funny, is all.

[JoeC]

16 minutes ago, Hamhock said:

I never fail to be amused by the duality of “This player is worthless - get rid of him/we will reap the finest crop of prospects in exchange for his outstanding talent” that is sports fandom. No slight intended to anyone here; every team’s fanbase does this. It’s just funny, is all.

My point isn’t that Moncada is useless or worthless (quite the opposite). My point is that we have a surplus of 3Bmen. Given the options, we can use one to fill a huge gap in other positions without creating one in his place at 3B.