VAUGHN vs ABREU (May update)

[gogosox1959]

 

	vaughn				abreu
	apr+may	may	apr		apr+may	may	apr
at bats	212				204
average	255		255		211		235
OBP	333		358		276		267
OPS	776		792		536		537
HR	7	4	3		1	1	0
RBI	39	19	20		20	9	11
BB	20	7	13		16	12	4
K	48	24	24		51	24	27
extra base hits	25	12	13		8	4	4
salary - year	$760,000				$19,500,000

AV isn't, so far, the player we expected or needed, however it's amazing how much better his numbers are as compared to Abreu - to say nothing of the salary 

[caulfield12]

1 hour ago, gogosox1959 said:

 

	vaughn				abreu
	apr+may	may	apr		apr+may	may	apr
at bats	212				204
average	255		255		211		235
OBP	333		358		276		267
OPS	776		792		536		537
HR	7	4	3		1	1	0
RBI	39	19	20		20	9	11
BB	20	7	13		16	12	4
K	48	24	24		51	24	27
extra base hits	25	12	13		8	4	4
salary - year	$760,000				$19,500,000

AV isn't, so far, the player we expected or needed, however it's amazing how much better his numbers are as compared to Abreu - to say nothing of the salary 

Congrats, Hahn?

Although did he really have any other legit choice?   Keep Abreu, and trade Vaughn?

I mean, it's not like we didn't have 5-6 other players whose best position on the field was arguably 1B/DH...

 

We can play the same game in reverse with Benintendi.

 

Trade for Kimbrel

QO for Kimbrel, not for Rodon

Trade for Pollock, who never wanted to play away from the West Coast, and who was never going to be suited for RF in any way shape or form (actually better in CF than LF statistically)...coming off a "peak" fWAR year compared to previous seasons and an aging vet in 30's

Not get stuck with Pollock, saving money because Pollock was so adamant about leaving the Sox...

Which led to overpaying Benintendi, wasting $75 million and being almost an entirely "sunk cost" 5 year albatross contract for a now perpetually rebuilding team, coming off a "peak" fWAR year compared to his previous 3 seasons with Boston and KC.

Rinse.
Repeat.

 

And we actually spent more money on Benintendi than we were theoretically going to allocate to Jose Abreu in the first place (in your given scenario.)

[chitownsportsfan]

A bit sad for Jose as he's a DFA candidate (well waivers anyways) come July. His statcast data is shockingly bad. He basically pulled a Konerko where at 37 he went from above average to below replacement suddenly.

[The Kids Can Play]

Ok congrats Hahn, you got this one correct letting Abreu go and keeping Vaughn.  A broken clock is always correct at least twice a day. So occasionally you can get one right. 

The fact still remains your resume of scouting, drafting, developing prospects, trading players, FA signings, etc., is complete horsesh*t and you need to be fired sooner than later. 

[hogan873]

I would imagine the decision to not re-sign Abreu, or at least not make a serious offer, was more about not spending money than Abreu's projected performance.  I'm not sure anyone thought he would fall off this fast.

I feel bad for Abreu.  His last season with the team that gave him the chance to play in the majors was miserable.  Then he gets a nice contract with a perennial contender and has a horrendous start to his tenure there.  I don't think he's quite as bad as he looks right now, but I think it's clear he is not the guy he used to be.

[Harry Chappas]

58 minutes ago, hogan873 said:

I would imagine the decision to not re-sign Abreu, or at least not make a serious offer, was more about not spending money than Abreu's projected performance.  I'm not sure anyone thought he would fall off this fast.

I feel bad for Abreu.  His last season with the team that gave him the chance to play in the majors was miserable.  Then he gets a nice contract with a perennial contender and has a horrendous start to his tenure there.  I don't think he's quite as bad as he looks right now, but I think it's clear he is not the guy he used to be.

if this was a real organization you could say the streakiness of he and many other White Sox hitters caused a log jam of identical skillsets when coupled with his salary justified letting him go. 

For this organization it was that he could easily be replaced by Sheets/Burger and Vaughn.  

The broken clock seems to be right on this one.

 

 

[JoeC]

The real comparison needs to be Abreu vs. Benintendi.

Vaughn was always going to be on this 2023 team no matter what.

It was either keep Abreu around for another year (and keep Vaughn in OF / DH / 1B limbo) or replace Abreu with a LFer (Benintendi).

[JoshPR]

14 minutes ago, JoeC said:

The real comparison needs to be Abreu vs. Benintendi.

Vaughn was always going to be on this 2023 team no matter what.

It was either keep Abreu around for another year (and keep Vaughn in OF / DH / 1B limbo) or replace Abreu with a LFer (Benintendi).

Benny hasn't been all that with the bat but having a legit leftfielder is a relief. Imagine having AV in left and Sheets in right.... 

[JoeC]

18 minutes ago, JoshPR said:

Imagine having AV in left and Sheets in right.... 

Yes, I can imagine 2022.

[soxrwhite]

12 hours ago, caulfield12 said:

Congrats, Hahn?

Although did he really have any other legit choice?   Keep Abreu, and trade Vaughn?

I mean, it's not like we didn't have 5-6 other players whose best position on the field was arguably 1B/DH...

 

We can play the same game in reverse with Benintendi.

 

Trade for Kimbrel

QO for Kimbrel, not for Rodon

Trade for Pollock, who never wanted to play away from the West Coast, and who was never going to be suited for RF in any way shape or form (actually better in CF than LF statistically)...coming off a "peak" fWAR year compared to previous seasons and an aging vet in 30's

Not get stuck with Pollock, saving money because Pollock was so adamant about leaving the Sox...

Which led to overpaying Benintendi, wasting $75 million and being almost an entirely "sunk cost" 5 year albatross contract for a now perpetually rebuilding team, coming off a "peak" fWAR year compared to his previous 3 seasons with Boston and KC.

Rinse.
Repeat.

 

And we actually spent more money on Benintendi than we were theoretically going to allocate to Jose Abreu in the first place (in your given scenario.)

Now c'mon this is titled Vaughn vs Abreu. It isn't about Benintendi Kimbrel Rodon Pollack and the myriad of other mistakes he has made. In this case he did good. Let him win when he wins. Even a broken clock is right twice a day.

[JoeCredeYes]

Going to pat myself on the back here and say that this was one of the easiest calls in recent history.  Paying jose again was always going to be a massive mistake.  My TA decline predictions last off season also coming to fruition.  I see Southsider2K5 has gone into hiding for months, anybody done a wellness check?

[Texsox]

12 hours ago, The Kids Can Play said:

Ok congrats Hahn, you got this one correct letting Abreu go and keeping Vaughn.  A broken clock is always correct at least twice a day. So occasionally you can get one right. 

The fact still remains your resume of scouting, drafting, developing prospects, trading players, FA signings, etc., is complete horsesh*t and you need to be fired sooner than later. 

Exactly. I think we all know everything wrong is his fault and anything positive was just luck. Let's get back to Kenny making the decisions. 

[caulfield12]

5 minutes ago, Texsox said:

Exactly. I think we all know everything wrong is his fault and anything positive was just luck. Let's get back to Kenny making the decisions. 

Without KW and Paddy, we wouldn't have had either Abreu or Luis Robert in the first place.

Imagine the franchise without those two over the last decade...

[Milkman delivers]

2 hours ago, caulfield12 said:

Without KW and Paddy, we wouldn't have had either Abreu or Luis Robert in the first place.

Imagine the franchise without those two over the last decade...

Getting off topic, but what has Robert really done to be compared with what Abreu did on the Sox?

[caulfield12]

1 hour ago, Milkman delivers said:

Getting off topic, but what has Robert really done to be compared with what Abreu did on the Sox?

He's the most valuable player on the roster. 

Abreu was an MVP level player for big chunks of nearly a decade. 

Robert is the only player on the current roster capable of being an MVP or getting Top 5 votes if he put a full season together. 

[ScootsMcGoots]

9 hours ago, caulfield12 said:

He's the most valuable player on the roster. 

Abreu was an MVP level player for big chunks of nearly a decade. 

Robert is the only player on the current roster capable of being an MVP or getting Top 5 votes if he put a full season together. 

Yeah but...look at what the other options are?

[Snopek]

3 hours ago, ScootsMcGoots said:

Yeah but...look at what the other options are?

Solid dunk on the sox terrible roster aside, Robert has MVP potential regardless of what team he's on. Sadly, though, his chances of meeting that potential probably increase greatly if he was on another team.